Brexit - Page 192

jfman · 27-05-2019, 23:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Carth

Labour leader Jeremy Corbyn has refused to explicitly back the idea of another referendum - despite increasing calls from within his party to do so.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-48419144

and the game continues

He’s enjoying that tightrope, isn’t he?

Corbyn backs referendum on Brexit deal after voter exodus

https://www.theguardian.com/politics...r-voter-exodus

So vague people see what they want to see.

Edit: missed Andrew’s post but the point stands without the link!

denphone · 28-05-2019, 05:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Carth

Labour leader Jeremy Corbyn has refused to explicitly back the idea of another referendum - despite increasing calls from within his party to do so.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-48419144

and the game continues :p:

And goes on and on and on with seemingly no ending in sight...

Angua · 28-05-2019, 08:48

One thing forgotten in all the claims about Labour votes, the MEPs elected are ALL pro EU and some were rather vocal about their disapproval of Labours EU manifesto fudge.

Which is why Labour votes should be discounted from either side of the argument. There is no clarity about what those Labour votes were based on.

papa smurf · 28-05-2019, 08:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Angua

One thing forgotten in all the claims about Labour votes, the MEPs elected are ALL pro EU and some were rather vocal about their disapproval of Labours EU manifesto fudge.

Which is why Labour votes should be discounted from either side of the argument. There is no clarity about what those Labour votes were based on.

Does that make you feel as though you've won something ?

**Hugh** · 28-05-2019, 09:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by papa smurf

Does that make you feel as though you've won something ?

Does that?

Angua · 28-05-2019, 09:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by papa smurf

Does that make you feel as though you've won something ?

No, just trying to shove Labour support definitively on to either side of the argument seems pointless with their fence squatting.

Leavers claiming Labour votes = leave support is just as wrong as Remainers also claiming the same.

papa smurf · 28-05-2019, 09:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Angua

No, just trying to shove Labour support definitively on to either side of the argument seems pointless with their fence squatting.

Leavers claiming Labour votes = leave support is just as wrong as Remainers also claiming the same.

Thank you for clarifying your reasoning .

ianch99 · 28-05-2019, 09:36

All of this trying to authoritatively conclude the National opinion from the EP voting is a bit silly. I mean, the Brexit Party only got 5% more of the vote than UKIP did in 2014 yet people are trying to claim a seismic shift .. and all from 37% of the electorate.

papa smurf · 28-05-2019, 09:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by ianch99

All of this trying to authoritatively conclude the National opinion from the EP voting is a bit silly. I mean, the Brexit Party only got 5% more of the vote than UKIP did in 2014 yet people are trying to claim a seismic shift .. and all from 37% of the electorate.

Were the Brexit party dominant in your voting area???

ianch99 · 28-05-2019, 09:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by papa smurf

Were the Brexit party dominant in your voting area???

dominant: having power and influence over others.

Nah ..

papa smurf · 28-05-2019, 09:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by ianch99

dominant: having power and influence over others.

Nah ..

Winning more seats at the EP than their rivals ???

Taf · 28-05-2019, 10:07

Turnout was just below 37% in the UK.

South East of England was 39.36% (36.3% in 2014).
West Midlands was 31.1% (32.4% in 2014).
North West was 33.1% (33.3% in 2014).
South Westwas 40.5% (37.4% from 2014).
The Eastern region was 36.4% (36.6% in 2014).
Wales was 37.3% (32% in 2014).

So perhaps over 63% didn't vote as they expect Brexit to actually happen, so why vote for an MEP?

Add that percentage to The Brexit Party vote and there is a landslide for leaving the EU.

Anyone can "play" with the figures, to suit their agenda.

**Mick** · 28-05-2019, 11:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by ianch99

All of this trying to authoritatively conclude the National opinion from the EP voting is a bit silly. I mean, the Brexit Party only got 5% more of the vote than UKIP did in 2014 yet people are trying to claim a seismic shift .. and all from 37% of the electorate.

It was a Seismic shift - it is a new party which is now the largest party sitting in the European Parliament. The mistake you're making is saying it's UKIP, it's not - for a start it has candidates from a whole range of political beliefs, from those on left, to those on right. It also had a diverse range of ethnic candidates, which was far from the case in UKIP.

BP is not UKIP.

---------- Post added at 11:04 ---------- Previous post was at 10:54 ----------

Liberal Democrats caught in a lie - they claim now after the vote that Labour is a Remain so they can fudge the argument that Remain won more votes, but they campaigned on a ticket which said a vote for them, is a vote to stop brexit and it said "Conservatives, Labour, Brexit Party and UKIP" is a vote for Brexit.

See the image of the leaflet....

https://twitter.com/IainDale/status/1133310925300273152

**Damien** · 28-05-2019, 11:22

Liberal Democrat leaflets are infamous for those kinds of things. The bar graphs which show Lib Dems being closer to whichever party won the previous election than they actually are.

1andrew1 · 28-05-2019, 11:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mick

It was a Seismic shift - it is a new party which is now the largest party sitting in the European Parliament. The mistake you're making is saying it's UKIP, it's not - for a start it has candidates from a whole range of political beliefs, from those on left, to those on right. It also had a diverse range of ethnic candidates, which was far from the case in UKIP.

Ian's not saying the Brexit Party is Ukip.

Basically, Ukip is all but dead (and Change UK for that matter) and Nigel Farage's new vehicle is the Brexit Party. I don't think it's unfair to compare the change in votes for Nigel Farage's old and new parties and to conclude that 5% is not a seismic shift.