[Merged] Prison for Council Tax Protest Pensioner

[NitroNutter]

The irony is she will not pay her 53£ on principle which is fair play imo. Taxation in the UK is unfair, if more followed her exemplary example the government would be up **** creek. Any way it is now going to cost you as well Punky being the idilic taxpayer at least £300 in prison care, and thats without any extra care she may need with her ill health and special dietry needs. Still you lot carry on sucking up to the candidates on polling day, its your funerul, they will screw you all over and over again, telling you you have untold freedom in Britain which in reality is ther biggest load of BS ever to be told, still most people will allways believe the propoganda spread about by the authorities and media when in reality they own your asses, all the way to the grave.

[Chrysalis]

Originally Posted by littld

My income has stayed pretty much the same for the last 3 years. My bills keep going up. I have to carry on living within my means. I don't see whay this woman should be allowed to get away with it. Before anyone starts defending the suffering pensioners, remember that young people today will almost certainly be worse off when they retire than pensioners are now.

Well think about it, if they get away with it now it sets a standard for the future and gives them the licence to treat more the same.

Its quite simple really, By not paying for whatever reason, she is breaking the law, that is punishable by a jail sentence. Whats the problem?

I dont earn much money, and I have to pay for prescriptions, council tax, mortgage or rent, income tax, savings tax, road tax, fuel tax. I have to pay for household bills, so can I refuse to pay because my wages dont increas in line with council tax increases?

[orangebird]

Originally Posted by timewarrior2001

Its quite simple really, By not paying for whatever reason, she is breaking the law, that is punishable by a jail sentence. Whats the problem?

I dont earn much money, and I have to pay for prescriptions, council tax, mortgage or rent, income tax, savings tax, road tax, fuel tax. I have to pay for household bills, so can I refuse to pay because my wages dont increas in line with council tax increases?

You're 29 and presuming you're of decent health, you can go get a second job to help with the increases you face. I very much doubt a pensioner of 73 has quite so much choice. I still can't believe that people who cause GBH, or any kind of assault can get off with a crappy CS order, but they send a 73 year old lady to jail. Lunacy.

[me283]

I think jail should be for people who are a danger to society; this woman clearly isn't. I also think jail should be for repeat offenders; I don't believe this woman is. Thirdly, I think prison should be to teach people discipline and respect; I think this lady showed a large measure of both.

Yes, she broke the law, and yes, she should suffer for it. But surely there must be some more fitting punishment? Especially when (as has been mentioned) offenders far more deserving of jail are given more lenient sentences/punishments.

The thing that amazes me is the apparent gusto with which the council have pursued this woman. It would be nice if they were so dilligent in their everyday duties...

Originally Posted by orangebird

You're 29 and presuming you're of decent health, you can go get a second job to help with the increases you face. I very much doubt a pensioner of 73 has quite so much choice. I still can't believe that people who cause GBH, or any kind of assault can get off with a crappy CS order, but they send a 73 year old lady to jail. Lunacy.

But I would still go to jail for not paying council tax, and I wouldnt have to be a repeat offender. And why should I take a second job, pay more income tax, pay more savings tax, more fuel tax just to cover the increase in council tax?

[punky]

What are they going to gain from this? This pensioner stood up for her rights and it stinks to high heaven that she's been jailed.

Originally Posted by NitroNutter

Any way it is now going to cost you as well Punky being the idilic taxpayer at least £300 in prison care, and thats without any extra care she may need with her ill health and special dietry needs.

The point is that noone is above the law, I don't care how old they are, what gender they are, or what principles that stand up for. In the eyes of justice, we are all equal.

OK, so let her get away with it. Pretty soon every pensioner will start doing it. It will cost us a damn sight more then won't it? Hell, let's the the 50 year old pensioners get away with it. Pretty soon everyone will be at it.

OR, because she's old, lets not send us to jail. Look over there, there is a 73 year old paedophile. He's old, on a pension, shall we let him off the hook too? Not quite. The law is there for everyone, and everyone should follow it, no exceptions. I don't care if you are an old woman, or a young male copper. Noone is above the law

[orangebird]

Originally Posted by punky

snip

OR, because she's old, lets not send us to jail. Look over there, there is a 73 year old paedophile. He's old, on a pension, shall we let him off the hook too? Not quite. The law is there for everyone, and everyone should follow it, no exceptions. I don't care if you are an old woman, or a young male copper. Noone is above the law

Punky, if you seriously think you can sensibly compare a paedophile with a pensioner that refused to pay the increase in her council tax, you really do need to get a grip.

[punky]

Originally Posted by me283

I think jail should be for people who are a danger to society; this woman clearly isn't. I also think jail should be for repeat offenders; I don't believe this woman is. Thirdly, I think prison should be to teach people discipline and respect; I think this lady showed a large measure of both.

What would be a suitable non-custodial sentence for her though mate? Another fine? If you do, and she doesn't pay that, which she probably won't, then she'll end up in jail anyway (and for more than 7 days probably). You could give her a community service order, but I think finding her a CS position could be quite hard.

The thing that amazes me is the apparent gusto with which the council have pursued this woman. It would be nice if they were so dilligent in their everyday duties...

Agreed. I know for a fact that there are families that are fairly well off that get away with worse. Neither should, but the council should get their priorities right anyway.
__________________

Originally Posted by orangebird

Punky, if you seriously think you can sensibly compare a paedophile with a pensioner that refused to pay the increase in her council tax, you really do need to get a grip.

The point is noone is above the law, in case you missed it the last 3 times I said it. It doesn't matter how serious or how trivial the crime. Its still a crime, and it still carries a punishment.

OK, so a pensioner gets caught speeding, we let them off because they are old? Parking tickets? We let them off those because they are old? When exactly do you become old, and so above the law?

[me283]

Originally Posted by punky

What would be a suitable non-custodial sentence for her though mate? Another fine? If you do, and she doesn't pay that, which she probably won't, then she'll end up in jail anyway (and for more than 7 days probably). You could give her a community service order, but I think finding her a CS position could be quite hard.

Well, by the sounds of it she's not on her uppers; so I would have thought that bailiffs could recover sufficient assets to cover the debt? Not an ideal scenario, but a lot less unsavoury than prison IMO.

[orangebird]

Originally Posted by punky

<snip>

The point is noone is above the law, in case you missed it the last 3 times I said it. It doesn't matter how serious or how trivial the crime. Its still a crime, and it still carries a punishment.

OK, so a pensioner gets caught speeding, we let them off because they are old? Parking tickets? We let them off those because they are old? When exactly do you become old, and so above the law?

AFAIK, no-one with a speeding or parking ticket has been sent to jail.... I haven't missed that she's not above the law. But a jail sentence is ridiculous.

[punky]

Well, by the sounds of it she's not on her uppers; so I would have thought that bailiffs could recover sufficient assets to cover the debt? Not an ideal scenario, but a lot less unsavoury than prison IMO.

Yes, but only in this circume stance. Its a bit like shutting the door after the horse has bolted. She might have means to recover the debt, but if others follow her lead, they might not. The point is to discourage others from following her example with a harsh punishment. I won't say its not harsh on her, but she knew what she was doing, deliberately sticking a finger up at the law, DPP and justice in general. What did she expect?

You could give her a suspended sentence, but she probably still wouldn't pay the council tax and end up in jail anyway.

Originally Posted by orangebird

AFAIK, no-one with a speeding or parking ticket has been sent to jail.... I haven't missed that she's not above the law. But a jail sentence is ridiculous.

Firstly, a speeding ticket is a fine. Non-payment of a fine almost always follows with a custodial sentence. A parking ticket is civil, so the rules are different, but she'd still be held accountable. See first paragraph.

[Pierre]

Although I can't advocate people taking it upon themselves to not pay taxes, I have the upmost sympathy for pensioners and their tax burden and I think something needs to be done about it.

If it was me, in her position, I'd probably do the same.

[SMHarman]

Originally Posted by Pierre

Although I can't advocate people taking it upon themselves to not pay taxes, I have the upmost sympathy for pensioners and their tax burden and I think something needs to be done about it.

If it was me, in her position, I'd probably do the same.

Am I right in thinking that the sentance will thus extinguish the debt, her debt being paid by the custodial sentence?
If we are not careful many pensioners may start considering this with the target to be in prision during February and save on the winter fuel costs.

[Pierre]

Originally Posted by SMHarman

Am I right in thinking that the sentance will thus extinguish the debt, her debt being paid by the custodial sentence?
If we are not careful many pensioners may start considering this with the target to be in prision during February and save on the winter fuel costs.

No the debt will remain.