Virgin on Watchdog again

Originally Posted by Arthurgray50@blu

Well there has to be something wrong somewhere, l used to work for two companies that bought up to date lists to customers in new areas of London and Middlesex and then phone them or deliver leaflets.

I know for a fact that VM send out sales reps to local areas to find customers in cabled areas. IF anyone walks down a road and its cabled area - there will be a green box -right, and then you look on the pavement and there is a small box that sends cables into the house.

Its different with BT, you see phone polls. With VM you see green boxes etc.

What l am saying is that it is a total waste of money to send out leaflets in an areas that doesn't have that service, VM must pay thousands of pounds on leaflet waste, wehere they put could this to good use.

Arthur I don't think it is more expensive. It would be it was targeted, as it would need Sorting into the correct addresses.

[RichardCoulter]

I too saw VM on watchdog yesterday for wasting time, money and paper.

It stated that they have been sending mailshots to encourage households to subscribe to VM.

Nothing wrong with this, but these are to households who either live in a non cabled area or are already existing customers.

The sensible thing to have done would have been to run a 'data match' between the various databases beforehand.

The people involved have repeatedly told staff about this, but they have continually ignored requests to stop this wastefulness. In one case after calling them to stop a woman was asked for her name. All that happened was that they continued, but instead of being addressed to "The householder", they included her name!!!

To add insult to injury, they have been running a corporate video that spouts on about how they hate wasting paper and have made inroads in reducing it's usage.

One of these ways is to introduce paperless bills. At first this gave you a discount, but now it costs one an extra £1.75 for each bill.

They were even charging an elderly man, with no internet, for receiving paper bills, even though he had no alternative!

I think that it's ridiculous that people have had to resort to contacting a TV programme to resolve the above issues.

What do others think?

Have you or anyone you know experienced any such behaviour by VM?

Originally Posted by Ken W

I get same type of leaflets and letters from BT saying as an existing customer I can get special deals, I have not been a BT customer for over 15 years, BT even removed the drop lead from the telegraph pole 10 years ago!
So it is not just Virgin that sends there leaflets

I'm sure that other companies indulge in this foolishness too!

Originally Posted by Jimmy-J

A quick video tutorial might help Arthur... Follow these steps to copy and paste a web page into your forum post. The video shows how to do it for sending links via email, just apply the same steps to your forum posts.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vCYP0mPeDoU

That's a much more helpful way to deal with the situation, rather than insulting and belittling Arthur.

We all had to learn these things after all and it sometimes takes longer for others to grasp.

[dilli-theclaw]

Originally Posted by RichardCoulter

We all had to learn these things after all and it sometimes takes longer for others to grasp.

There is a difference between unwilling and unable to learn - perhaps you should have a look at how many times people have tried to show Arthur to do this, also it's a bit rich you mentioning belittling -when you do it quite often yourself.

[djmagnifique]

It also doesn't help that VM are using an out of date address database. Where I deliver post there were about 100 houses demolished a few years ago, VM keep sending large letters to these addresses about once a month which I have to endorse for return.

There are a few other rounds in the office I work at in the same situation so at a guess i'd say we have to return around 600 letters a month and my office only covers three post code areas.

[RichardCoulter]

Originally Posted by dilligaf1701

There is a difference between unwilling and unable to learn - perhaps you should have a look at how many times people have tried to show Arthur to do this, also it's a bit rich you mentioning belittling -when you do it quite often yourself.

It sometimes takes time for some people to learn new things in life- you should be aware of this. There are many and varied reasons as to why this is so.

I do not belittle people- don't talk nonsense.

Can we now get back to the subject of VM on Watchdog please...

---------- Post added at 17:19 ---------- Previous post was at 17:16 ----------

Originally Posted by djmagnifique

It also doesn't help that VM are using an out of date address database. Where I deliver post there were about 100 houses demolished a few years ago, VM keep sending large letters to these addresses about once a month which I have to endorse for return.

There are a few other rounds in the office I work at in the same situation so at a guess i'd say we have to return around 600 letters a month and my office only covers three post code areas.

Good heavens! This is ridiculous, surely it must cost more in aggregated resources to use an out of date list than buy a new one

[dilli-theclaw]

Originally Posted by RichardCoulter

It sometimes takes time for some people to learn new things in life- you should be aware of this. There are many and varied reasons as to why this is so.

No I shouldn't

Originally Posted by RichardCoulter

I do not belittle people- don't talk nonsense.

Yes you do

Originally Posted by RichardCoulter

Can we now get back to the subject of VM on Watchdog please...

You mentioned it first - and yes we can.

I have mentioned that I get many letters - calls from VM even though I don't have cable in my area, it doesn't bother me too much although I'd be happier if the calls were less.

[Pierre]

In my list of things I worry about when I go to bed this ranks 7,869.

[Russ]

Keep the moderating to the CF Team please.

[Arthurgray50@blu]

To the CF Team, don't worry, l am still learning at the moment - l am nearly 61 remember and l cherish all the advice that l am being given.

[RichardCoulter]

Originally Posted by dilligaf1701

No I shouldn't

Yes you do

You mentioned it first - and yes we can.

I have mentioned that I get many letters - calls from VM even though I don't have cable in my area, it doesn't bother me too much although I'd be happier if the calls were less.

I believe that it is everybodys duty to try and have patience to those who take longer to learn new things. Some people have learning difficulties, for example, so, yes, I think that you should.

I do not belittle others. We could go round in circles all day, but it probably doesn't make very interesting reading

I'm pleased that these inappropriate contacts from VM don't inconvenience you too much, but there is also the environmental impact to consider, as well as the unecessary cost to VM- this could be used for getting the extra channels that customers want instead

Originally Posted by Arthurgray50@blu

To the CF Team, don't worry, l am still learning at the moment - l am nearly 61 remember and l cherish all the advice that l am being given.

You are very gracious Arthur. It must be difficult to get to grips with new technology, apparently, the earlier we start to learn in life, the easier it is to grasp.

[dilli-theclaw]

Originally Posted by RichardCoulter

I believe that it is everybodys duty to try and have patience to those who take longer to learn new things. Some people have learning difficulties, for example, so, yes, I think that you should. .

Good - but as you are no doubt aware that's your opinion not a fact.

Originally Posted by RichardCoulter

I do not belittle others. We could go round in circles all day, but it probably doesn't make very interesting reading

Yes you do - quite often, but as you say let's not go round in circles about it.

Originally Posted by RichardCoulter

I'm pleased that these inappropriate contacts from VM don't inconvenience you too much, but there is also the environmental impact to consider, as well as the unecessary cost to VM- this could be used for getting the extra channels that customers want instead

I don't care about the cost to virgin or new channels to be honest. As for the environment - I suspect VM don't care about that either as long as they are getting people in. Even spamming non cabled areas they will probably get some people into their quite frankly crap off net product hen they phone to see about getting services.

[RichardCoulter]

Originally Posted by dilligaf1701

Good - but as you are no doubt aware that's your opinion not a fact.

Yes you do - quite often, but as you say let's not go round in circles about it.

I don't care about the cost to virgin or new channels to be honest. As for the environment - I suspect VM don't care about that either as long as they are getting people in. Even spamming non cabled areas they will probably get some people into their quite frankly crap off net product hen they phone to see about getting services.

My opinion that others should have patience with those less able than themselves is indeed my opinion, but there are occasions where this is required by law eg to prevent disability discrimination.

I do robustly defend myself from a minority who seek to cause trouble for little or no reason, but do not accept that I routinely belittle people.

I care about any wasteful expenditure by VM as it's ultimately customers and shareholders that end up footing the bill!

You make an interesting point about Off Net, perhaps they could design an alternative mailshot for non cabled areas, or put something on the back along the lines of "if you're not in a cabled area, don't worry, we can still supply you with products from Off Net".

VM have made a big thing about environmental issues lately eg they have introduced paperless bills and a corporate video about paper waste has been made to show to staff- then they go and waste paper sending inappropriate mailshot!

[joglynne]

Originally Posted by Arthurgray50@blu

To the CF Team, don't worry, l am still learning at the moment - l am nearly 61 remember and l cherish all the advice that l am being given.

Arthur with greatest respect I am several years older than you and am more than capable of adding a link to my posts so please don't play the 'old age' card as it just doesn't wash.

You have been shown numerous times, by various members, how to identify and add links to your posts, I even offered to show you how to do it privately by PM and you showed not the slightest interest to learn. Age is not the barrier here it is disinclination. My offer of several years ago is still open to you if you wish to PM me I will happily teach you how to locate and post the information members keep asking of you.

[dilli-theclaw]

Originally Posted by RichardCoulter

My opinion that others should have patience with those less able than themselves is indeed my opinion, but there are occasions where this is required by law eg to prevent disability discrimination.

I do robustly defend myself from a minority who seek to cause trouble for little or no reason, but do not accept that I routinely belittle people.

I care about any wasteful expenditure by VM as it's ultimately customers and shareholders that end up footing the bill!

You make an interesting point about Off Net, perhaps they could design an alternative mailshot for non cabled areas, or put something on the back along the lines of "if you're not in a cabled area, don't worry, we can still supply you with products from Off Net".

VM have made a big thing about environmental issues lately eg they have introduced paperless bills and a corporate video about paper waste has been made to show to staff- then they go and waste paper sending inappropriate mailshot!

I find the DDA pretty useless and do know a great deal about it - not just due to my own circumstances.

I do have an inordinate amount of patience where its due.

We are never going to agree on your opinion of how you see your actions / posts etc so maybe you should leave it at that. The evidence of your 'style' is after all all there in your posts - just the same as mine.

I find VM the same as any other company that I've come across - they may well make all the right noises but as soon as it comes to money they tend to throw that out the window - and I Can't say I blame them either.

It's not just the mailshots - they call too and don't seem to realise (despite) being told repetedly that there's no point in calling.

I left in the end as they wanted to charge an extra £25 a month to move me onto adsl2+

But my dad sticks with them and he gets letters at least once a week.

---------- Post added at 19:59 ---------- Previous post was at 19:57 ----------

Originally Posted by joglynne

Arthur with greatest respect I am several years older than you and am more than capable of adding a link to my posts so please don't play the 'old age' card as it just doesn't wash.

You have been shown numerous times, by various members, how to identify and add links to your posts, I even offered to show you how to do it privately by PM and you showed not the slightest interest to learn. Age is not the barrier here it is disinclination. My offer of several years ago is still open to you if you wish to PM me I will happily teach you how to locate and post the information members keep asking of you.

Indeed - several of the blind people I teach IT skills are well into their 90's and they manage just fine

They give me a run for my money I tell you

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