Real Justice. - Page 3

TheDon · 06-11-2009, 16:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris

A life sentence is designed to provide both punishment and the possibility of rehabilitation. The tariff ensures there is a minimum period in jail as adequate punishment, but this is only the period they must serve before applying for parole. There's no guarantee of release after that; if they don't convince the parole board they have reformed and no longer pose a risk, then they stay behind bars for as long as it takes.

People on life sentences are also only released on license. This means that whilst being out of prison they are never actually free. They always have conditions on what they can and can't do and can be put back in prison at the drop of a hat, and even committing the most minor of crimes will lead to them being sent straight to jail immediately on arrest.

Flyboy · 06-11-2009, 16:49

Life sentences are not conducive to rehabilitation, if there is no hope of parole.

Ramrod · 06-11-2009, 16:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flyboy

Some source material would be useful.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/2030326.stm

Flyboy · 06-11-2009, 16:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ramrod

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/2030326.stm

I think you might have missed something in your interpretation of the facts:

Quote:

The general re-offending rate among paedophiles is 90%, but after treatment at Wolvercote, it dropped to 20%

Ramrod · 06-11-2009, 16:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by zing

you are missing chemical castration

iirc, thats not even all that effective

Quote:

Incidentally and I realise this is going to go down like a ton of bricks if as you say its a natural attraction like yours and mine hetrosexuallity are you not giving them the arguement that its genetic and they were born that way therefore it is not their choice?

I'm not saying it's necessarily genetic, just that it's the way their brains are 'wired' by nature or nurture......but I do agree that it's not their choice.

---------- Post added at 16:55 ---------- Previous post was at 16:52 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flyboy

I think you might have missed something in your interpretation of the facts:

Yeah, but they ain't dead yet......therefore we can't say if they never will reoffend.......all we do know is that 90% (or 70-80% according to other studies) reoffend

You have a touchingly naive belief in 'treatment'

06-11-2009, 16:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ramrod

iirc, thats not even all that effective

I'm not saying it's necessarily genetic, just that it's the way their brains are 'wired' by nature or nurture......but I do agree that it's not their choice.

then you are classing it the same as hetro and homo sexuality. Its a dangerous path. I have no idea what makes someone a pedophile but if it is genetic the same as hetro and homo then what do we do about them then? remember homosexuality was illegal up until recentish history obviously that is not an option for pedophiles but if they are genetically inclined to be the way they are then killing them is a horrendously brutal option.

They also used to think homosexuality was treatable too

I obviously do not think its acceptable and am purely playing devils advocate

TheNorm · 06-11-2009, 17:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nidge

...Respect to Saudi Arabia.... that punishment wouldn't happen here! ....

So are you in favour of sharia law in the UK?

TheDon · 06-11-2009, 17:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by zing

you are missing chemical castration

Incidentally and I realise this is going to go down like a ton of bricks if as you say its a natural attraction like yours and mine hetrosexuallity are you not giving them the arguement that its genetic and they were born that way therefore it is not their choice?

(I do not support this theory btw in any way shape or form)

It's not their choice to feel that way, it IS their choice to act on it. There are plenty of pedophiles that do not act on their urges, who choose to ignore it and are perfectly capable of living normal lives in the community. This is another reason why crimes dealing with it have high re-offending rates, the ones that offend in the first place are the ones that cannot control them, and so the risk that they'll therefore re-offend in future is naturally far higher.

To support the fact it's a natural attraction then you only have to look at it only being quite recently in human history that pedophilia has been seen as wrong, and there's still many tribal communities around the world where it's actively practiced. Not much has changed in the human brain since then, only social conditioning.

Ramrod · 06-11-2009, 17:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by zing

then you are classing it the same as hetro and homo sexuality. Its a dangerous path. I have no idea what makes someone a pedophile but if it is genetic the same as hetro and homo then what do we do about them then?

Lock em up forever for the good of our children......but in the case of that one in Saudi, I'd kill him.....

06-11-2009, 17:03

How isnt chemical castration effective?

Ramrod · 06-11-2009, 17:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by zing

How isnt chemical castration effective?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chemical_castration

Quote:

48 males with long standing histories of sexually deviant behaviour were given medroxyprogesterone acetate for as long as 12 months. Forty of those subjects were recorded as to have diminished desires for deviant sexual behaviour, less frequent sexual fantasies, and greater control over sexual urges

Not a resounding success....
btw, it's hard to find any studies about chemical castration and it's efficacy, this suggests that we don't really know how effective it is

06-11-2009, 17:44

its not negative either though is it?

TheNorm · 06-11-2009, 18:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ramrod

....btw, it's hard to find any studies about chemical castration and it's efficacy, ...

Maybe you are not looking in the right place. A quick search revealed five papers:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/en...=related_query

Tech_Boy · 06-11-2009, 19:02

http://www.matrixknowledge.com/wp-co...es-article.pdf
shows that the annual average cost for each prisoner exceeds Â£40,000.

I pay .035 pence per round of .22 rimfire ammunition, I'm sure that the Government can get it cheaper.

You do the maths.

Ramrod · 06-11-2009, 19:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by zing

its not negative either though is it?

Not positive enough though

---------- Post added at 19:16 ---------- Previous post was at 19:15 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheNorm

Maybe you are not looking in the right place. A quick search revealed five papers:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/en...=related_query

I looked there with various search requests!

Then again, those don't talk about it's efficacy.....