Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]

[Cobbydaler]

Originally Posted by Dephormation

Reminder
Home Secretary Jacqui Smith will be in Downing Street on 17 April for a live webchat from 14:00 BST.
http://www.number10.gov.uk/output/Page15259.asp

Wonderful, when any normal working person can't quiz her...

[OF1975]

OK having watched the videos of Simon Davies and Kent Ertegrul I am deeply irritated. Not by Simon Davies but by Kent. I am going to watch the video of Richard Clayton then Alexander and then I am going to go to bed and get some sleep and mull it over for a bit tomorrow before posting again. Nite all.

[serial]

After seeing Simon in person I truly believe in his integrity. What I believe the view is is that the "markets will decide", i.e. the people, this change in direction is greed driven but is untested(other than secretly). BT et al are most likely going opt-in, so they have have to encourage people to do that. As we have seen, 10 years ago we were fighting to keep pop up ads down, pop under ads off it was hell for everyone on the web. The public have seen the damage done by adware/spyware companies, almost everyone now has some form of anti-adware/spyware on their PC, most come preinstalled. I saw the blog yesterday from f-secure saying they are already developing anti-phorm cookie technology. The public don't like and don't want this kind of intrusive technology. I believe that it will fail in the market if it doesn't fail in the courts first. Yes Simon is fraternising with the enemy, but lets not forget that at the end of the day he is also working for us.

[Cobbydaler]

Originally Posted by serial

After seeing Simon in person I truly believe in his integrity. What I believe the view is is that the "markets will decide", i.e. the people, this change in direction is greed driven but is untested(other than secretly). BT et al are most likely going opt-in, so they have have to encourage people to do that. As we have seen, 10 years ago we were fighting to keep pop up ads down, pop under ads off it was hell for everyone on the web. The public have seen the damage done by adware/spyware companies, almost everyone now has some form of anti-adware/spyware on their PC, most come preinstalled. I saw the blog yesterday from f-secure saying they are already developing anti-phorm cookie technology. The public don't like and don't want this kind of intrusive technology. I believe that it will fail in the market if it doesn't fail in the courts first. Yes Simon is fraternising with the enemy, but lets not forget that at the end of the day he is also working for us.

The actual quote from the f-secure blog:

Because the technology uses a cookie to identity each user, most antivirus vendors have the possibility of creating a signature and can wipe the tracks of monitored interests. Based on the descriptions of the deployment (opt-out) and the technology we lean towards creating such a detection signature for the cookie. The same stance has been given by many other security vendors and we all pull for a secure opt-in solution.

[JackSon]

Originally Posted by Dephormation

Reminder
Home Secretary Jacqui Smith will be in Downing Street on 17 April for a live webchat from 14:00 BST.
http://www.number10.gov.uk/output/Page15259.asp

Originally Posted by Cobbydaler

Wonderful, when any normal working person can't quiz her...

With Jacqui's history with the internet exhibit A, it could well be teatime before she's got her webcam logged on.

On an on topic note - thanks for the videos, CaptJamie. Just what the doctor ordered.

[OldBear]

Originally Posted by CaptJamieHunter

OK, last night's meeting... If anyone did get a recording of the group discussion I'd love to see it.

Colossal post! Many thanks for the excellent videos.

My opinion, if anyone is interested:
Alexander: well done, sir; given the short notice you had for this you did an excellent job.
Richard Clayton: agreed with just about everything he said; this is downright illegal in my opinion, too.
Kent E: wouldn't trust this man as far as I could throw him.

Here's the bit a lot of people won't like. I'm still not completely convinced by Simon Davies/80-20 Thinking; I'm troubled by his comments that there can be a way to make this work. Returning to his words I quoted earlier about Google/Doubleclick, I just can't see how he can say what he said about that deal, yet feel that the DPI system that Phorm/Webwise propose could be/can be acceptable. JMHO.

OB

[bigsanta11]

http://www.pcadvisor.co.uk/news/index.cfm?newsid=12751

Quite a long and one sided view,and if i hadn't been correctly informed by the cf ,i'd see phorm as not something to worry about.

[unicus]

Originally Posted by OldBear

Here's the bit a lot of people won't like. I'm still not completely convinced by Simon Davies/80-20 Thinking; I'm troubled by his comments that there can be a way to make this work. Returning to his words I quoted earlier about Google/Doubleclick, I just can't see how he can say what he said about that deal, yet feel that the DPI system that Phorm/Webwise propose could be/can be acceptable. JMHO.

I've just watched Simon's bit (I'll watch the rest in the morning) but I'm not sure how you came to the conclusion that he thinks Phorm's system as proposed is acceptable. He seems to me to be saying that a system could be devised that would be acceptable and within the law that would enable Phorm to do business. And I think he's right and IMO would have to start with 'no interception without explicit consent from all parties in the data exchange'. This would be difficult to implement, is not what is currently proposed and I think - well pretty much know - would not work as a profitable business model so Phorm would phail.

[tdadyslexia]

Originally Posted by CaptJamieHunter

[big snip]
Thanks again to Simon for organising the meeting, Dr Richard Clayton and Alexander for speaking so well. If anyone did get a recording of the group discussion I'd love to see it.

Here Here, and thank you for puting up the Video of the meeting.

Everybody types faster than me, it suks been Dyslexic!

[Bonglet]

Watched the interview's taken by CaptJamieHunter nice work btw

Just quickly add my comments about persons in it

Simon Davies - Still concerned like others and not sure what he's trying to prove as even he himself must be concerned if hes a privacy expert and has heard other experts view on the matter - i feel sorry for him actually after signing the contract for this episode before he actually knew of phorms past as 121 media. (One of phorms Competitors leaked the link - Possibly Nebuad)
Hope you come out of this with your reputation intact simon wouldnt want that company to drag me down.

Kent - Same old product wish wash and people trying to buy into his flawed idea of illegal interception is good for buisness (i guess it is for those that pay you and not for those you could eventually blacklist by ruling the garden gate) backed up by no actual independent verified proof.

Dr Richard Clayton - Absoloute Star (This Guy And Alexander would be welcome to pay me a visit anytime as are both very genuine) i may have got mixed up with him in prievous post sorry about that deepest apologies again i was tired (got a 1 year old daughter teething away atm and had no sleep at all and was reading so much phorm stuff and alexanders finished report my brain went to mush - Must stop using forums as instant messenger sometimes to get flamed for it ).
Pity that the phorm pr team were planted to heckle the guy.

Alexander - Put everyone's views across perfectlly very well done and loved the people in to products comparison (Lets not forget phorms previous product as 121 media called people on paper - Same idea and vision to illegally spy and serve ads - different deployment)
Massive thanks from all Alexander .

Very well done to all keep up with getting the message out.

[popper]

Originally Posted by PhormUKPRteam

Greetings Bonglet
... For the record, I think at present about three members of the Phorm UK PR effort will be present tonight. Personally speaking I won't be and neither will other team members I know.

<snip some unimportant stuff>

And as for your suspicion that he is not an expert take a look at http://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/~rnc1/ - the man's CV is outstanding.
As always, if you want any more information, check out

this thread, its just full of interesting facts; so your staging/staged the classic silence treatment and staying away because your friends in the group dont personally agree with the cause, good for you and your fellows, although it was a public meeting for the stake holders and you are, we assume, effected too, you are in the UK right, with an effected isp? so were more than within your rights to attend;anyway we did see your brave stance against your paymaster, and applaud you for it, please dont go holding it agains those 3 fellows after all they may have had no choice but to work and so couldnt join your workers revolution

[ceedee]

Originally Posted by unicus

I've just watched Simon's bit (I'll watch the rest in the morning) but I'm not sure how you came to the conclusion that he thinks Phorm's system as proposed is acceptable. He seems to me to be saying that a system could be devised that would be acceptable and within the law that would enable Phorm to do business. And I think he's right and IMO would have to start with 'no interception without explicit consent from all parties in the data exchange'. This would be difficult to implement, is not what is currently proposed and I think - well pretty much know - would not work as a profitable business model so Phorm would phail.

So on that basis, what do you think Simon's PIA is going to say?

[Barkotron]

Ho ho - the Channel 4 page is excellent, I particularly like the title: http://www.channel4.com/news/article...+phorm/2023952

Also, whoever posted that FoxNews page, that's great stuff: Phorm should be forced to link to that page from their consent requesting popup so people really do have "fully informed consent"...

[Ravenheart]

I was having a tidy up this morning, and I found my dvd of a film called Taking Liberties, anyone who has any interest in the erosion of our rights here in the UK it's well worth watching and touches on all aspects of law that Blair and his cronies pushed through and it's effect on NORMAL people.

I got to know about the film through another forum I'm a member of, and after seeing it frankly I was shocked, and why I'm so strongly opposed to Phorm, we have to take a stand.

Official Site here: http://www.noliberties.com/

And it's available on dvd for under a fiver from Amazon.

Thanks to Captn Jaime for uploading the vids, I'll have a watch of them shortly.

[OF1975]

Just want to say thanks to CaptJamie for uploading the vids. I have watched them all but am still taking time to digest everything that I saw and heard. Anyone have any information on when the professionally filmed version will be posted?