Cash and the cashless society

Originally Posted by pip08456

Companies love people like you. You mainly use Apple Pay what do you think Apple does with that infomation now? Your buying habits are sold on to other companies, would it be that hard for the Government to get that information also?

What do you think Apple does with that information?

Apple is not selling what you buy to third parties. Why would they? First of all, it would be a major scandal and breach of data protection laws for peanuts worth of money for a company like Apple. Especially since their privacy policy explicitly states they don't store it.

Secondly, the data is worth more for them to keep to themselves. Facebook and Google don't 'sell your data', they use it to sell advertising. If they sell your data they can only sell it once. However, if they sell access to your eyeballs because only THEY have the reach to advertise product X to demographic Y then they make a business the size of Google on that.

Finally, it's not even technically how Apple Pay works. They're just a conduit between your card, the payment-processing network, and your bank. When you pay for something that transaction isn't going via Apple's servers, it's going via Mastercard/Visa/Amex just like if you were to use a contactless card. If you go into Apple Wallet and look at the transactions they like that information is coming directly from your bank which is why it doesn't always work well.

And as for the Government getting that information. How specifically would they get it? Do they send a request to the bank for your transaction history? That would work but it won't scale. They would need to automate it. That means each bank, which will have different databases and store it all differently, would need to write code to upload transactions daily/weekly to the Government. The Government would need to write code to receive that information and then store what amounts to a HUGE amount of data.

That's quite an undertaking and it won't go unnoticed. (Theoretically GCHQ could put a tap on the payment networks themselves I guess).

If the Government suspects you of something they can get your transaction information but that's different from a national database of everyone's purchases.

Besides, as with all these things, if the Government ever takes an interest in you specifically then you're screwed anyway. Paying in cash and turning off location history on your phone isn't going to stump them.

[Mr K]

Originally Posted by Damien

Paying in cash and turning off location history on your phone isn't going to stump them.

I think you over estimate our Government/security services

[Rillington]

Originally Posted by peanut

Banks are closing but cashpoints are still popping up and has to be within a certain distance like 3 miles or something or other, so that's still helpful.

Yes but my guess is that many of these cashpoints charge a fee.

Originally Posted by Rillington

Yes but my guess is that many of these cashpoints charge a fee.

https://www.fca.org.uk/data/access-c...age-uk-2022-q2

96.3% of the UK population are currently within 2km of a free-to-use cash access point

99.8% of the UK population are currently within 5km of a free-to-use cash access point

[Itshim]

Originally Posted by Hugh

https://www.fca.org.uk/data/access-c...age-uk-2022-q2

I would think that people needing a cash point could travel that far

[Stephen]

I've not lifted cash for a long time now. I've always used my debit card to pay in shops and spend my momey and continue to do so via my contact less card. Its just a lot simpler and easier. So is Google pay. Don't even need my wallet on me.

All that unnecessary weight of change jingling in my pocket. No need for that.

Also had online banking for over 23 years. Just makes life easier.

[Mr K]

Bought a 70p scone from Thomas's today. Was in a dilemma whether it was a cheeky to pay by card, or use my emergency £10 note. I used the note and got lots of change. Not sure whether it was the right choice, been bothering me all day. Scone was good though.

[Rillington]

More and more businesses would force you to pay by card for that 70p transaction and very recently, this happened to me, and for that very amount. I refused to pay by card and left the item on the counter, politely telling the lady behind the counter that I would never return. She said that if she had her way, she would have allowed payment in cash and she was happy to direct me to another shop which took cash. I mentioned it in the shop she directed me to, and the comment I received was "interesting..."

I wonder how much revenue and profit businesses which refuse cash are losing, both from the charges they pay for every card transaction to any actual reduction in people coming through the door.

[Taf]

I bagged up £320 worth of coins yesterday. All gathered during the pandemic. Santander will only let me deposit a couple of bags per day. So I may open an account with Metro as they allow you to deposit as many coins as you like, unbagged and straight into a sorting machine.

[Anonymouse]

Originally Posted by Rillington

More and more businesses would force you to pay by card for that 70p transaction

At the cashpoints I use, there's a sign: 'you will not be charged for this transaction'. Too bloody right I won't - if they start with that, I will boycott them!

[Stephen]

Originally Posted by Anonymouse

At the cashpoints I use, there's a sign: 'you will not be charged for this transaction'. Too bloody right I won't - if they start with that, I will boycott them!

Usually it's only the ones outside newsagents and the stand alone ones. Real banks machines never charge.

Originally Posted by Rillington

More and more businesses would force you to pay by card for that 70p transaction.

My local shop refuses to allow you to pay with card unless the total is at least £2.00.

[pip08456]

Originally Posted by Paul

My local shop refuses to allow you to pay with card unless the total is at least £2.00.

My local (literally next door) I can pay for any amount no matter how small (never tested how small but used for a £1 transaction) with card and I can get cash back if I need cash.

The shop at the top of the street must be £5 min transaction and no cash back.

Guess which is the busiest shop?

[spiderplant]

Originally Posted by Taf

I bagged up £320 worth of coins yesterday. All gathered during the pandemic. Santander will only let me deposit a couple of bags per day. So I may open an account with Metro as they allow you to deposit as many coins as you like, unbagged and straight into a sorting machine.

I use the self-service tills at Asda. Just throw in a handful of coins, they'll take what they need and give you the rest back.

Not £320 though. How the heck did you collect that during the pandemic?

[Taf]

Originally Posted by spiderplant

Not £320 though. How the heck did you collect that during the pandemic?

Notes only from cash machines, and then shops giving coin change, but not accepting it. It builds up quickly, so the total over 3 years is not that bad.