British Steel bill to save Scunthorpe

Originally Posted by Paul

As a fuel to make the steel, maybe.
However, you also need carbon to create the steel itself.
That carbon also (normally) comes from the coke.
As best I can tell, its not impossible to use other sources of carbon, but none are as common.

Of course, "Net Zero" is a far off (and currently unrealisitc) fantasy anyway.

In virgin steel production at Scunthorpe the coke provides some of the heat as well as the source of carbon. They also seem to use some unmodified coal in the process.

Virgin steel production without coke is possible, apparently they do it in Iran and India, and there are newer methods which aren’t commercialised yet, but any of these would require the steelworks to be rebuilt.

So we now have emergency ship-loads of coking coal and iron ore heading to the UK from the USA and Australia, with some apparently likely to come from Japan as well, and no doubt we paid top-tier prices for it to make sure it doesn’t get diverted anywhere else en route.

I wonder whether Friends of the Earth still think they scored a win by preventing it being mined in Cumbria and delivered to Scunthorpe by train, a mere 300 miles away?

[Pierre]

Originally Posted by Chris

So we now have emergency ship-loads of coking coal and iron ore heading to the UK from the USA and Australia, with some apparently likely to come from Japan as well, and no doubt we paid top-tier prices for it to make sure it doesn’t get diverted anywhere else en route.

I wonder whether Friends of the Earth still think they scored a win by preventing it being mined in Cumbria and delivered to Scunthorpe by train, a mere 300 miles away?

This is the fallacy of net-zero.

Like, saying Drax is renewable by switching the fuel from coal to "bio-mass" wood pellets, shipped across the Atlantic from Canada (using renewable diesel no doubt) and then by train from Liverpool (again using that renewable diesel)

Virtue signalling at a billion dollar scale.

[Carth]

Thread revival time

BBC news: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cr5rgdpvn63o

The UK has secured a £10bn deal to supply the Norwegian navy with at least five new warships.

The government said the deal would support 4,000 UK jobs "well into the 2030s", including more than 2,000 at BAE Systems' Glasgow shipyards where the frigates will be built.

UK Prime Minister Sir Keir Starmer said the agreement would "drive growth and protect national security for working people".

Not one mention in that story of where the steel is coming from

Most of it comes from overseas because governments past and present already shamefully allowed our strategic ability to produce it domestically to wither.

Originally Posted by Chris

Most of it comes from overseas because governments past and present already shamefully allowed our strategic ability to produce it domestically to wither.

Yup…

From 2017

https://ukdefencejournal.org.uk/type...foreign-steel/

“Responsibility for sourcing steel for the Type 26 Frigates rests with BAE Systems as the contractor. In accordance with Government guidelines on the procurement of steel, the company has run a competition to select a supplier of steel for the programme, and an announcement is expected shortly.

UK steel suppliers have been strongly encouraged to bid in line with the Government’s Procurement Policy Notice concerning the procurement of steel for major Government projects. This pipeline is published on GOV.UK. The MOD will continue to carry out early market engagement and forecast our steel requirements for shipbuilding through the UK Government Steel Pipeline.

We expect that around 35 per cent of the steel required to build each Type 26 Frigate will be sourced from UK suppliers in Scotland and Scunthorpe; approximately 1,400 tonnes per ship. For some grades of plate steel needed for the Type 26 Frigates the combination of thickness, size and flatness specifications means that the steel cannot be sourced in its entirety in the UK.”

A source in the Royal Navy, who wishes not to be named, told us via e-mail:

“It’s nothing new, the carriers were the last big ticket item we had that were mostly British. The new Dreadnoughts, the new OPVs will also feature mostly foreign steel. It’s disappointing but it’s either that or paying much more for the vessels.”

BAE explained to the UK Defence Journal today that the Type 26 programme requires a considerable proportion of ‘thin plate’ steel due to the nature of the warship. This thin plate steel cannot be sourced from UK steel suppliers.

[Pierre]

Good news / bad news

[Carth]

the Type 26 programme requires a considerable proportion of ‘thin plate’ steel due to the nature of the warship

That'll be everything but the ammo magazines then