Unstoppable migration?

[Osem]

The fiscal impact of immigration and the real impact of illegal immigration and abuse of the asylum system are not the only issues of concern here. There's an increasing security issue here, not to mention the message being sent out to the world's poor that if you find yourself some traffickers you'll eventually get what you want - a new life in Europe. Of course traffickers aren't renowned for telling the whole awful truth to their clients and those clients are only too willing to believe a better life can be had elsewhere - hence the bodies floating in the Med. It's an awful situation.

[mrmistoffelees]

Originally Posted by Osem

The fiscal impact of immigration and the real impact of illegal immigration and abuse of the asylum system are not the only issues of concern here. There's an increasing security issue here, not to mention the message being sent out to the world's poor that if you find yourself some traffickers you'll eventually get what you want - a new life in Europe. Of course traffickers aren't renowned for telling the whole awful truth to their clients and those clients are only too willing to believe a better life can be had elsewhere - hence the bodies floating in the Med. It's an awful situation.

Is there, can you back this security risk up with some statistics?


Are you implying that most immigrants have criminal tendencies?

[Osem]

Originally Posted by heero_yuy

They're as bad as the migrants for milking the system.

Well a nice bit of uncontrolled migration plus a sprinkle of asylum abuse is a nice little earner for these people.

What do people honestly think would happen were we to offer an amnesty to the economic migrants in Calais? I have a sneaking suspicion that it might just serve as an inducement for more to come and try their luck. Just a thought...

[mrmistoffelees]

Originally Posted by Osem

Well a nice bit of uncontrolled migration plus a sprinkle of asylum abuse is a nice little earner for these people.

What do people honestly think would happen were we to offer an amnesty to the economic migrants in Calais? I have a sneaking suspicion that it might just serve as an inducement for more to come and try their luck. Just a thought...

They're all economic migrants? Source? Or, are you making yet another sweeping generalisation?

[Osem]

France is to send 120 extra police officers to Calais as the migrant crisis there continues.

Migrants attempting to reach Britain told the BBC they would continue to try to enter the Channel Tunnel, despite one man dying on Tuesday night.

Severe delays are affecting travellers. Operation Stack is expected to continue into the weekend with more than 3,600 lorries currently queuing on the M20.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-33709244

There's not much point having more police there if all they're doing is removing illegals from the so called security area then letting them try again repeatedly and indefinitely.

[Arthurgray50@blu]

This scenario is like a major circle. We have Theresa May saying - sadly there are some migrants that have entered the UK.
Then we have a ex customs officers saying on the radio this morning, that France has more police officers then the MPS, so why cant they do more.

I totally agree, France is being given OUR tax money, to build fencing on the Calais side.

How can you stop migrants from getting into the tunnel if they are that determined.
Remember, British Lorry drivers are being FINED, if migrants are caught on the vehicles
I have a suggestion - those useless water cannons that that Berk Boris, bought. Send them over, and douse them with water. And go in hard.

The Government have been saying for months - that they will something about this problem - are they hell.

Its no good building fences, put some electrified fences up with 'low voltage' so they wont do it again - similar to cows in a field.

[heero_yuy]

Originally Posted by Arthurgray50@blu

Its no good building fences, put some electrified fences up with 'low voltage' so they wont do it again - similar to cows in a field.

No, link the fences up to the overhead lines: 25,000 volts and they definitely won't do it again.

[Osem]

If this wasn't so serious it'd be laughable. A hundred illegal immigrants made it through the tunnel last night. How's that for security? These people are in France - they're no longer running from anything and the only risk to the lives is their own decision making.

[Jimmy-J]

There's lots of benefits waiting for them here, no wonder they're risking life and limb to get them, and they'll probably get them.

There are benefits in France too. Their reasoning for coming here seems to be a mix of a incorrect perception of the scale of the benefits, the language and generally a quite tolerant society.

We have to think carefully how to solve this problem. We need to work with the French but ideally we need to deal with the problem at source. I mean it's all very well building more fencing but then they'll just walk further and camp nearer. If we build a fence all around France they'll camp outside France. The worst case scenario is that the French tell us to take our border back to Dover and we can't process security on the French side.

[Osem]

Originally Posted by Damien

There are benefits in France too. Their reasoning for coming here seems to be a mix of a incorrect perception of the scale of the benefits, the language and generally a quite tolerant society.

We have to think carefully how to solve this problem. We need to work with the French but ideally we need to deal with the problem at source. I mean it's all very well building more fencing but then they'll just walk further and camp nearer. If we build a fence all around France they'll camp outside France. The worst case scenario is that the French tell us to take our border back to Dover and we can't process security on the French side.

I believe there's a far larger black economy in the UK and that it's far harder to work illegally and exist 'unofficially' in France.

Originally Posted by Osem

I believe there's a far larger black economy in the UK and that it's far harder to work illegally and exist 'unofficially' in France.

Good point. Not sure how easy it is in France but they do have ID cards so that might help.

Either way someone needs to take leadership and deal with this problem. We're saying they're in France so it's France's problem and they're saying they want to get to Britain so it's our problem as both sides do token gestures while the camps sit there and more travel across Europe to get to it.

Something needs to be done but what that is clearly stumps both Governments. Ideally France would better control the borders but that seems unrealistic given the size of it and they would need to break out of the cross-border deal they have with other EU nations.

Answers on a postcard....

[TheDaddy]

Originally Posted by Damien

Good point. Not sure how easy it is in France but they do have ID cards so that might help.

Either way someone needs to take leadership and deal with this problem. We're saying they're in France so it's France's problem and they're saying they want to get to Britain so it's our problem as both sides do token gestures while the camps sit there and more travel across Europe to get to it.

Something needs to be done but what that is clearly stumps both Governments. Ideally France would better control the borders but that seems unrealistic given the size of it and they would need to break out of the cross-border deal they have with other EU nations.

Answers on a postcard....

The simplest solutions would be french detention centres for those trying to sneak in and the most draconian punishments for businesses in this country that employ illegals up to including jailing business owners and confiscating their assets, the proceeds of which could be used to pay our share towards the french detention centres.

Originally Posted by TheDaddy

The simplest solutions would be french detention centres for those trying to sneak in and the most draconian punishments for businesses in this country that employ illegals up to including jailing business owners and confiscating their assets, the proceeds of which could be used to pay our share towards the french detention centres.

Seems rather inhumane and even then you can't keep them in detention centres forever. I think we need to stop the trafficking at it's source somehow, even if that means boots on the ground in Northern Libya, introduce non-biometric ID cards in the UK for work (I don't really see this is illiberal) and then take the Calais immigrants and distribute them across Europe with a focus on states which hitherto haven't had a lot of immigration.

None of these seem easy but we have to address this in a more pragmatic and substantive way then just building more fences. We have to do it sooner rather than later before the French decide we can't have the border at Calais anymore too.

[heero_yuy]

Andy Burnham, who is in the running to become next Labour leader, was quick to criticise the PM’s words.

He wrote on Twitter: “Cameron calling Calais migrants a “swarm” is nothing short of disgraceful.

The open door immigration party speaks up. They're responsible for making the UK a magnet to every chancer who wants a better life. Hypocrites.