[Update] BNP on Question Time this week

Originally Posted by Gary L

I know, I think we're trying to exclude the 'political correctness' out of the issues in hand.

You think, or you know? I think you don't know. The problem is Gary, you introduced political correctness to the discussion, but you still have yet to show you understand what it means or how it applies here.

Come on, step up to the plate and give us more than slogans. What do you want to say?

No Maggy he wasn't quizzed on anything current. what he was questioned on and was only to be expected was all the drivel he has come out with over the years and as it was the first time many of the public had a chance to question him on that was no surprise to me. How badly he handled it was a surprise to me i was sure he would have had some training before the show on dealing with things a lot better then he did or maybe is capable of handling.

Some people seem to feel he was victimised and bullied and i find that hilarious i really do when you don't have to look hard to see that those are things nick griffin and the bnp core membership are constantly doing to others. Seems it's ok for them to do it but heaven forbid they should ever be on the end of it themselves. He got a very easy ride last night compared to what he could have got and i agree the purpose of last nights show was not to show the bnp for what they are it was to show the nation what nick griffin is like out of his comfort zone you know that place most of us have to deal with often in our lives.

In future i hope the bnp are on more often then we can get to the truth of how capable they are on the real issues of the economy and other things that are just as important as the race area. But right now for anyone to say they now have greater support of the bnp after his appearence last night shows why were in the mess we are with politics if some of us are setting the bar so low for our support.

Personally for me who i admit was more likely to nail my head to a wall then ever vote\support the bnp i found his appearence to be anything but support worthy and showed him up as about as convincing a politician as a chocolate fireguard is for protecting me as fireguards are meant too. He has changed his views according to him on so many of the core thngs the bnp stands for that he clearly hasn't got a single bone of conviction in him.

I would rather someone be honest about their views however despicable i might find them, then have someone who clearly holds views and is scared to express them for the sake of votes he is no different to any of the others except of course the lengths his party would go to if we were ever stupid enough to vote them into power.

[Hiroki]

Originally Posted by Damien

Anyway. So:

• Gay people are 'creepy' (or public affections of their homosexuality is)

And Nick Griffin is complaining he is being victimised

A LOT of people think that public affection of homosexuality is creepy so he is right in that part at least

[Gary L]

Originally Posted by Chris

You think, or you know?

I think we're trying to exclude the 'political correctness' out of the issues in hand.

I think you don't know.

You think I don't know I think?

Come on, step up to the plate and give us more than slogans. What do you want to say?

Nothing I haven't really already said. I might have something to say later as the thread progresses.

---------- Post added at 16:11 ---------- Previous post was at 16:10 ----------

Originally Posted by Hiroki

A LOT of people think that public affection of homosexuality is creepy so he is right in that part at least

I thought that too when I heard him say it.

[alferret]

I found it rather good to watch. Thankfully Griffin isnt as charismatic as he would have himself believe but he did have some valid points and on the odd point came across slightly more forth coming than some of the other panelists.

I have also seen in todays papers and on the BBC news web site how some of his comments have been taken out of context & or the full sentence of his reply's havn't been used verbatim. Which from those media representitives is a pretty poor show.

We dont really need to know how friendly he is with the KKK or that he has changed his mind over the holocaust, what we need to know is if the BNP were to get any further than they are in the political arena would they do the right thing by all citizens of the UK, what the people really want or would they continue to use their soaring popularity to persue their own agenda.

Jack Straw was clutching at them, Barroness Warsi came across as the most competent of the panelists and the most articulate politcian on the panel. I didnt understand why Bonnie Greer was on the panel, never heard of her and although she talked a good arguement really shouldnt have been on there as she is not representative of the UK and not an elected party member. Chris Huhne seemed to sheepishly follow Warsi and Straw and was not strong enough in the comments he made apart from his condemnation of Jan Moir, totally wasted opportunity by the Lib Dems IMO.

I would like to see more of Griffin on shows like question time. All the other parties seems to get lots of air time and we have to endure them why should the BNP be singled out as a party that shouldnt have a voice when they have 2 ELECTED members of the EU parliament.

I dont think that Griffin shot himself in the foot by going on QT, he didnt seem comfortable with the studio and the audience but as this was his first foray into live TV debating he wasnt totally stupid, arrogant or ignorant.

And no I dont support the BNP, but I do support freedom of speech and expression and if that means more parties like the BNP getting airtime then so be it.

[Flyboy]

Originally Posted by Saaf_laandon_mo

I do think Griffin missed an opportunity last night. Surely he would have had an inkling as to what he would be asked, and rather than respond with "I have changed my mind" he should have presented coherent arguments for doing so, as opposed to just smirking. Everyone is entitled to change their mind about views and opinions that they had in the past, but you need to have good arguments for doing so.

Personally I think he could have been given a much harder ride to account his and his party's view. For example the views on disability that Rizzyking put forward in a previous post. The panel, given the short period of time they had, were focussing on his views regarding immigration and race, but they could have gone to task with other BNP policies which perhaps a lot of the audience are not aware off.

I don't think Griffin or the BNP benefited from his appearance yesterday, its a shame it wasn't a longer show, maybe with Paxman or Andrew Marr presenting it.

I fully agree. Even when given his "get out of jail free card," he still refused to answer the question about changing his mind. Which really begs the question, has he actually changed his mind (don't worry I am under no illusions as to whether he really has or not)?

Originally Posted by Gary L

You think I don't know I think?

I think we think we know that we think you don't think, even though you think you think you know you think, but you might not think you think you know you think.

Originally Posted by alferret

I have also seen in todays papers and on the BBC news web site how some of his comments have been taken out of context & or the full sentence of his reply's havn't been used verbatim. Which from those media representitives is a pretty poor show.

You seen the program? There is little taken out of contest although the 'defending' of the KKK was kind of badly worded. He did defend the leader of the KKK and unsuccessfully tried to make a joke out of the KKK which brought a stamming response from Greer.

We dont really need to know how friendly he is with the KKK or that he has changed his mind over the holocaust, what we need to know is if the BNP were to get any further than they are in the political arena would they do the right thing by all citizens of the UK, what the people really want or would they continue to use their soaring popularity to persue their own agenda.

Of course we need to know if he is friendly with the KKK! He is an elected representative in the European Parliament, a leader of a party with aspirations to get members into the British Parliament. Going to meet the KKK and being friendly with it's leader is important.

I didnt understand why Bonnie Greer was on the panel, never heard of her and although she talked a good arguement really shouldnt have been on there as she is not representative of the UK and not an elected party member.

They always have someone from the world of culture on the show. This time the politicians were overrepresented as it's usually 3 politicians and 2 from the world of culture/sport/business/religion/other social organisation. She was the best on the show so I am glad she was on.

I would like to see more of Griffin on shows like question time. All the other parties seems to get lots of air time and we have to endure them why should the BNP be singled out as a party that shouldnt have a voice when they have 2 ELECTED members of the EU parliament.

Because they only have 2. Parties get coverage relative to their position amongst the electorate and the BNP are still a minority party by a long way. The Greens and UKIP also don't find a lot of attention. I don't think the BNP deserve special treatment.

I dont think that Griffin shot himself in the foot by going on QT, he didnt seem comfortable with the studio and the audience but as this was his first foray into live TV debating he wasnt totally stupid, arrogant or ignorant.

He didn't come across the way he wanted too. His explanation of changing his mind on the Holocaust was poor as was his (lack) of explanation into why a senior member of his party said Churchill was a traitor for fighting other white nationalists (Hitler).

And no I dont support the BNP, but I do support freedom of speech and expression and if that means more parties like the BNP getting airtime then so be it.

Freedom of Speech does not equate to a free platform. I have freedom speech but couldn't be on Question Time because of my insignificance and lack of interesting things to say.

[Flyboy]

Originally Posted by Mr Angry

You thought wrong.

Dimbleby:

Have you actually changed your mind or because the law says you cant say these things.

Griffin:

I have changed my mind, a lot of it is about figures, one of the key things that have changed my mind was the British radio intercepts of German radio transmissions, about the brutal mass murder of innocent Jews in Eastern front during anti-partisan warfare, which changes the figures very greatly.

(Apologies for any inaccuracies, but the gist is there)

BBCi 19:58

Although it does appear to be somewhat ambiguous, I am inclined to believe he is still saying that only four hundred Jews were killed.

[Saaf_laandon_mo]

Originally Posted by Flyboy

Dimbleby:

BBCi 19:58

Although it does appear to be somewhat ambiguous, I am inclined to believe he is still saying that only four hundred Jews were killed.

That's what I thought his overall conclusion was i.e. he belives that Jews were killed , but a much smaller number. I also got the opinion that he still thinks concentration camps are a myth.

The most positive reaction he received was when he 'discussed' Islam. I do feel that the BNP's future strategy will be to tone down on the blatant racism (i.e. make Britain white) angle and concentrate on, as he put's it, Islam's incompatibility with the west and base his immigration arguments against that.

[Dai]

Originally Posted by alferret

Jack Straw was clutching at them, Barroness Warsi came across as the most competent of the panelists and the most articulate politcian on the panel. I didnt understand why Bonnie Greer was on the panel, never heard of her and although she talked a good arguement really shouldnt have been on there as she is not representative of the UK and not an elected party member. Chris Huhne seemed to sheepishly follow Warsi and Straw and was not strong enough in the comments he made apart from his condemnation of Jan Moir, totally wasted opportunity by the Lib Dems IMO.

I pretty much agree with all of this. For me Baroness Warsi was the surprise. She was articulate, logical and incisive. She managed in her few sentences to put down both Straw and Griffin. I found her delightful.

Dimbleby should be ashamed of himself. Allowing the mob to run riot has almost certainly gained Griffin some sympathy in certain circles. I feel he and the BBC managed to shoot themselves in the foot.

[TheDaddy]

Originally Posted by TheDaddy

Bullying has never gone down well in this country and I can see the BNP getting an upsurge of support over the next couple of weeks

The staggeringly biased lynch mob Question Time broadcast on BBC 1 has turned into the single biggest recruitment night in the British National Party’s history, with no less than 3,000 new people registering to be signed up as members when the current court-ordered recruitment freeze ends.


From the BNP's website

Originally Posted by TheDaddy

The staggeringly biased lynch mob Question Time broadcast on BBC 1 has turned into the single biggest recruitment night in the British National Party’s history, with no less than 3,000 new people registering to be signed up as members when the current court-ordered recruitment freeze ends.


From the BNP's website

That was going to happen anyway. The type of people who would actually sign up to be a member would be those already strongly in favour of them and thus trying to make a point about the criticism he received. He could have gone on there are called for death camps and their recruitment would have gone up.

His performance last night would not be enough to convince moderates. I mean his performance was not probably good enough to cause people to leave the BNP but there was nothing last night that would encourage people unless they are massive KKK fans or also suspect the Holocaust was a lie.

[Gary L]

Originally Posted by Damien

The type of people who would actually sign up to be a member would be those already strongly in favour of them and thus trying to make a point about the criticism he received.

unless they are massive KKK fans or also suspect the Holocaust was a lie.

You make it sound like you have to be a racist to vote the BNP.
I'm sure the kind of people you have described are most probably already a supporter.

---------- Post added at 17:48 ---------- Previous post was at 17:46 ----------

Originally Posted by foreverwar

I think we think we know that we think you don't think, even though you think you think you know you think, but you might not think you think you know you think.

I'll have what he's not sniffing up his nose

[SB_07]

So Griffin called it "a lynch mob" and he's cool with the KKK? Oh the irony.