Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]

[dav]

Originally Posted by flashpaul

Well done Alexander ,

When you get up I think you should look at this reply (copied from VM newsgroups)

Reply from EU Information, Society & Media Commissioner Viviane Reding
<snip>

I've already posted this, along with source clarifications and subsequent caveats. (Posts 3481, 3485, 3496, 3511 and 3517)
However, there is a good chance Alexander could miss these due to last nights activity so it doesn't hurt to reiterate.

Anyway, this was taken from a personal reply to an email. We really need to see it on an EU headed web page.

[The Jackal]

Originally Posted by TehTech

YOU even THINK of allowing these spyware peddling criminals into your buildings to install this crud and YOU WILL BE TAKEN TO COURT AND SUED SO DAMN HARD

Yet again the British are all mouth and no action that's why you're always walked over.

There are 1000 votes here, if everyone were to pledge £500 we could make a go of this.

[roadrunner69]

I think last night will probably be a watershed in this whole issue.

The fears of many that phorm had something up their sleeves in
this PR meeting have come to nothing.

The case was presented clearly and eloquently by Dr Clayton and
Alexander and, just as importantly, the audience. in front of what
we hope will be national media coverage

Maybe, just maybe kent may be getting the message that this
massive invasion of our privacy WILL NOT BE TOLERATED.

Once again many, many thanks to Alexander
People who have his drive, passion, knowledge and eloquence
(not to mention his seeming ability to go days without sleep), do not
appear in society very often and we are so lucky to have found this man
in our midst.

[ceedee]

Originally Posted by The Jackal

Yet again the British are all mouth and no action that's why you're always walked over.
There are 1000 votes here, if everyone were to pledge £500 we could make a go of this.

Oh we seem to be doing pretty well in our customary amateur and cheapskate way!
But if you've got £500 to spare, I'm sure Alexander or Privacy International would be very appreciative...

[Dephormation]

Originally Posted by AlexanderHanff

With regards all this talk of donations, there really is no need. However, if people really do want to make donations, I will use them to buy some books I need for my Masters and the offers are very much appreciated

Please Alexander, set up an Amazon Wish List. Put all the books you need on it, and publish the address. Its a ten minute job.

The books will be yours in an hour, I'm absolutely certain of it.

Pete

Amazon Wish Lists

[TehTech]

Originally Posted by The Jackal

Yet again the British are all mouth and no action that's why you're always walked over.

There are 1000 votes here, if everyone were to pledge £500 we could make a go of this.

Plezase do not attack me, if you're fine with VM, then so be it, but DONT have a go at people for different oppinions than yourself!!

You talk about paying, would YOU be prepaired to pay £500?? I say to that you are VERY lucky if you have a spare £500!!!

What about people on low incomes or single families???

Wake up please!

Is it the customers fault that virgin (and NTL previously) are in such amount of debt???

If i owed a quarter of what they owe, I'd be taken to court & declaired bankrupt, knowing english law, I'd probably spend a few years inside too, so dont try using that as it is not our fault, WE should NOT have to bail virgin out of their problems, no way on your nelly matey!

[The Jackal]

Originally Posted by TehTech

Plezase do not attack me, if you're fine with VM, then so be it, but DONT have a go at people for different oppinions than yourself!!

You talk about paying, would YOU be prepaired to pay £500?? I say to that you are VERY lucky if you have a spare £500!!!

What about people on low incomes or single families???

Wake up please!

Is it the customers fault that virgin (and NTL previously) are in such amount of debt???

If i owed a quarter of what they owe, I'd be taken to court & declaired bankrupt, knowing english law, I'd probably spend a few years inside too, so dont try using that as it is not our fault, WE should NOT have to bail virgin out of their problems, no way on your nelly matey!

No you read me wrong. The funds gathered would be used for legal action. Once we get say 50K together we'll soon get pledges/offers from individuals with more clout.

And yes I would pledge £500 as a matter of principal even though I'm neutral to this whole 'phorm' issue that people are crying wolf about.

Sorry I wasn't attacking you directly just the general consensus

[OF1975]

Originally Posted by The Jackal

{ snip }
And yes I would pledge £500 as a matter of principal even though I'm neutral to this whole 'phorm' issue that people are crying wolf about. [my added emphasis]

Sorry I wasn't attacking you directly just the general consensus

Crying wolf? Excuse me? You may not care about these issues but a lot of us do and a lot of us see this as a threat not just for what it is right now but for what uses it could be put to later on down the line. The much discussed issue of function creep. I don't accept that people are crying wolf on this.

[TehTech]

Originally Posted by OF1975

Crying wolf? Excuse me? You may not care about these issues but a lot of us do and a lot of us see this as a threat not just for what it is right now but for what uses it could be put to later on down the line. The much discussed issue of function creep. I don't accept that people are crying wolf on this.

[The Jackal]

Originally Posted by OF1975

Crying wolf? Excuse me? You may not care about these issues but a lot of us do and a lot of us see this as a threat not just for what it is right now but for what uses it could be put to later on down the line. The much discussed issue of function creep. I don't accept that people are crying wolf on this.

What's the threat here ? Are you under attack from terrorism ?

What exactly are you scared of when much more sophisticated eavesdropping technology already exists and is being used.

[LondonChris]

Originally Posted by The Jackal

What exactly are you scared of when much more sophisticated eavesdropping technology already exists and is being used.

That's funny, you sound just like Kent did last night, "Look at what everyone else is doing, they're worse!!!11!!!"

[OF1975]

The threat is to our privacy, our right to not have our communications UNLAWFULLY intercepted. The fact that our clickstream data is going to be auctioned off to the highest bidder. Its the thin edge of the wedge. I just knew you were going to bring up the issue of terrorism.

Heres the point. If the government/MI5 etc wants to do what phorm is going to be doing (intercepting communications) then they have to get a court order to do so. Phorm plans to do this by default just in order to push adverts.

[LondonChris]

A couple of points that I didn't get to make last night at the meeting last night.

1. I think the earlier poster is quite right, it's unfair to say "the general public thinks x". The general public at the moment doesn't know their phorm from their elbow (although that will change). "The technical community" would have been a more accurate phrase.

It is worth noting however that the technical community tend to be one of the bedrocks on which the general public computing experience sits - have a problem with your internet connection? don't understand this phorm thing? printer not working? Who do you speak to? Your local techie.

2. The whole "honouring robots.txt is implied consent to interception" is utter ******** and made me really quite cross, just because I want my pages to be accessible and searchable easily DOES NOT mean that I consent to a third party intercepting the transmission of those pages.

To use an analogy (no cars!), if I'm handing out a bunch of different leaflets, anyone is more than welcome to take whatever leaflets they like. It is no-one's business however (other than mine and Joe Bloggs), what specific leaflets Joe Bloggs decides to take from me.

3. Choice.

Choice was mentioned a lot by Kurt, choice on having cookies stored for ages, choice to have your web browsing profiled by IP address from a number of sites. Yes there is choice, there is the choice to use a service or to not use it. When an ISP employs phorm, the choice in having data intercepted vanishes. Therefore my next choice will be to use a Phorm-free ISP.

Chris

[The Jackal]

If you feel so passionately about the subject then

" DO SOMETHING REAL ABOUT IT "

Crying wolf on public forums doesn't really help nor does a petition with a handful of sigatures.

[LondonChris]

Originally Posted by The Jackal

If you feel so passionately about the subject then

" DO SOMETHING REAL ABOUT IT "

Like go to a public meeting to voice your discontent?