Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797] - Page 284

AlexanderHanff · 21-04-2008, 08:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by dav

Is'nt it time to start keeping our cards close to our collective chests now?
Discussing this in open forum is great, but it does give Phorm an unfair advantage (not that they know how to operate in any other way)
Is it now time to create a private group to compile these questions that is comprised of trusted members? I realise it restricts the debate a little, but I think most people are of the view that a concerted, co-ordinated policy is now needed and a bit of rabble-rousing on a forum, whilst certainly cathartic, isn't necessarily the best way.
Once the group members have been decided upon, other members can submit suggested questions to them for inclusion via PM.

I will ask the admin for a private forum area to discuss the questions or we can do it on irc.

Alexander Hanff

bigbadcol · 21-04-2008, 09:21

ICO / Phorm spin version 3.

On friday 18th the ICO issued a revised statment abour Phorm.

http://www.ico.gov.uk/about_us/news_...e_and_oie.aspx

Yet again they have missed the point, it is our data, nobody has the right to intercept that datastream.

The ICO is not fit for purpose.

They miss the point on RIPA and refuse to even look at the matter.

They miss th epoint on the original Home Office Statemment.

They miss the point on this whole sorry system.

This is not a tootless watchdog, it is one with its mouth wired up and lips sown together.

AlexanderHanff · 21-04-2008, 09:28

There is a long way to go yet and the new statement goes even further to emphasise informed consent and recognises the reports and concerns of experts such as Dr Richard Clayton, so this is not a bad result for the public and does nothing to strengthen Phorm's position.

I agree, the IC is a bloody idiot, but don't look on this latest version as a completely negative thing.

Alexander Hanff

OF1975 · 21-04-2008, 09:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by AlexanderHanff

I will ask the admin for a private forum area to discuss the questions or we can do it on irc.

Alexander Hanff

IRC is an excellent idea. We could make the channel invite only too and only tell people the channel name via private message and that way we can ensure that PhormPRTeam cannot snoop on the plans. Their activities on badphorm vis-a-vis the user pages has me a little concerned as to what they are up to.

I keep mIRC connected to undernet 24/7 anyway. Its one of my hobbies.

AlexanderHanff · 21-04-2008, 09:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by OF1975

IRC is an excellent idea. We could make the channel invite only too and only tell people the channel name via private message and that way we can ensure that PhormPRTeam cannot snoop on the plans. Their activities on badphorm vis-a-vis the user pages has me a little concerned as to what they are up to.

I keep mIRC connected to undernet 24/7 anyway. Its one of my hobbies.

I have been hanging out on undernet for 11 years, gimmie a shout, nick is Paladine.

Alexander Hanff

OF1975 · 21-04-2008, 09:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by AlexanderHanff

I have been hanging out on undernet for 11 years, gimmie a shout, nick is Paladine.

Alexander Hanff

Ah another long-time undernet user. I have been going to undernet on and off for about 10 years or there abouts. Will message you on IRC in a few minutes.

dav · 21-04-2008, 09:51

Wouldn't setting up an IRC channel be discrimitory in some way against those who are less technically adept? I don't think we need to take this in the direction of the more net savvy users at the expense of the users whose less technical concerns are those we are trying to court.
Ease of input and engagement for all should be a prime concern and not all forum members with something valuable to contribute to the list of questions may be able to join an IRC chat. This is why I suggested a private forum area. It is a format everyone here is comfortable with and capable of easy access.
In addition, people posting from work (like me) will more often than not have IRC chat blocked.

AlexanderHanff · 21-04-2008, 09:54

Naaaah there is a good web based client on mibbit.com seems to work for most people at work as it is ajax based and all done over http. And you don't need to be a geek to use irc.

But I don't mind to be honest, whatever most people are comfortable with.

Alexander Hanff

OF1975 · 21-04-2008, 10:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by dav

Wouldn't setting up an IRC channel be discrimitory in some way against those who are less technically adept? I don't think we need to take this in the direction of the more net savvy users at the expense of the users whose less technical concerns are those we are trying to court.
Ease of input and engagement for all should be a prime concern and not all forum members with something valuable to contribute to the list of questions may be able to join an IRC chat. This is why I suggested a private forum area. It is a format everyone here is comfortable with and capable of easy access.
In addition, people posting from work (like me) will more often than not have IRC chat blocked.

Ok thats fair enough. You raise some good points especially vis-a-vis those not technically adept and the IRC blocked at work issue.

---------- Post added at 10:04 ---------- Previous post was at 09:55 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by AlexanderHanff

Naaaah there is a good web based client on mibbit.com seems to work for most people at work as it is ajax based and all done over http. And you don't need to be a geek to use irc.

But I don't mind to be honest, whatever most people are comfortable with.

Alexander Hanff

Not only that but there is chatzilla as well which is a firefox addon. Maybe we could do both? A chat channel on IRC for those able and willing to do it and also a private forum. The main reason I suggested IRC was that it does give us more control. We could more easily ensure that Phorm were not able to join and gain an advantage.

dav · 21-04-2008, 10:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by AlexanderHanff

Naaaah there is a good web based client on mibbit.com seems to work for most people at work as it is ajax based and all done over http. And you don't need to be a geek to use irc.

But I don't mind to be honest, whatever most people are comfortable with.

Alexander Hanff

I tried to avoid using the "g"-word, but as you have now brought it into play, yes I think that is the perception of many. IRC is geek territory

We don't want to come across as a minority geek faction. Everyone, including their granny should be able to contribute.

AlexanderHanff · 21-04-2008, 10:17

I was just talking to a 63 yr old man who was on the original arpanet team waaay back. People of all ages use IRC, but like I said, I don't mind either way.

Alexander Hanff

fidbod · 21-04-2008, 10:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigbadcol

ICO / Phorm spin version 3.

On friday 18th the ICO issued a revised statment abour Phorm.

http://www.ico.gov.uk/about_us/news_...e_and_oie.aspx

Yet again they have missed the point, it is our data, nobody has the right to intercept that datastream.

The ICO is not fit for purpose.

They miss the point on RIPA and refuse to even look at the matter.

They miss th epoint on the original Home Office Statemment.

They miss the point on this whole sorry system.

This is not a tootless watchdog, it is one with its mouth wired up and lips sown together.

Alexander, you should take this as a compliment. They seem to be using your research to tell what regulations are applicable.

Seriously though, this statement from the ICO is a step in the right direction. Every piece of further scrutiny makes life harder for Phorm/Webwise.

Also, a vote in favour of a private forum rather than IRC. Work would not be happy with me running an IRC client.

roadrunner69 · 21-04-2008, 10:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by OF1975

The main reason I suggested IRC was that it does give us more control. We could more easily ensure that Phorm were not able to join and gain an advantage.

After the shennanigans at badphorm i think irc is probably the way to go in the final question forming stage but keeping the discussions and input on this thread to allow access for all.

OF1975 · 21-04-2008, 10:25

Ok, I accept a private forum would be easier for most people but how do we stop Phorm PRTeam or Phorm employees from accessing that forum? Permissions that block newly registered users from accessing the private forum?

dav · 21-04-2008, 10:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by fidbod

Also, a vote in favour of a private forum rather than IRC. Work would not be happy with me running an IRC client.

Indeed, I just tried to connect using Alexander's mibbit suggestion and it was blocked.

Have the private forum area set up as invite only with a friendly CF team member (aren't they all?) willing to allow permissions to a select few who will debate and screen questions submitted to them by PM's from all other members.

Keep it a small group (<10?) of members who are known to be genuine.
I'm unsure how progress could be reflected to the community at large though, irrespective of the approach used.