Think petrol tax is high right now?

[Will21st]

Originally Posted by Ignitionnet

Second post you've made with that exact last paragraph in.

From what I can see people who voted the other way to you aren't complaining. Why? Because we understand, unlike most Labour supporters, that there isn't an endless pot of money to throw at public services and welfare and buy votes.
Snippedy snip snip

Funny isn't it to labour supporters their beloved party did nothing wrong for the thirteen years they held power but they are so happy to have a go at the poor sods that havn't been in for three weeks about this mess. Get real and take off those red tinted specs and see the complete mess that labour have left us all in and all of us are going to have to pay for it oneway or the other. But one consolation for you the majority of the public in this country are so damn short sighted come the next election they will forget who caused all this and will punish those who sorted it out letting the lunatics take over the asylum again.

Originally Posted by Ignitionnet

Second post you've made with that exact last paragraph in.

From what I can see people who voted the other way to you aren't complaining. Why? Because we understand, unlike most Labour supporters, that there isn't an endless pot of money to throw at public services and welfare and buy votes. We accept that the bills have to be paid and I'm sorry to inform you that we don't blame the new administration for it - we blame the previous administration that chalked up the deficit that needs paying.

The simple fact is that the economic woes were bad, however even without that Labour were happily chalking up ever increasing deficits that were not sustainable in the long term.

It's what they do, spend and spend and tax and tax and borrow and borrow if they don't feel it politically convenient to tax enough to pay for the spending. They were handed a prosperous economy in surplus and urinated that away throwing money at inefficiently run services, welfare and bribing and expanding their base.

We're not in the state Greece were, but the fact remains either we deal with the deficit as a country or the deficit deals with us by causing us to lose our AAA credit rating and our interest bill go up further increasing the amount of money being spent unproductively and on overheads instead of servicing us the people.

This won't be pleasant, but sadly those who are pragmatic enough to grasp it will accept the need. I appreciate this may well not include many who think that they can live off the state, that it should look after them and all their needs and don't grasp that the money for it has to come from somewhere and their relatively small or non-existent tax bill really doesn't come close to covering it.

Nice try

ok, you've established that labour made a right pigs ear of things and mostly i agree ,you also say that as usual labour have spent,spent and taxed and taxed ,i agree also ,so given that this is true what the hell makes you or the politicians think that the people who pay taxes of any form ,be it vat , income tax ,council tax or any other tax can afford to pay any more .It's ok saying ,but the debt has to be paid back ,yes it has ,but there isn't a limitless pot of money to draw on from the publics wages. Increasing taxes ,taking more of our wages will only create hardship that the state will pay for in the form of wellfair handouts .Other ways of reducing the deficit will have to be found other than taking it of the workers through increased taxes

[Hom3r]

The point I'm trying to make is everytime extra cash is need they go "I know lets screw the motorist again".

I know taxes need to be raised, but they have said they cannot put food up as it will affect the poorest. but obviously the poorest don't own cars.

Well the way things are going there will come a point when motorists will snap, and no doubt fuel protest will raise there head and I will join them.

Originally Posted by RizzyKing

Funny isn't it to labour supporters their beloved party did nothing wrong for the thirteen years they held power but they are so happy to have a go at the poor sods that havn't been in for three weeks about this mess. Get real and take off those red tinted specs and see the complete mess that labour have left us all in and all of us are going to have to pay for it oneway or the other. But one consolation for you the majority of the public in this country are so damn short sighted come the next election they will forget who caused all this and will punish those who sorted it out letting the lunatics take over the asylum again.

I have never said that Labour where perfect, and my glasses are very clear.

[Xaccers]

Once again, VAT is not only on fuel! (actually it's not even on my fuel)

[Ignitionnet]

Originally Posted by martyh

Increasing taxes ,taking more of our wages will only create hardship that the state will pay for in the form of wellfair handouts .Other ways of reducing the deficit will have to be found other than taking it of the workers through increased taxes

There has to be a balance of cuts to services and tax increases. Cut services too much it causes hardship through job cuts causing an influx on a job market that might not be able to take the strain, and reduction of services people have come to, right or wrong, rely on. Increase taxes too much it disincentivises work and deters investment.

The Tory plan had the balance shifted more towards cuts than tax increases, Labour's was skewed more towards tax increases, the Lib Dems' was in between the two.

The point is due to the mess we can't have no cuts or no tax increases sadly, it's a balancing act. We'll see if the balance we get from ConLib is the right one.

---------- Post added at 20:34 ---------- Previous post was at 20:32 ----------

Originally Posted by Hom3r

The point I'm trying to make is everytime extra cash is need they go "I know lets screw the motorist again".

I know taxes need to be raised, but they have said they cannot put food up as it will affect the poorest. but obviously the poorest don't own cars.

Well the way things are going there will come a point when motorists will snap, and no doubt fuel protest will raise there head and I will join them.

I have never said that Labour where perfect, and my glasses are very clear.

There has been no confirmation that it will happen, and no confirmation of how it will happen if it does.

Let's wait and see the specifics before condemning them over a policy they haven't yet announced, eh?

Originally Posted by Ignitionnet

There has to be a balance of cuts to services and tax increases. Cut services too much it causes hardship through job cuts causing an influx on a job market that might not be able to take the strain, and reduction of services people have come to, right or wrong, rely on. Increase taxes too much it disincentivises work and deters investment.

The Tory plan had the balance shifted more towards cuts than tax increases, Labour's was skewed more towards tax increases, the Lib Dems' was in between the two.

The point is due to the mess we can't have no cuts or no tax increases sadly, it's a balancing act. We'll see if the balance we get from ConLib is the right one.

?

and that will be balancing act worthy of Billy Smarts Circus lets hope they get it right

Originally Posted by Hom3r

The point I'm trying to make is everytime extra cash is need they go "I know lets screw the motorist again".

I know taxes need to be raised, but they have said they cannot put food up as it will affect the poorest. but obviously the poorest don't own cars.

Well the way things are going there will come a point when motorists will snap, and no doubt fuel protest will raise there head and I will join them.

You probably didn't want to bash the government on motorists the same day that this comes out:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/7720...y-pledges.html

Within 24 hours of taking on the portfolio he confirmed the new administration would bring in a "fuel price stabiliser" which would see the taxes reduced if the price of oil rises sharply.

However Mr Hammond, who drives a Jaguar, sought to underline the new Government's motorist-friendly credentials confirming a manifesto pledge that there would be no Whitehall cash for new fixed speed cameras.



He said road safety partnerships would have to pay for new devices out of their own funds, even though the Treasury would still pocket the fines.
The new Government will also press ahead with plans to curb the activities of rogue private clamping firms, Mr Hammond added.

---------- Post added at 20:43 ---------- Previous post was at 20:42 ----------

I not sure I agree with all of that though. Speed cameras do seem to work, accidents overall down, accidents near troublespots where cameras are installed way down.

Also road tolls work well in Europe. Awesome roads there.

[PeteLockwood]

a fuel price stabiliser is a excellent idea i have been wondering why labour never did this... i dont drive but maybe they could go ahead and use some of this extortionate amount of tax and filling in the millions of potholes ?

Originally Posted by PeteL

a fuel price stabiliser is a excellent idea i have been wondering why labour never did this... i dont drive but maybe they could go ahead and use some of this extortionate amount of tax and filling in the millions of potholes ?

To be fair it is probably hard to manage if you cannot be sure what fuel duty is bringing in. You would have to be running a surplus budget or borrow more...

[Hom3r]

Originally Posted by Damien

I not sure I agree with all of that though. Speed cameras do seem to work, accidents overall down, accidents near troublespots where cameras are installed way down.

Also road tolls work well in Europe. Awesome roads there.

Well IMHO speed camera are pointless, most sat navs have locations of them in, you can buy devices exclusively for them.

Most people speed upto them then slow down, then speed up after them.

Well i get the bus to work, leaving the car on the drive Monday - Friday.

A 4 week ticket with Arriva online costs me £33.30p so that is less than a weeks fuel in the car.

OK, so i have to walk 10 mins to the bus stop to and from, but otherwise - Win

[Xaccers]

Light up speed limit signs have been shown to be more effective in that people slow down and stay slowed down.

[Derek]

Originally Posted by Hom3r

Well IMHO speed camera are pointless, most sat navs have locations of them in, you can buy devices exclusively for them.

They still catch plenty of people going over the limit.

[Xaccers]

Originally Posted by Derek S

They still catch plenty of people going over the limit.

Which shows that they're not doing their job as a deterrant, and if they're in accident blackspots, if they're not slowing people down, they're not saving lives, so something else needs to be done such as redesigning the road to be safer.