Another speed?

[Ramrod]

Originally Posted by BBKing

Ramrod - it costs a flipping fortune to upgrade speeds, new equipment for capacity upgrades, people's time from other teams, overtime for night work, engineer visits to sites and homes, swapping Pace boxes out. Not a cheap proposition.

That explains that then. Ta m8
....I would still be willing to pay £50 for 3mb though

[SMHarman]

Originally Posted by Ramrod

That explains that then. Ta m8
....I would still be willing to pay £50 for 3mb though

But see my post (14) for the disincentive for them to do that though.

Your £50 or 10 customers £17.99. I know which I would prefer.

[Rone]

On a similar topic, whats the max capacity the new STBs can handle?
I know the old Pace are being swapped cos of possible problems with 1.5 from 1meg.
So if we all had the latest modem and stb would it need say all new hardware everywhere, to go to 2meg?
Or is 1.5 the limit on the NTL hardware or are there other reasons?
Just wondered why we got 1.5 and not 2.
And no i,m not unhappy with the 1.5 now its been fixed.

[BBKing]

10Mb through the Ethernet port I think is the limit. The modem itself is just like any Samsung SACM apparently, such as the business ones.

[Mauldor]

Originally Posted by SMHarman

But see my post (14) for the disincentive for them to do that though.

Your £50 or 10 customers £17.99. I know which I would prefer.

Hmm this dont fit in though, why provide 750 and 1.5mbit then?
Let do the sums:

1 x 300 = loads of people on UBR (i think) and gets £17.99 a month
1 x 750 24.99 - starting to loose some money now and can fit 2 1/2 300 users
1 x 1.5mit a whopping 5 300k users = £89 a month vs £37.99

How do Telewest make money as they offer 3mbit and use if im not mistaken the same kit right? WHy not follow Telewest lead on this, it makes sense as it claws back money. You have speed 300, 750, 1.5mbit and 3mbit, you charge one price for CM only (higher price) and if they take out TV and Phone then it comes down.

As with anything in the world, something is only worth what people will pay for it. At the moment i agree you have certain choices depending on where you live. You can have CM as above, depending on TW or NTL top si 1.5/3mbit sort of thing. Now if you have ADSL you can go upto 2mbit and if your really special you can get Bulldog which goes uto 8mbit i think.

People still have the shopping Mall mentality - a bigger box is cheaper then buying 2 small ones, of course there is a marketing reeason for this as more you have the longer it will be before you try another brand. In throey then, 1.5mbit should be double the price of 750 as your getting twice the speed, but in reality is only £13 more not £24.99 more.

Im suprised that the 1.5mbit is so low a product as mentioned but then again with imposing limits why on earth would you pay loads of dosh for something that you could potentialy overuse and effect your entire area? Odd that if 1mbit before and also 600 caused such a problem with people damm well downlaoding and uploading all the time, how does uppping the speed make any sense at all?

Oh as a side note to first thing, if NTL only supplied 300k as there one and only connection then i would expect a LOT of people would switch, if they could to ADSL withouth a flicker of a eye lid - so that argument is null and void to be honest. As was said - if BT provided 3mbit, NTL would follow suit in a Heart beat, roll on Telewest/NTl Merger

[SMHarman]

The math is very simplistic, compare 5 x 300 to 2 x 750 you have 3 more SACMs and installs to do, 3 more bills to process DDs to collect over 100% chance more of one connection being knackered, etc etc.

There are also network sunk costs which means that these numbers are also not so valid.

NTL supply more than the 300k product as that is what the market dictates, if NTL held a monopoly on BB then they would probably only carry 300k until their regulator forced them to provide different speeds.

How to TW make money on 3Mb, do they? Or is it a loss leading Brand Marketing that they have the fastest widespread consumer BB product in the country.

You also have to factor in contention and other wonderful considerations that 5 300k users will probably use more bandwidth more of the time than 1 user on a 1.5Mb connection, so assuming normal usage patterns you can probably put two 1.5m customers where 5 300k customers go making the numbers add up again, however when both want to use their connection to the max all the time that therory falls over.

[Ignition]

Also guys think about those who would pay the £50 for a 3Mbit service, most of them are likely to really get their money's worth and then some. The 3 300k users that would provide the same income and the 4 300k users that would cover the extra network costs, etc, wouldn't consume anywhere near as much bandwidth. That's another reason to hold off from releasing the service.

Don't know what the average usage is on Telewest's 3Mbit service but would bet it's comfortably 150GB/month/user.

[jtwn]

I wouldn't upgrade from 1.5 to 3mbit if it did come out, the upgrade wouldnt woo me that much, unless the upload was increased; i'd snap it up in an instant.

[Rone]

2mbit would be a nice round figure.
Only cos people are getting on my wick asking why its 1.5 and not 2 !!!

[scrotnig]

I would concur that the most popular service is now the 300k. For the vast majority of customers I deal with, this is more than adequate for their needs.

There may well be a demand for higher speeds among the power users on this site...and in fact, I would include myself in that....but across the user base of ntl as a whole, there'd be little demand. There is not THAT much demand for the 1.5mb service really.

I think the reality is, it won't happen.

[Ignition]

Originally Posted by Mark B

I would concur that the most popular service is now the 300k. For the vast majority of customers I deal with, this is more than adequate for their needs.

There may well be a demand for higher speeds among the power users on this site...and in fact, I would include myself in that....but across the user base of ntl as a whole, there'd be little demand. There is not THAT much demand for the 1.5mb service really.

I think the reality is, it won't happen.

Hey never say never - I would very much like to keep this thread alive and in the public eye. If you are prepared to pay for it and want it in enough numbers it'll be provided. While people are happy with 750k and 300k it won't, simple as. You want to see 3Mbit with possibly a higher upload upgrade to 1.5Mbit!

Well I am on 1.5mb and unless your downloading massive amounts of stuff i dont really notice it and for £37.99 its a little much when i am now really paying for the status of the speed.


Considering downgrading to 750k and saving some cash for that new hifi i like

[kronas]

Originally Posted by JustAnotherN00b

Where would you draw the line tho Kroneh, if NTL gave you 3Mbit would you be happy only achieving 2Mbit at peak times? Some people believe it's a leased line, these are the same people who leave P2P apps on all the time, usually stuff like kazaa, and think it's their absolute duty to download as much as possible all the time because 'They are paying for it.'. Where do you draw the line between acceptable performance for a shared service and giving the impression of no contention, the price paid for this is innovation to be honest.

the way NTL initially offered the service is i think what people are laying their premesis on, i would accept a service to be slightly slower at peak times if a 3mbit service was introduced, i have been very fortunate to be in an area with low usage of down and upstream, i know others have the misfortune of being on crowded ubr's or being on a relatively low user upstream and being hit with mass p2p clogging activties....

you pay for what you get, when i signed up for this service i was told my downloads can be faster, i can download music files and 'large' movie files, those were the old enticing leaflets.

Originally Posted by JustAnotherN00b

FWIW I'm a massive advocate of higher speeds, however in this case I am, necessarily, playing devil's advocate. If people want the speeds they need to show demand, the applications are SLOWLY but surely arriving to push this forward, especially in the upstream direction, however those wanting more upstream to improve their share ratio on P2P apps or host the latest leet warez are I suspect going to be disappointed.

it is true that quite alot of people want more upstream speed, but p2p is here to stay, there are others out there who want to transfer files from home to remote servers and such so there is that fine balance aswell of trying to provide customers a good service while not trying to 'break the bank' so to speak.

Originally Posted by JustAnotherN00b

Yes this ISPs feed isn't good, however I'm moving to another one that will supply the 100% speeds that I should get at the contention ratio.

unless you get hit again on the way in

my main concern is that broadband in this country should be 'high speed' unfortunately alot of the 'top brass' fail to realise the capabilitys of broadband as an educational tool

[Siuko]

I have stated on quite a few occasions on this forum, and I'm also certain many others have, that I would be willing to put my money down for more bandwidth.

Lets just say for instance in relation to the 1.5mb service.

Bandwidth 1536/256 @ £37.99

NTL obviously can offer this and there must be a profit in running such a service at such a price.

So give me the chance of having this service.

Bandwidth 3072/512 @ £75.98

Now that doesnt break any mold for crazy low pricing - it still fits in with the model for the 1.5mb service but just a doubling of download and upload speed and a doubling of price. Maybe even go as far as adding another £20+ to the amount to make it an even £100/month and then offer a fully uncapped/unmetered service where I could be happy in the knowledge that poeple arent blaming such a terrible heavier user as me for affecting there internet (that as a note they arent using to its potential - which obviously NTL are happier with).

So NTL just get offering the service and I'll pay for it!!! I have my wallet ready and I'm sure it cannot be that difficult technically!

PS. If anyone at NTL wants to contact me to offer me this service as a trial to see if it is technically viable I'm all up for that and ok to pay the said amount to trial it too!! GIMME MOOOOORE

[Mauldor]

Makes me laugh really - a lot of people are still living in the 56k modem age - spend too long online and download too much and your a bad bad person. While I agree that we pay a small price for what we get, just what is the point of offering a service that is on 24/7 and can download at 180KB/Sec + yet if you use it too much then you are indeed effecting all the people within a 100 mil radius, you bad bad boy.

Now I personally dont P2P, I hate it in fact - but take a few games and straight away your in with a chance of been classed as a bad person. Lineage 2 - comes in at 1.3 GIG. The you go get the updates - god loads there. MIR3, another 1+ gig and then update that.

Question here really, do the same things get talked about to death on ADSL forums as they dont seem to have any caps, surely the technoloy is the same (or similar). Another question, if i was a business user and paid for the 1.5mbit line say (at stupid prices like they do) then surely its got to be connected to the same lines at the end of the day? thus me as a business user downloading/uploading 24/7 will effect people will it not?

Is it not possible to clump the heavy users on certain UBRS thus each effecting each other? We in Britain need to push forward not go feking backwards here.... damm 300k

Actually Just had a thought - Motorways - UK pants, rest of world Brill.
Public Transport - Uk "delays and slow", rest of world Prompt and on time.
Comms - SDSL, 10mbit, Fribe etc - us - still living in the 56k modem era by the sounds of it.

Basically we are always last, we dont inovate, we suffocate, you never know in 10 years time we might have 3mbit line but dont hold your breath eh!