Nurse suspended for offering to pray for patient's recovery

[Mick Fisher]

I think it would be a better World all round if everybody kept their beliefs or non-beliefs to themselves.

It's not what you believe in that makes you the person you are. It's what you do with your life that counts.

[rogerdraig]

Originally Posted by Damien

I think people should remember it was not necessarily her Religion that was the problem, it was her indifference to her supervisors orders. She had done this before and was requested to avoid doing so. Now, that may have been a unreasonable request to make of her (although given the complaints, it may have been for her own good. Don't mix Religion/Politics with work) and I also think she suspension was harsh.

She is not being targeted for her religion but her failure to do what was asked for her.

Also The Woman that reported her is a cow.

cant quite agree though i will say the person or persons deciding that she could be told not to do it may well have done so with no intended targeting of her religion or indeed any religion

what they did was not lawful and is not lawful under the articles on freedom of religion

so her not complying shouldnt and most likely cant be held against her

just because a boss says something doesn't make it automatically right or lawful

where she went wrong was not escalating this when first told but as we dont know the full facts she may have been told this by a junior supervisor and decided they didn't understand what they were talking about and just left it at that

if we all escalated everything at the first instance there would be a lot more litigating going on lol

as to the one reporting her ( darn it defending the other party now lol ) they may well belive they are only doing the right thing not understanding the law either ( why should she how many here have read any of these acts all the ay through ) and in any case i defend the right those who dont like religion have to say so and to say if they want some one ike that helping them or thier relatives etc

which takes me back to the mangement who really should undestand these acts and as i said befoe offered to provide another nurse / carer while giving the nurse another job or asking her if she would be happy to not talk about reliogion with that particular person

which could takeme to a big bug bear of mine of management no longer managing anything just following memos and rules and not using judgemnet and knowledge any more ( but that would be another thread lol )

[downquark1]

http://www.layscience.net/node/482

She is a deeply Christian nurse, which is fine, but had apparently made a bit of habit of pushing those beliefs on patients in her care - which is clearly unprofessional. She was warned about this behaviour back in October, after making a patient a home-made "prayer card". Reports that she has been suspended are quite simply false - she is a bank nurse, and the local trust (North Somerset Primary Care Trust) have simply decided not to use her services again until an investigation has been completed into her behaviour.

[superbiatch]

Originally Posted by downquark1

http://www.layscience.net/node/482

The comment below was cut from the first link in this thread:

A spokesman for North Somerset Primary Care Trust said: "Caroline Petrie has been suspended pending an investigation into the matter.
"She is a bank nurse and she has been told we will not be using her in this capacity until the outcome of our investigation is known.

[etccarmageddon]

maybe she mislead the daily mail when they asked her questions?

Originally Posted by etccarmageddon

maybe she mislead the daily mail when they asked her questions?

Maybe they selectively quoted?

I would love to hear the other side of the story, as at the moment, it appears all one-sided.

[SMG]

Originally Posted by Russ B

She did keep them to herself, otherwise she would have been asking the patient to join her in prayer.

How could she have kept it to herself when she made the offer to pray?

Originally Posted by Russ B

This nurse was not harming anyone in any way. I'll go out on a limb and suggest if anyone on here claims they'd be offended if she'd done the same to them it's purely because they want to get a "religious person" in to trouble.

I agree there was no harm done, but part of the issue is her employers policy, which she failed to adhere to.

[Russ]

Originally Posted by SMG

How could she have kept it to herself when she made the offer to pray?

She wasn't inviting the patient to join her in prayer.

If someone had said "Oh God, I've been looking for you" are they pushing religion on people?

Originally Posted by SMG

I agree there was no harm done, but part of the issue is her employers policy, which she failed to adhere to.

And one step further, the issue is the trust have misplaced priorities and seem more interested in being PC.

[SMG]

Originally Posted by Russ B

She wasn't inviting the patient to join her in prayer.

As a bit of an ignorant atheist, I would perceive that the fact that she asked if she could pray for her, was an invitation. As a believer, you perceive it to be different. Thats OK, because I think were just splitting hairs.

Originally Posted by Russ B

If someone had said "Oh God, I've been looking for you" are they pushing religion on people?

No. I commonly things like "Jesus wept" without meaning anything religious.

Originally Posted by Russ B

And one step further, the issue is the trust have misplaced priorities and seem more interested in being PC.

Possibly, but when an employee does something which is against policy, then they are treading on dangerous ground. Theres no reason to suspect this nurse did anything bad. She mentioned religion. Most people would just shrug it off as meaningless.

However, people do start to get defensive when religion is pushed on them. None of us were there at the time so we cannot say how the subject was brought up, how forcefully it was said, or what reaction the patient & carer had. But, unfortunately, she brought the trouble on herself.

Keep shut & get on with it. Best policy.

[rogerdraig]

suggested reading for those who think they can ban religion in work

http://www.biznet.org.uk/religion.htm

http://www.biznet.org.uk/Department%...mployers_taken

Originally Posted by rogermevans

suggested reading for those who think they can ban religion in work

http://www.biznet.org.uk/religion.htm

http://www.biznet.org.uk/Department%...mployers_taken

imho, it's not about banning religion, it's about inappropriate behaviours.

[rogerdraig]

if its part of the way she practices her religion then its about religion

as i said before that doesn't take away from the other side if they don't like what she was doing they shouldn't have to have her there but that should be achieved through moving her to another patient

If i am a patient in a hospital the last thing i want to hear from a nurse is an offer for her to pray for me come on people a nurse says that when you are in hospital your not going to have positive thoughts are you. Secondly we have had 11 pages of chat about a woman who was previously warned not to do it and disregarded those orders so what other job can you ignore the boss and not face any action i am curious.

This isn't about religion for me on this occasion this is about a woman who didn't do what she was told and whether it was two or two hundred people got upset by it. Rules are rules and are not there to be disrgarded because they don't fit what you like to do she was told she ignored and now she is getting the reward for that. All this talk of religious freedom is a smoke screen in this case because no one is saying she can't be religious they are saying don't offer prays to patients and she did so what is the big deal.

I am an atheist well known on here don't hide it and yes i think some people have gone a bit ott on this but if she had done what she was told there wouldn't be a problem thats the basic issue here not religion or the freedom of religion in this country it is about an employee being given an order and not complyng with that and just because she was offering prayers should not mean she gets any special consideration.

[Mick Fisher]

Originally Posted by RizzyKing

If i am a patient in a hospital the last thing i want to hear from a nurse is an offer for her to pray for me come on people a nurse says that when you are in hospital your not going to have positive thoughts are you. Secondly we have had 11 pages of chat about a woman who was previously warned not to do it and disregarded those orders so what other job can you ignore the boss and not face any action i am curious.

This isn't about religion for me on this occasion this is about a woman who didn't do what she was told and whether it was two or two hundred people got upset by it. Rules are rules and are not there to be disrgarded because they don't fit what you like to do she was told she ignored and now she is getting the reward for that. All this talk of religious freedom is a smoke screen in this case because no one is saying she can't be religious they are saying don't offer prays to patients and she did so what is the big deal.

I am an atheist well known on here don't hide it and yes i think some people have gone a bit ott on this but if she had done what she was told there wouldn't be a problem thats the basic issue here not religion or the freedom of religion in this country it is about an employee being given an order and not complyng with that and just because she was offering prayers should not mean she gets any special consideration.

In a nutshell...

[frogstamper]

Originally Posted by RizzyKing

If i am a patient in a hospital the last thing i want to hear from a nurse is an offer for her to pray for me come on people a nurse says that when you are in hospital your not going to have positive thoughts are you. Secondly we have had 11 pages of chat about a woman who was previously warned not to do it and disregarded those orders so what other job can you ignore the boss and not face any action i am curious.

This isn't about religion for me on this occasion this is about a woman who didn't do what she was told and whether it was two or two hundred people got upset by it. Rules are rules and are not there to be disrgarded because they don't fit what you like to do she was told she ignored and now she is getting the reward for that. All this talk of religious freedom is a smoke screen in this case because no one is saying she can't be religious they are saying don't offer prays to patients and she did so what is the big deal.

I am an atheist well known on here don't hide it and yes i think some people have gone a bit ott on this but if she had done what she was told there wouldn't be a problem thats the basic issue here not religion or the freedom of religion in this country it is about an employee being given an order and not complyng with that and just because she was offering prayers should not mean she gets any special consideration.

I couldn't have put it better Rizzy, lest people forget she is in a position of power ministering to sick people, how many people have not complained about her behavior for fear of causing a stink?
If her beliefs are that important that she can't separate them from her work, maybe a change of vocation is in order.
Oh and before I'm accused of wanting to dehumanize her, I'd suggest its perfectly simple to be compassionate and caring without invoking religion on her patients...surely thats not asking too much.