Benefits deductions: Crime shouldn't pay, says David Cameron

[TheDaddy]

Originally Posted by Pierre

Don't recall seeing bankers smashing up London?

Of course we shouldn't financially penalise these rioters, we should give them more money that they haven't earn't.

I'd happily pay triple the amount of tax I do, and give it to this deserving demographic of our society, as they contribute so much to it.

No they didn't smash it up for a few days, they've just brought the city and country to its knees for decades and not one of them's been banged up for it or even fined, in fact classically enough they're being paid bonuses for it and just waiting for the chance to do it again or profit from the mess they have created.

---------- Post added at 00:50 ---------- Previous post was at 00:48 ----------

Originally Posted by Ignitionnet

Getting rather tiring this government's increasing penchant for picking on the population as a whole and handing those at the top of the chain a free pass.

Yep, some chavy type nicks a telly and we'll take half their dole money or bang them up, some MP add's it to his expences and it's fine, the rot starts at the top Dave not the bottom.

---------- Post added at 00:54 ---------- Previous post was at 00:50 ----------

Originally Posted by Sirius

So are you saying they all live just around the corner from where they are protesting, I dont wear rose tinted glasses because i live in the real world Maggy and yes i am having a go at them read my post again as to why

You ask me if i do know so do you know that there is none there on jsa

I spoke to some of them the other day, most seemed to be students, looked to me like posh kids rebelling tbh.

---------- Post added at 00:55 ---------- Previous post was at 00:54 ----------

Originally Posted by Sirius

I just feel they could have picked a better target, how about the gates of Downing street.

You couldn't bet a better target then The Stock Exchange, which is within spitting distance...

One of the local happy people a few doors down who works full time and commits acts of violence on a regular basis was laughing about this yesterday. He isn't on any benefit and despite being fined thousands over the years has not paid a penny of it and for some reason unknown to him and me no attachment of earnings has ever been made. Only once has he served anytime for fines think it was thirty days a few years ago (he has done a few years in the last twenty for his violence).

This just stinks of more anti benefit claimant crap from this government which is becoming quite regular these days and making this a big headline give what impression of us to non benefit claimants. It isn't only benefit claimants commiting crime and the whole system is woeful in how it deals with fines and getting them off people who have them imposed so why the hell just highlight one small section.

Maybe oneday i will start to act like the **** the daily hate and this government make me out to be quite often afterall what else can you expect from the likes of me .

[mertle]

Originally Posted by Ignitionnet

I love David Cameron. He should have said that crime only pays if you're wealthy and work in the City in which case you can commit wholesale fraud, the powers that be will note that you committed fraud, and ignore it.

Getting rather tiring this government's increasing penchant for picking on the population as a whole and handing those at the top of the chain a free pass.

Absolute spot on I have become to think we all in it together is therye admitance of troughing it up. Seems theyre all in the act ex MP's got in too thinking dont matter who in power they bleeding this country dry no doubt shoving it into tax havens before the country collapses.

Maggy J your very observant shame these idiots dont see it.

I would expect drug crime go up too gang crime think it even could turn us into america levels crime.

Yeah i think we're all starting to understand the meaning of "we're all in it together" it's just some groups are more in it then others. Being honest i am not sure i can bring myself to bother voting anymore whats the point we get one load of excrement in after another whats the point anymore.

Is it any wonder the people of this country are not perfect when our so called leaders set such a lousy example for us all. Sometimes though i think politicians in this country are doing their best to put us all off voting so at some future point they can get us sleepwalked into a federal EU or some other debacle.

Originally Posted by Sirius

I have no problem with people protesting, I have a problem with people getting benefits they are NOT entitled to. My point is that if its found that some of the protesters at this camp in London are claiming JSA in another town and that town is not where they are protesting then they are in my eye's not looking for work, Therefor they are not entitled to JSA, If that is the case JSA should be removed whilst they protest in London. Or do you think they should be paid a benefit they are not entitled to.

But this is not a discussion about people getting benefits they are not entitled to.It's about those on benefit ,committing crimes and being made to pay more than the usual £5 weekly fine that the court decides they get to pay because they are on benefit.
Cameron wants to increase the minimum fine that they pay even if it does take more or most of the benefit. Why you are banging on about JSA and protesters beats me.

[Chrysalis]

good for headlines, but the decision has no common sense.

Almost every day and pretty much every week there is news on some kind of crackdown on benefits from the tories, they are obssessed with benefits.

Nearly every decision they have made shows they are completely out of touch and only serve the rich and those working.

This one is very extremely obvious it will make an increase in crime, £25 a week is a big dent of a benefit like JSA.

Its a benefit cut disguised, and why should crime only pay if the person is on benefits? whats with the specific targeting of a group for crime. If he wants to be tough jail time or similiar punishments are better,. not financial.

---------- Post added at 20:56 ---------- Previous post was at 20:53 ----------

Originally Posted by Sirius

I have no problem with people protesting, I have a problem with people getting benefits they are NOT entitled to. My point is that if its found that some of the protesters at this camp in London are claiming JSA in another town and that town is not where they are protesting then they are in my eye's not looking for work, Therefor they are not entitled to JSA, If that is the case JSA should be removed whilst they protest in London. Or do you think they should be paid a benefit they are not entitled to.

Given that the government expect people in low employment areas to move house to work, to forbid people looking for work in other cities would be counter productive. Of coruse people can be in a different city when on JSA. What you suggesting is ludicrious. Also one doesnt have to be looking for work all day every day, there is only so much can do. Of course if they doing nothing at all looking for work you have a point, but you dont know what they doing in that regards.

Also just watched that video clip he referes to "normal people" thinking it not enough, he is even stereotyping claimants now.

[Stuart]

Originally Posted by Pierre

Don't recall seeing bankers smashing up London?

It's possible they were. Unlikely, but possible.

---------- Post added at 21:38 ---------- Previous post was at 21:37 ----------

I don't profess to know exactly what is wrong with society, but I suspect that there are several things going wrong.

First, we have cost cutting. This is leading to a lack of proper education in schools with schools seeming to be be more interested in attaining good grades in exams rather than educating their pupils. Cost cutting also means that unemployment is rising. It also generates a certain amount of resentment when the man (and even in these apparently enlightened times, it is nearly always a man) who is ultimately responsible for the cost cutting gets a "performance" bonus running in to millions of pounds for apparently doing very little.

Second, we have advertising. We have an entire industry devoted to telling us we are not complete if we don't own the latest trainers, clothes, smartphones etc.

Third, the 'sleb culture and general media. We have a media telling people that spends a lot of time telling people that it's easy to make lots of money by kicking a ball around, shagging someone famous, or , if you are female and possibly attractive (or at least willing to have a breast enlargement, bleach your hair and paint your face orange), you can **** (or marry, if you are lucky) a footballer to make money.

Now, I actually don't have a problem with people shagging celebrities, or some bleached, surgically enhanced slapper stumbling out of a "trendy" nightclub with a footballer at 3am. I have a problem with the message it gives. It gives the message that you don't have to work to earn money, as long as you can find someone famous to ****.

Fourth. The bankers. I doubt the rioters did, but certain members of the working classes will have seen the bankers apparently being rewarded for losing billions of pounds. Rewards that probably number in the tens of thousands a pounds a quarter, each.

We also have the slight problem that there is a perception (whether it is true or not) that the government is willing to let the rich and big businesses get away with massive amounts of immoral (if not illegal) actions while heavily penalising small businesses and anyone who isn't rich. This isn't going to help with any unrest.

Now, none of this is a justification for the actions taken by the rioters. But, I come from a family where we are taught to work hard for what we get, and I wouldn't dream of nicking.

I am, however, trying to offer an explanation of why some people may be driven to take extreme action.

While I can actually see the sense behind David Cameron's argument, I don't actually think his solution is going to do anything but increase any sense of persecution felt by these people, and ultimately, that isn't good.

[Gary L]

They'll be giving out a rule book to benefit claimants soon.

You shall work for free if we tell you to.
You shall get no money off us if we say you can't have any.
You shall pay fines off at £25 per week.
You shall do as you are told by an employee at the jobcentre.
You shall not backchat the staff.
You shall be a piece of **** that you are whilst claiming benefits.
You shall not riot.

No, they won't.

[Gary L]

Yes, they will.

[denphone]

Originally Posted by Gary L

They'll be giving out a rule book to benefit claimants soon.

You shall work for free if we tell you to.
You shall get no money off us if we say you can't have any.
You shall pay fines off at £25 per week.
You shall do as you are told by an employee at the jobcentre.
You shall not backchat the staff.
You shall be a piece of **** that you are whilst claiming benefits.
You shall not riot.

Tell me Gary what is your reasoning behind these thoughts.

[papa smurf]

Originally Posted by Gary L

They'll be giving out a rule book to benefit claimants soon.

You shall work for free if we tell you to.
You shall get no money off us if we say you can't have any.
You shall pay fines off at £25 per week.
You shall do as you are told by an employee at the jobcentre.
You shall not backchat the staff.
You shall be a piece of **** that you are whilst claiming benefits.
You shall not riot.

think austerity Gary -they'll be charging for the book not giving

Originally Posted by denphone

Tell me Gary what is your reasoning behind these thoughts.

There is the flaw in your otherwise eminently reasonable question....

[Gary L]

Originally Posted by denphone

Tell me Gary what is your reasoning behind these thoughts.

Methodical.

---------- Post added at 22:52 ---------- Previous post was at 22:49 ----------

Originally Posted by papa smurf

think austerity Gary -they'll be charging for the book not giving

Yeh.
You shall have the book on you at all times.
You shall be charged £3.70 for a replacement.
You shall have to purchase a replacement if you cannot present your book when requested.

You've missed your medication again, I see.....