Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]

[JackSon]

Originally Posted by R Jones

and when I clicked the No this isn't satisfactory button I got this email

Dear Customer,

Please ignore my previous email which was sent erroneously. I apologise for the same.

I have reviewed the previous correspondence with you, and I offer my sincere apologies for any misunderstanding thus far.

I do understand your concern in this regard.

I have passed your message on to the appropriate department
in our company for investigation. Customer feedback such as yours
helps us to continue improving the selection and service we
provide. We appreciate the time you've taken to write to us.

If you have any other suggestions for us or would like to make a
comment at another time, please don't hesitate to send us an
e-mail. To do this, please visit our Help Desk at the following URL:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/contact-us

We'll look forward to hearing from you. Thank you for shopping at
Amazon.co.uk.

Warmest regards


named person
Amazon.co.uk

Woah, that is quite a turn of tone! That concerns me more than their initial response for some reason

[dav]

Sounds like an auto-reply stalling email to me.

[popper]

Originally Posted by R Jones

Is this group moderated please? I don't think this sort of language helps the cause especially if we are trying to complain about breaches of the law while using the internet.

Thanks for the prompt action.

use the red triangle on the left to receave faster feedback from the mod and action in such cases.

[JackSon]

Originally Posted by dav

Sounds like an auto-reply stalling email to me.

Caught me hook line and sinker then; I'll get me coat.

[SMHarman]

Originally Posted by Chroma

Somewhat related article on ArsTechnica

http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post...ke-a-buck.html



Seems things on the other side of the pond are in fairly bad shape too, is it just me or have more and more of these shady ad brokers poped up?

Interesting other article on that site about how IP addresses are considered personal data by NJ courts.
http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post...-subpoena.html

[popper]

Originally Posted by JackSon

Caught me hook line and sinker then; I'll get me coat.

you just have to love generic speak

[SBD]

Online advert system Phorm could be automatically blocked by security programs, BBC News has learned.

The controversial system is based around small files called cookies that some computer security firms say they may label as "adware" and block.

Other firms are waiting until the system is rolled out until they decide what to do with Phorm cookies.

Phorm said the firm was talking to security companies to explain how its system worked.

Many security firms contacted by BBC News said the tools included in security programs would let computer owners stop the cookie being used.

Privacy fear

Phorm works by watching a user's web browsing habits and then slipping adverts related to that history onto websites that have signed up.

To target ads Phorm, like many other web businesses, uses a small text file called a cookie.

So far three net firms, BT, Virgin and Carphone Warehouse, have signed up for Phorm. Carphone Warehouse has said its customers will have to opt in to the system the other two will automatically enrol anyone that does not explicitly ask to be excluded.

Some computer security companies contacted by the BBC say they may block the cookie that Phorm uses to keep an eye on a web user's habits.

Stefan Lundstrom, an anti-spyware researcher at F-Secure, said it had been in discussion with Phorm about how its system works. He added that it would take a firm decision when the system goes live.

"Phorm have hinted that most ISP's will choose an opt-out solution based on a cookie," he said. "We have expressed our concern that's not informed consent and most likely will meet our detection criteria."

The result would be blocking of the cookie and labelling it as adware.

Simon Heron, managing director of UK security firm Network Box, which provides security services to small businesses, said it would block the cookie initially.

Mr Heron acknowledged Phorm's efforts to abide by the Anti-Spyware Coalition's code of practice and its links with net firms but said security and privacy concerns had driven its blocking decision.

He added: "We will continue to monitor this situation but browsing information is the user's property not the ISP's or anybody else's."

Symantec, Trend Micro and McAfee said they would monitor Phorm as it gets rolled out to see how the cookie is used in practice and whether users need warning about it.

In a statement Symantec said: "At this point we are assessing the full implications of this technology and how it fits into the established criteria we use for categorising and classifying new technologies such as Phorm's."

Graham Cluley, senior technology consultant at Sophos, said because it only provided services to businesses it was unlikely to be called on to block Phorm cookies.

He added that the website Phorm uses to serve up targeted ads would be entered into its security database to give customers the option of blocking that.

"Our aim is to give companies the power to police their users' safe use of the web, rather than disrupt what some may consider legitimate internet traffic," he added.

Greg Day, security analyst at McAfee, said it was still talking to Phorm about how the ad-serving system worked.

"At this point we have not rushed to give it a classification," he said.

Its eventual classification would come down to how the system was used, added Mr Day.

"Is the customer aware of it and do they have the choice of whether to opt in or out?"

Mr Day said that the cookie could end up being blocked by many users if security programs warn them about the tiny file.

"Most people do not differentiate between viruses, worms, mass mailers or trojans," he said. "When they see a pop up from a security vendor they will see it as a bad thing and worry about it."

A spokesman for Phorm said: "The reality of it is that the Phorm cookie is a cookie like any other. It is an inactive piece of text that's dropped on your computer just like any other third party tracking software."

He added that any company that blocked the Phorm cookie could consider blocking cookies from other ad-serving companies, such as Google, which gave users no choice to avoid being shown targeted ads.

He said Phorm was talking to security companies to explain how its system worked so they could understand what it did and respect the methods it used to help people opt out.

EDIT Rob: Do not cut and past large articles, but provide links to the original to avoid breach of copyright. This post has been merged as another Phorm thread wasn't justified

[mark777]

Originally Posted by JackSon

Caught me hook line and sinker then; I'll get me coat.

It just means Amazon's e-mail bot is doing a better job and is more convincing than the Phorm PR Team.

[dav]

Originally Posted by mark777

It just means Amazon's e-mail bot is doing a better job and is more convincing than the Phorm PR Team.

"This just in...e-mail bot passes Turing Test; Phorm Pr Team fails"

[CaptJamieHunter]

Originally Posted by dav

"This just in...e-mail bot passes Turing Test; Phorm Pr Team fails"

I was listening to a reading of 2001 this morning which discussed the Turing Test

[popper]

this newest EU survey is dated 17.04.2008 but its only just been put up today, interesting....

http://ec.europa.eu/justice_home/fsj...s/index_en.htm

17.04.2008Eurobarometer survey reveals that EU citizens are not yet fully aware of their rights on data protection
Eurobarometer survey reveals that EU citizens are not yet fully aware of their rights on data protection
Eurobarometer survey measures perceptions amongst European data controllers
Results of the two Eurobarometer surveys on data protection awareness in the European Union carried out in 2008:

1. Data Protection in the European Union : Citizens' perceptions (Flash Eurobarometer EB 225)
   • Summary (PDF File 486 KB)
   • Report (PDF File 4.2 MB
2. Data Protection in the European Union : Data controllers' perceptions (Flash Eurobarometer EB 226)
   • Summary (PDF File 329 KB)
   • Report (PDF File 1.9 MB)

[davidb24v]

Originally Posted by CaptJamieHunter

Don't start me off on BT and Openreach engineers. It's not just headaches they cause, it's stress, stratospheric blood pressure and so much more. Even now the sight of a BT logo ups my BP 30 points. I'm not joking.

Your speculation seems logical to me. I'm not sure of the legality of such a move but if they could get away with it I'm sure BT would go for it. Which could mean that smaller ISPs who have said they won't ever go down the Phorm route might find themselves shafted (can I use this word mod?) by BT...

I know exactly where you are with that good Sir. Been there, done that, still got the straightjacket. It really bothers me that I don't see ADSL as an option (I don't even like to think about it to be honest, as the BT/Openreach memories come flooding back my BP goes through the roof too - that was a few years ago and a 512kbps connection ).

Strangely, I recall very clearly that they couldn't tell me about certain "issues" - that's it, er, not working to us little people - on my line because that was to do with their contract with my ISP (a very small and a very good one). To have told me would "breach the data protection act" apparently . I remember the conversation with the muppet^H^H^H^H^H^H Openreach person as if it was 10 minutes ago.

Funny old world, hey!

Dave

[mark777]

Originally Posted by CaptJamieHunter

I was listening to a reading of 2001 this morning which discussed the Turing Test

Well, I saw Hillary Clinton on the box and I thought it was a Turing test.

I wonder if Kent was with her, under sniper fire, in Sarajevo?

Seriously, I think Kent has seriously mis-understood the cultural differences between the UK and US. Every time he opens his mouth he seems to drop a clanger, but it's not one that would seem out of place in the US.

[manxminx]

Had a reply from another MEP. The most important thing he wrote was:

As you will be aware, some parts of the European Union’s e-privacy directive are being reviewed at present, as part of the review of the so-called 'Telecoms Package'. I have asked my European Parliamentary Labour Party colleagues who are members of the EP’s Industry Committee, to take a keen interest in this revision to see if we can strengthen these measures.

However, what concerns me more is the secretive way that some ISPs have trialed and introduced such software. Many consumers will simply be unaware of the concerns of such new technology, introduced without their knowledge.

Ok, we've bombarded our MPs and MEP's. As someone mentioned a few pages ago, we now need to concentrate on educational bodies, schools, library's etc. Has anyone got a letter template they can post up, or pm me, that I can use as a basis for my letter please?

Ali.

[popper]

http://internetcommunications.tmcnet...-my-cookie.htm
"April 22, 2008

Waiter, there's a Phorm in my Cookie

By Richard Grigonis
Executive Editor, IP Communications Group

Phorm (News - Alert), formerly known as 121Media, is an online behavioral targeting advertisement technology company based in New York, London and Moscow. The company has been attempting to line up deals with some UK-based ISPs to deliver targeted advertising based on a user's browsing habits by using deep packet inspection.
..."

http://www.redorbit.com/news/technol...wary_of_phorm/