[Merged] CR3-Feedback & Questions in Here Please. - Page 27

Derek · 04-05-2004, 19:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nor

Dunno why everyone is so anxious to get it. Its completely crap and as soon as you've updated you'll wish to god you had the old epg back.

Well I prefer it and my parents (who aren't exactly techno-phobes but wouldn't be rushing to set a video) like it. They have actually started using the guide which they never did on CR2.

Nor · 04-05-2004, 19:16

Fair enough. My dad likes it too. But I think thats because he's never really used the onscreen guides that much so quite likes to just have something different.

In simple terms, it doesn't do the job its required to do. I want to see whats on quickly and the new epg only allows me to see things slowly and with the added annoyance of if being as far from intuitive as is possible. God only knows who tests these things before they are released.

Tristan · 04-05-2004, 19:32

About 1.5 million Bromley and Telewest customers tested the basic layout and functionality (what button does what, etc). I can't comment on the speed, but the design is sound. You just have to get used to it.

bigitup_j · 04-05-2004, 19:34

the layout and design, and the function of the buttons, on CR3 is excellent. it makes sense, there maybe a few problems but i'm sure these will be fixed soon!

Nor · 04-05-2004, 19:47

You now how you say 1.5 million people tested it. What was the reporting procedure to get opinions and feedback from those 1.5 million people. Also, please don't tell me that I just have to get used to it. Its nothing to do with 'getting used' to a new layout and funtionality. Its about having to live with an EPG where its quicker to get the radio times than use it notwithstanding the functionality issues.

Tristan · 04-05-2004, 20:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nor

You now how you say 1.5 million people tested it. What was the reporting procedure to get opinions and feedback from those 1.5 million people. Also, please don't tell me that I just have to get used to it. Its nothing to do with 'getting used' to a new layout and funtionality. Its about having to live with an EPG where its quicker to get the radio times than use it notwithstanding the functionality issues.

Okay, yes, I was being a little glib. What I should have said was, 1.5 million or so people use software which is the same in terms of which button does what on the mini-guide and so forth. The Telewest favourites system is a bit different, and they only have one day's worth of listings in their TV guide, but anyway...

The point I was trying to make is that a great many people use equivelent software every day without any bother at all. It's all about what you're used to. To me, CR3 seems very simple to use; press TV wherever you are to get back to fullscreen viewing, and when it's fullscreen, press TV to bring up the miniguide. Press i, or Browse on old Langley remotes, to see a synopsis for whatever programme you have highlighted in whatever menu you're in. If there are no menus onscreen, it brings up the programme you're currently watching. I can't for the life of me see how that's a difficult to use system, or how it's confusing, but there you go.

Anyway, I'm kind of curious now. Imagine that your guide gathered data as it should, and that the speed is adequate, and so forth. Imagine CR3 is working as it should, basically. Now, aside for the fact you can't scroll up and down the channel list in 100s (which would be a bit odd with the new favourites system, and wouldn't really work with the goal of consistancy across all menus), what exactly is wrong with the fundemental design of it?

1701-e · 04-05-2004, 20:51

I think you've 3 balls sir!!!

Tristan · 04-05-2004, 20:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1701-e

I think you've 3 balls sir!!!

Quite right! Consider it amended

Nor · 04-05-2004, 21:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tristan

Okay, yes, I was being a little glib. What I should have said was, 1.5 million or so people use software which is the same in terms of which button does what on the mini-guide and so forth. The Telewest favourites system is a bit different, and they only have one day's worth of listings in their TV guide, but anyway...

The point I was trying to make is that a great many people use equivelent software every day without any bother at all. It's all about what you're used to. To me, CR3 seems very simple to use; press TV wherever you are to get back to fullscreen viewing, and when it's fullscreen, press TV to bring up the miniguide. Press i, or Browse on old Langley remotes, to see a synopsis for whatever programme you have highlighted in whatever menu you're in. If there are no menus onscreen, it brings up the programme you're currently watching. I can't for the life of me see how that's a difficult to use system, or how it's confusing, but there you go.

Anyway, I'm kind of curious now. Imagine that your guide gathered data as it should, and that the speed is adequate, and so forth. Imagine CR3 is working as it should, basically. Now, aside for the fact you can't scroll up and down the channel list in 100s (which would be a bit odd with the new favourites system, and wouldn't really work with the goal of consistancy across all menus), what exactly is wrong with the fundemental design of it?

Speed is the main factor for me. You say ignore that and talk about the design, but surely this new fancy, more complicated design has impacted on speed ? So why are they rolling out a design that the cpu power of the box can't cope with ? I used to be able to get the diary up instantly, now I have a please wait sign for 9 seconds.

To pinpoint a couple of design/fuctionality issues not connected with speed. The scrolling in 100s as you've mentioned. I'm not a great fan of the full guide either, I prefered being able to see what was on an entire channel for the evening, then I click arrowed down and it showed me the whole next channel. Currently I see only half the movie channels, have to scroll along loads to find out whats exactly on that night. Then go to the next lot of movie channels and start all over again. Notwithstanding the fact that it moves sooooo slowly even if it was like lightening it'd still be slower and less easy to find out whats on all night. Also takes up far too much of the screen and for such an intrusive EPG its not customisable enough. Have to laugh at who selected the reminder noise notifications too, you couldn't get more unfriendly and annoying reminders (yes I do realise you can turn them off, but who thinks these things are good to include them in the first place). Also in the main guide, it doesn't actually tell you when programs start. If its not on the hour of half hour you have to guess what time it starts or goto the bother of clicking it to find out.

Also not keen on the mini guide which forwards 2 programs at a time. Which also incidently leaves you highlighting the second one. The main problem is the speed though and in all honestly its quicker to grab the radio times than to use the guide.

Derek · 04-05-2004, 21:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nor

I prefered being able to see what was on an entire channel for the evening, then I click arrowed down and it showed me the whole next channel. Currently I see only half the movie channels, have to scroll along loads to find out whats exactly on that night. Then go to the next lot of movie channels and start all over again.

You can use the favourites section. It works almost the same as the old guide (plus you can use the PageUp/Down buttons to jump down the screen)
You access this by pressing yellow from the mini-guide

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nor

Have to laugh at who selected the reminder noise notifications too, you couldn't get more unfriendly and annoying reminders (yes I do realise you can turn them off, but who thinks these things are good to include them in the first place)

Now if you are in another room you can tell if a reminder has appeared. I use it if I'm getting some food. The sounds might be annoying to some but what would you have put there?

Nor · 04-05-2004, 21:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by dezzo

You can use the favourites section. It works almost the same as the old guide (plus you can use the PageUp/Down buttons to jump down the screen)
You access this by pressing yellow from the mini-guide

Its completely different. It doesn't show whats on the channel, just the channels. If I want to see whats on the channel I have to right click over to it, and even then I only see 5 timings. Then if I want to change channel it all dissapears. Its not the same at all as being able to cycle down all the channels and for it to show basically whats on the whole evening. It just seems now to achieve something requires a helluva lot more clicks and menus visited than it did before. I'm sure someone will say, its just cos its different and you're not used to it that you don't like it. I wish it was too, but it isn't its because through both the poor speed of the new epg and the poor design and functionality achieving what you want takes a helluva lot longer than it used to, and than it should. So much so that its genuinely quicker and less frustrating to use the radio times than it is to use the epg.

Quote:

Now if you are in another room you can tell if a reminder has appeared. I use it if I'm getting some food. The sounds might be annoying to some but what would you have put there?

I'm not complaining about audible reminders. I'm just commenting on the fact that they could have put abit more thought into it and chosen more pleasing sounds, they are just ugly. Personally I don't use them.

Derek · 04-05-2004, 21:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nor

Its completely different.

On CR2 you had a list of all the channels. Moving down gave a listing of each channel. On CR3 you get a list of channels. Clicking right gives you the listings. Clicking left goes back to the channels.

I don't think two click counts as being completely different. You can also use the pageup/down buttons to jump down the listings and I find this the fastest way to use the new EPG.

I'd be interested to know what other people think of this compared to the old guide. I find it a LOT faster to use than the old method.

Nor · 04-05-2004, 21:35

Considering we're talking about viewing channel contents for the day it doesn't take much to be completely different. Perhaps I'm ott saying 'completely' as it is a slightly similar approach, but thats where the similarity ends.

Before you could find out what was on for basically the whole evening on a channel on the one screen, and then with one click see what was on the next channel at the same time of day. Now you have to right click to see only 5 programs, scroll through to find the time you want, then left click to get back to change the channel, change channel, then right click to get back to the 5 programs you can see, whereup the time is reset and you have to scroll back through the programs again.

It just seems we have 2 ways now of doing what 1 way did previously, and it was far superior and far quicker.

DeKurver · 04-05-2004, 22:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tristan

Now, aside for the fact you can't scroll up and down the channel list in 100s (which would be a bit odd with the new favourites system, and wouldn't really work with the goal of consistancy across all menus), what exactly is wrong with the fundemental design of it?

I don't think there's anything fundamentally wrong with it, and on the whole I'd say I'm happy with the upgrade, however the lack of page up/down in the Mini Guide is a real spoiler. It obvious that those who never used this feature don't miss it, but for those that did use it the Mini Guide has become a disappointment. Did you ever make use of page up/down pre-CR3 (I'm betting that you didn't, otherwise my theory is complete BS

)? I'd also say that the goal of the different menus should be to allow me to use the EPG quickly and efficiently, in as few clicks as possible. Obviously consistency is a desirable part of any UI, EPG or otherwise, as it reduces the amount of stuff the user needs to remeber, but it shouldn't be an absolute rule. For example, Sky's EPG is much more consistent in that up/down scrolls through channels in the main guide and the mini guide. Similarly, left/right scrolls though programmes on the current channel in both menus. I've always found this unintuitive and much prefer the more intuitive, but inconsistent, approach of using left/right to scroll though channels in the Mini Guide. Therefore, if left/right and up/down can behave differently then why not page up/down as well? IMHO the favourites system is an opt-in system; you shouldn't be forced to use it to be able to make efficient use of the Mini Guide.

davie_gla · 05-05-2004, 09:46

On the whole im happy with the new look/feel of the software. The only thing that bugs me is why create software that is slower than the old version?

Whenever Im in guide and scroll right for programmes more than 6 hours away all I get is 'programme information unavailable' and have to wait 2-3 minutes for this information to come through. It's frustrating and I eventually give up... meaning missing programmes I would have seen previouly.

I phoned cust. services this morning and they said the problem is that they are running two different software/guides just now and when migration to the new software is complete in the next month or so things will speed up 'dramatically'. Let's hope so!