Brexit (Old)

[Angua]

Originally Posted by RichardCoulter

Most employees don't really have the choice though in the real world, just as they don't regarding Sunday working.

Most employees have plenty of choice, unless they work in the NHS. Jobs are advertised with the hours expected. If it matters to you that you don't work Sundays and not more than 48 hours per week, then don't apply for a job that requires this.

[Sephiroth]

Originally Posted by Hugh

i agreed with you on the other two, but you avoided my question on why the WTD is a bad thing...

The process may not have been ideal, but the outcome was optimal (unless you are an employer who didn’t want to give your employees decent holidays or working hours).
<SNIP>

Fair enough. Actually I didn't say it was a bad thing although I like the idea of the UK being more competitive than France by being more flexible in terms of labour laws. As it happens, we secured opt-outs that I find acceptable.

The con was the device used to thwart our veto. It's one of the reasons I hate them as an institution.

[Pierre]

You know that European Army we were told, by Europhile Nick Clegg, would never happen?

https://fullfact.org/europe/hunt-eu-army/

Well, typically, and as I have previously commented on, here it comes.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...-a8619721.html

And Macron, the stupid French Twit, reckons they need it to protect themselves against the US?? That’s just offensive.

So you see the end game here is to dissolve NATO. Well I know who I would rather pin my allegiance too. The yanks or cheese eating surrender monkeys.............

[RichardCoulter]

Originally Posted by Angua

Most employees have plenty of choice, unless they work in the NHS. Jobs are advertised with the hours expected. If it matters to you that you don't work Sundays and not more than 48 hours per week, then don't apply for a job that requires this.

My point is that employers want employees to be totally flexible to their needs and that, whilst this law does exist and will help some people, most will ultimately have no choice.

[jonbxx]

Originally Posted by Sephiroth

Fair enough. Actually I didn't say it was a bad thing although I like the idea of the UK being more competitive than France by being more flexible in terms of labour laws. As it happens, we secured opt-outs that I find acceptable.

The con was the device used to thwart our veto. It's one of the reasons I hate them as an institution.

Hi, I have been trying to find anything about France making this an H&S issue but I haven’t had luck yet. Could you link me up? I worked ld be interested to know basis the WTD was before the change.

I did find an interesting parliamentary research paper discussing the WTD including the UK objections to the H&S basis of the WTD and the subsequent ECJ judgement. It also has nice appendices on the working hours and holidays of different then EU countries - http://researchbriefings.files.parli...6/RP96-106.pdf

[Pierre]

Originally Posted by jonbxx

Hi, I have been trying to find anything about France making this an H&S issue but I haven’t had luck yet. Could you link me up?

A complete history here

http://journals.sagepub.com/doi/full...23263X18760547

Knock yourself out, once you’ve Read it, any chance of doing us a quick appraisal?

[Bircho]

Originally Posted by Mick

And the ones who really want to leave like me - do not give a shit one way or the other, leaving was not just about money FFS, we just want to get out of that cancerous club.

This is why we need to leave the EU in it's entirety - we do not need to be in a con job membership club to do trade deals. The other benefit is, we also save £39 Billion divorce bill, another con the corrupted EU said we owe them, they have robbed us and conned us for years - time to get on and leave that toxic shambolic union.

Mick whilst it may not be just about the money there are a LOT of businesses exposed. It is not only the loss of trade but many took a big hit, particularly on cash reserves when pound fell after the vote. Another drop of 10%+ will kill many businesses. There is much more to it than in any out especially if profitable businesses can't pay wages because they ain't got cash.

[Dave42]

Originally Posted by Pierre

You know that European Army we were told, by Europhile Nick Clegg, would never happen?

https://fullfact.org/europe/hunt-eu-army/

Well, typically, and as I have previously commented on, here it comes.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...-a8619721.html

And Macron, the stupid French Twit, reckons they need it to protect themselves against the US?? That’s just offensive.

So you see the end game here is to dissolve NATO. Well I know who I would rather pin my allegiance too. The yanks or cheese eating surrender monkeys.............

Donald Trump has talked about leaving NATO too

https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...t-would-happen

[Pierre]

Originally Posted by Dave42

Donald Trump has talked about leaving NATO too

https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...t-would-happen

Duh.......Dave i’m Starting to worry that you’re not the sharpest tool in the box, so to speak.

Because, pretty much since the end of the war, and certainly in recent years, the US has pretty much bankrolled NATO and most of the EU, post Cold War.

The reason Trump questioned the US role in NATO was because the EU members were/are taking the piss. Spending sod all and relying on the US to provide the muscle.

I agree with Trump on this issue.

[Dave42]

Originally Posted by Pierre

Duh.......Dave i’m Starting to worry that you’re not the sharpest tool in the box, so to speak.

Because, pretty much since the end of the war, and certainly in recent years, the US has pretty much bankrolled NATO and most of the EU, post Cold War.

The reason Trump questioned the US role in NATO was because the EU members were/are taking the piss. Spending sod all and relying on the US to provide the muscle.

I agree with Trump on this issue.

says the man that don't understand all treaty cease mean in article 50 and cut the abuse out I never abused you and not gonna stope to your level

[ianch99]

Originally Posted by Pierre

Duh.......Dave i’m Starting to worry that you’re not the sharpest tool in the box, so to speak.

Why don't you just stick to the facts and avoid the personal attacks?

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by Pierre

Duh.......Dave i’m Starting to worry that you’re not the sharpest tool in the box, so to speak. .

Go for the ball, not the man. You weaken your subsequent points by your unnecessary put-down.

---------- Post added at 23:52 ---------- Previous post was at 23:47 ----------

Originally Posted by Mick

Wtf is this obsession with Banks FFS ?

No wonder nothing.

Banks is a multi millionaire, the fines imposed are small change to him - it's not bad news for him or Brexiteers.

- you keep going on about him but he did not help me make my decision to vote leave and I am damn well sure that goes for millions of others. There is nothing to discuss about Banks.

Not an obsession. But a bit strange that on a day when he's found to be breaking the law, Brexiiters suddenly become interested in the Working Time Directive.

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

Go for the ball, not the man. You weaken your subsequent points by your unnecessary put-down.

---------- Post added at 23:52 ---------- Previous post was at 23:47 ----------


Not an obsession. But a bit strange that on a day when he's found to be breaking the law, Brexiiters suddenly become interested in the Working Time Directive.

Yawn, do you actually have any valid point here or what ?

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by Mick

Yawn, do you actually have any valid point here or what ?

Two.

[Sephiroth]

Originally Posted by jonbxx

Hi, I have been trying to find anything about France making this an H&S issue but I haven’t had luck yet. Could you link me up? I worked ld be interested to know basis the WTD was before the change.

I did find an interesting parliamentary research paper discussing the WTD including the UK objections to the H&S basis of the WTD and the subsequent ECJ judgement. It also has nice appendices on the working hours and holidays of different then EU countries - http://researchbriefings.files.parli...6/RP96-106.pdf

That link will do. The French thing is well known by those watching it at the time; they are also the ones that opposed the Services Directive for the same reasons.

---------- Post added at 06:00 ---------- Previous post was at 05:51 ----------

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

Go for the ball, not the man. You weaken your subsequent points by your unnecessary put-down.

---------- Post added at 23:52 ---------- Previous post was at 23:47 ----------


Not an obsession. But a bit strange that on a day when he's found to be breaking the law, Brexiiters suddenly become interested in the Working Time Directive.

You're being ridiculous. What's the big deal with Banks? To hell with him and the clutching at straws that some Remainers have in their heads.

I brought in the WTD not as a diversion from Banks but to keep us focused on the shenanigans of the EU and in that case protection of France's interests. Are you Remainers really respecters of the rigged Cap (in favour of France)? Are you really in favour of the rigged Euro (in favour of Germany)? Are you really in favour of the perfidious Irish using the CU to try and keep us shackled to the EU (in favour of Irish exports)?

You might well argue, and some of you have, that we brought this on ourselves by voting Leave. Be that as it may, the EU are determined to wreck Brexit and they should be vilified for their perfidy rather than the democratic Leave vote.