Migrant workers help UK economy

[Escapee]

I guess the TUC have gained their figures from companies they deal with who are responsible, above board and above all trustworthy.

Companies illegally employing migrant workers with no work permits and illegal passports will not be included in these figures. My area has very few immigrants, but its only a matter of months ago an Asian convenience store less than a quarter of a mile away was raided. They found and arrested somewhere in the region of 17 illegal immigrants (from memory) that were living above the shop, all smuggled in by the owner.

There have not been any follow on news reports about the incident. I also understand one of the local kebab houses is reputed to have a large number of immigrants living above the premises, and a few of these are working in the shop.

For every good piece of evidence there is bad evidence, and with the government having no idea how many illegal immigrants there are here its a little silly to portray a picture of all being well.

[Chrysalis]

Originally Posted by Damien

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/6766003.stm

Something the Daily Mail and others should take on board. Instead they choose to run

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/liv...n_page_id=1770

Damien you come across as a bit gullible reading stories like this as gospel, 1.5million workers probably means 1.5million legit tax paying workers so will exclude all the illegal working immigrants and of course when they talk about the public services costs it probably excludes the costs of providing public services to non working immigrants and asylum seekers.

The fact they are saying it has little impact on wages is it no surprise that areas that have a high immigrant population also have the lowest wage levels in the country.

---------- Post added at 00:19 ---------- Previous post was at 00:15 ----------

Originally Posted by sherer

for every report saying they are usefull there will be reports saying they aren't.. whatever view you have you can always put spin on these and if you want the anti immigration people can just choose to ignore these pro reports anyway

i was saying to someone the other day that if they all went "back to where they came from" as alot want I don't think I would be able to get into work. I know my office wouldn't be clean as we would have no cleaners.. plus alot of other jobs.. alot of nurses as from other countries as they would be missed plus the hundreds of other useful jobs they do too..

i've met more work shy, chavs, jobs from the UK than I have immigrants

Of course you not wrong, but where I disagree with you is you taking extremist views, are you saying there is only two options in that we either send every immigrant back and completely close the borders or we carry on having an open immigration policy, why not just limit immigration and make people claim asylum before they enter the uk?

---------- Post added at 00:21 ---------- Previous post was at 00:19 ----------

Originally Posted by danielf

I've had a cursory glance as well, but what they are actually saying is that population growth in general tends to help the economy by creating more demand (page 10; the baby boom example is quite interesting). It also says that, because migrants tend to be young adults, they are less likely to use public services (i.e. they have already been educated), which plays a large part in them being net contributors). (page 19). Page 18 also gives data on net contributions during 2003/2004 (when on average more was taken out than was paid in, but this was particularly true of the natives)

Edit: figured out how to copy from that article

Interesting points about the education, what they forget to realise is immigrants are having more children per women then non immigrant women at current so of course in years to come there will be a future impact on the education system. no forward thinking in that report if thats how they concluded.

[danielf]

Originally Posted by Chrysalis

Interesting points about the education, what they forget to realise is immigrants are having more children per women then non immigrant women at current so of course in years to come there will be a future impact on the education system. no forward thinking in that report if thats how they concluded.

I'm not quite sure if that argument holds. Firstly, many immigrants will bugger off after a few years. Secondly, if they put their children through full education here, the children are likely to remain here and pay their own taxes (i.e. they would be contributing as much as the average native briton (on average)).

[Florence]

It isn't all good there is a company in Manchester who is bringing polish people in to work on refurbising computers. They rent rooms in a couple of large houses the company owns. Rent is take out of the wages before they are paid. This is so they can have cheap labour instead of employing british workers.

[JackB]

Interesting points about the education, what they forget to realise is immigrants are having more children per women then non immigrant women at current so of course in years to come there will be a future impact on the education system.

I'd say there is already an impact on education. My son came home recently and told me that he hadn't learned much at school as his teacher was struggling to explain the lesson to some children who couldn't speak English.

This article suggests that this is becoming a widespread problem.

http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/10437

[Xaccers]

Lets not foget, I know some people would like to, that children born to immigrants will grow up learning english and so won't have a problem at school.
Sorry, was that too obvious?

me283, sorry, I mean JackB, so easy to get you two mixed up, your son said he hadn't learnt much at school because the teacher was dealing with other kids?
Hell, that's school for you.
I didn't learn much in some lessons because of the less intelligent kids.
Thankfully, we had things called school books, which we were supposed to learn from, rather than being dictated to by a teacher and just regurgitate things parrot fashion, but hey, maybe your school doesn't do that.
What did the head teacher say when you discussed it with them?

[punky]

Originally Posted by Xaccers

me283, sorry, I mean JackB,

Please do not post petty accusations in public.

Any suspicion of duplicate accounts should be directed to the team in private where we will act where we see fit. Its not for members to decide.

[Womble]

h

Originally Posted by Xaccers

Lets not forget, I know some people would like to, that children born to immigrants will grow up learning English and so won't have a problem at school.
Sorry, was that too obvious?

me283, sorry, I mean JackB, so easy to get you two mixed up, your son said he hadn't learnt much at school because the teacher was dealing with other kids?
Hell, that's school for you.
I didn't learn much in some lessons because of the less intelligent kids.
Thankfully, we had things called school books, which we were supposed to learn from, rather than being dictated to by a teacher and just regurgitate things parrot fashion, but hey, maybe your school doesn't do that.
What did the head teacher say when you discussed it with them?

That has to be one of the most contentious posts I've read.
You can bury your head in the sand as much as you like, but the fact remains there are to many immigrants/asylum seekers in our country, and its causing bad feeling among even the most placid of English

---------- Post added at 11:47 ---------- Previous post was at 11:45 ----------

Originally Posted by Chrysalis

Damien you come across as a bit gullible reading stories like this as gospel, 1.5million workers probably means 1.5million legit tax paying workers so will exclude all the illegal working immigrants and of course when they talk about the public services costs it probably excludes the costs of providing public services to non working immigrants and asylum seekers.

The fact they are saying it has little impact on wages is it no surprise that areas that have a high immigrant population also have the lowest wage levels in the country.

---------- Post added at 00:19 ---------- Previous post was at 00:15 ----------



Of course you not wrong, but where I disagree with you is you taking extremist views, are you saying there is only two options in that we either send every immigrant back and completely close the borders or we carry on having an open immigration policy, why not just limit immigration and make people claim asylum before they enter the uk?

---------- Post added at 00:21 ---------- Previous post was at 00:19 ----------



Interesting points about the education, what they forget to realise is immigrants are having more children per women then non immigrant women at current so of course in years to come there will be a future impact on the education system. no forward thinking in that report if thats how they concluded.

Most sensible post award for this one

[Xaccers]

Originally Posted by Womble

h

That has to be one of the most contentious posts I've read.
You can bury your head in the sand as much as you like, but the fact remains there are to many immigrants/asylum seekers in our country, and its causing bad feeling among even the most placid of English

So because people are resentful towards foreigners, that's the foreigners fault?
Do you also believe that Islamists complaining about Rushdie getting a Knighthood are justified?
Or do you think that their resentment is their own responsibility?

[Womble]

Originally Posted by Xaccers

So because people are resentful towards foreigners, that's the foreigners fault?
Do you also believe that Islamists complaining about Rushdie getting a Knighthood are justified?
Or do you think that their resentment is their own responsibility?

???
There are too many foreigners, period.
They are affecting the English way of life, is that the foreigners fault?? hell yes, and the wish washy Govts fault too.

As for Salmon Rushdie, he wrote a book ffs, so what?? Plenty books have been written about the Catholic Church, any death threats from the Pope?? thought not!

[Xaccers]

Originally Posted by Womble

???
There are too many foreigners, period.
They are affecting the English way of life, is that the foreigners fault?? hell yes, and the wish washy Govts fault too.

As for Salmon Rushdie, he wrote a book ffs, so what?? Plenty books have been written about the Catholic Church, any death threats from the Pope?? thought not!

So it's the foreigners fault that people are resentful of them being here, but it's the islamists fault that they are resentful about a book someone else wrote.
Tell me, if someone is homophobic, is it the homosexual community's fault, or the homophobe's fault for his homophobia?

[Russ]

Originally Posted by Womble

???
There are too many foreigners, period.
They are affecting the English way of life, is that the foreigners fault?? hell yes, and the wish washy Govts fault too.

And the English are affecting the Welsh way of life too, is that your fault?

[Womble]

Originally Posted by Russ B

And the English are affecting the Welsh way of life too, is that your fault?

If I was affecting your way off life, yes it would be, but I'm not, I dont live in Wales.. Your point is?
Dont you have your own assembly?? We the English dont

[Xaccers]

Can you please define what the English way of life is?

[Russ]

Originally Posted by Womble

If I was affecting your way off life, yes it would be, but I'm not, I dont live in Wales.. Your point is?

Just as daft as yours.

Originally Posted by Womble

Dont you have your own assembly?? We the English dont

Yes you do, it's called Westminster which is infinately more powerful than what we've got - and is totally off-topic.