Coronavirus (OLD)

[nomadking]

Originally Posted by Mick

We are not talking about schools FFS.

You're not highlighting anything specific here that I don't already know and you're missing my point entirely.

I still stand by that the statement of "anybody can go to work" is not at all accurate, especially when many industries have been ordered shut and should not even be open.

We are in a lock down for a reason, it doesn't mean all and sundry can ignore it and still carry on going to work, else wtf is the point of a lockdown if everyone carried on going to work, because they're allowed to. Wrong!

So if Joe Bloggs, is seen out and about during this lock down and is stopped by the Police, they ask the purpose of the journey, and Joe replies, work, they won't leave it there, they will ask what kind of work, if Joe says he is going to go work in an industry not considered essential, he could still be fined.

Perhaps you should look at your own posts #1520, #1545, #1555.
You claimed only essential workers could go out to work, and used a link to try and back that up. The link explains key workers in the context of whose kids can go to school and/or nursery.

Originally Posted by Mythica

Joe might want to direct the police to the government.

"The government is not saying only people doing “essential” work can go to work. Anyone who cannot work from home can still go to work."

https://www.gov.uk/government/public...-or-go-to-work

Does not matter, he could still face being fined or advised that his journey is not essential.

I am sticking by what I say.

Not everyone can go to work. We're in a lockdown, that means non-essential travel, including to work premises not considered essential and or even permitted to be open and there is many that should not be.

I mean even my employers, I've stated on here, I work in the healthcare sector, they have given me a letter headed statement with my full name on and ID on, FAO the Police, saying that I am an essential worker and should be allowed to travel to and from work. Hence the key word "Essential". I did ask why I needed this paperwork and I was told other colleagues in the country were facing problems with the police doing random spot checks on peoples purpose of travel.

---------- Post added at 21:36 ---------- Previous post was at 21:31 ----------

Originally Posted by nomadking

Perhaps you should look at your own posts #1520, #1545, #1555.
You claimed only essential workers could go out to work, and used a link to try and back that up. The link explains key workers in the context of whose kids can go to school and/or nursery.

Perhaps I don't need to.

Nope, I know I do not. There, hows that for you?

And in that same link, it says what should be shut and open and what exceptions there are, this "anybody can go to work" line just isn't accurate when most things have been ordered shut in a lockdown. Again, you're not highlighting anything specific.

[nomadking]

Originally Posted by Mick

Does not matter, he could still face being fined or advised that his journey is not essential.

I am sticking by what I say.

Not everyone can go to work. We're in a lockdown, that means non-essential travel, including to work premises not considered essential and or even permitted to be open and there is many that should not be.

I mean even my employers, I've stated on here, I work in the healthcare sector, they have given me a letter headed statement with my full name on and ID on, FAO the Police, saying that I am an essential worker and should be allowed to travel to and from work. Hence the key word "Essential". I did ask why I needed this paperwork and I was told other colleagues in the country were facing problems with the police doing random spot checks on peoples purpose of travel.

They weren't looking out for non-essential workers. Even essential workers can be travelling for non-essential reasons. Being classed as being essential doesn't give them a free pass to do what they like.


Your post #1545 was in response to a post by "TheDaddy", which said "When was that rule changed, thought you could go to work as long as you couldn't do it from home". Your response started with "Only essential work:-" and then gave a list. You were saying only those essential workers could travel. That is incorrect.

[Mythica]

Originally Posted by Mick

Does not matter, he could still face being fined or advised that his journey is not essential.

I am sticking by what I say.

Not everyone can go to work. We're in a lockdown, that means non-essential travel, including to work premises not considered essential and or even permitted to be open and there is many that should not be.

I mean even my employers, I've stated on here, I work in the healthcare sector, they have given me a letter headed statement with my full name on and ID on, FAO the Police, saying that I am an essential worker and should be allowed to travel to and from work. Hence the key word "Essential". I did ask why I needed this paperwork and I was told other colleagues in the country were facing problems with the police doing random spot checks on peoples purpose of travel.

Well it does matter, really, doesn't it. Considering you're sticking to what you say which in post 1545 stated -

"only essential work"

and in post 1566 you stated -

"So if you go against government instructions, it's no longer advice and your work is not considered essential, good luck with the police if they stop you."

Yet straight from the government website they state -

"The government is not saying only people doing “essential” work can go to work. Anyone who cannot work from home can still go to work."

Originally Posted by nomadking

They weren't looking out for non-essential workers. Even essential workers can be travelling for non-essential reasons. Being classed as being essential doesn't give them a free pass to do what they like.


Your post #1545 was in response to a post by "TheDaddy", which said "When was that rule changed, thought you could go to work as long as you couldn't do it from home". Your response started with "Only essential work:-" and then gave a list. You were saying only those essential workers could travel. That is incorrect.

Nope that is correct.... just give up, you will not change my view.

We'll see if folk get fined then, for travelling to places of work that are not essential/permitted to be open.

And I never said anything about getting a free pass so don't know wtf you're on about on this one.

---------- Post added at 21:48 ---------- Previous post was at 21:47 ----------

Originally Posted by Mythica

Well it does matter, really, doesn't it. Considering you're sticking to what you say which in post 1545 stated -

"only essential work"

and in post 1566 you stated -

"So if you go against government instructions, it's no longer advice and your work is not considered essential, good luck with the police if they stop you."

Yet straight from the government website they state -

"The government is not saying only people doing “essential” work can go to work. Anyone who cannot work from home can still go to work."

You as well.

[Mythica]

Originally Posted by Mick

Nope that is correct.... just give up, you will not change my view.

We'll see if folk get fined then, for travelling to places of work that are not essential/permitted to be open.

And I never said anything about getting a free pass so don't know wtf you're on about on this one.

---------- Post added at 21:48 ---------- Previous post was at 21:47 ----------



You as well.

I'm correcting what you have typed. It's pointless posting incorrect information. I've linked directly to the government website to back up my correction.

It might not change your view but at least others reading it can see what is correct.

[1andrew1]

This is all very strange.

British officials took part in four meetings where EU projects to bulk-buy medical kit were discussed – the earliest in January, according to official minutes that heap doubt on government claims of missing an email.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...-say-officials

Un-Locked Again.

Stop arguing with each other in this topic.
Make your point, agree to disagree, move on.

If people cant behave and stop acting up, there will be more breaks.
I dont want to login to this topic every day to see a bunch of useless arguments between the same few people.

[heero_yuy]

This is an extract from a transcript of yesterdays R4 World at One interview with the former supreme court justice Johnathan Sumption QC:

BBC interviewer Jonny Dymond 'A hysterical slide into a police state. A shameful police force intruding with scant regard to common sense or tradition. An irrational overreaction driven by fear.' These are not the accusations of wild-eyed campaigners, they come from the lips of one our most eminent jurists Lord Sumption, former Justice of the Supreme Court. I spoke to him just before we came on air.

Lord Sumption: The real problem is that when human societies lose their freedom, it's not usually because tyrants have taken it away. It's usually because people willingly surrender their freedom in return for protection against some external threat. And the threat is usually a real threat but usually exaggerated. That's what I fear we are seeing now. The pressure on politicians has come from the public. They want action. They don't pause to ask whether the action will work. They don't ask themselves whether the cost will be worth paying. They want action anyway. And anyone who has studied history will recognise here the classic symptoms of collective hysteria. Hysteria is infectious. We are working ourselves up into a lather in which we exaggerate the threat and stop asking ourselves whether the cure may be worse than the disease.

When we call for action we should be careful what we wish for, we might just get it.

[jfman]

A rather reckless opinion piece for our state broadcaster to peddle at an anxious public where there's already significant difficulty in achieving compliance.

Do people really want the freedom to have our healthcare system overwhelmed like Italy? Compliance and sacrifice is a small temporary ask, for people who are generally quite privileged relative to the few billion people on the planet who live in relative poverty.

More compliance equates to a shorter need for any measures in place.

[Anonymouse]

Does anyone else here feel we've reached the stage where you can't help but think "Stop the world, I wanna get off"? I know I have. I reached it this morning.

To explain:

I happen to be a Key Worker; I even have a letter to that effect in case I'm stopped en route to work by the police (and yes, this is happening; at least two of our lads I know of have been stopped). This is because I work for a very large online electrical retailer, and someone has to load the delivery vans. That's us.

We receive trailers from Crewe stuffed with fridge freezers, washers, cookers and the like; we then truck these off each trailer as it arrives, sort out which item is going on which van, and load them accordingly. We don't have any stock on hand; we're what's known as an outbase, in Heywood. There are similar outbases in Spennymoor, Yaxley, Croydon and a few others - nine in total, I think.

All well and good so far, but here's where sense takes a left turn: last night we were shown a notice from Rochdale Borough Council, requiring our workplace to practice social distancing at work. Among other things, this means that only one person can be on a trailer at one time...so every time someone goes on there, the other two or three unloaders (tippers, we call 'em) have to wait until he's off, instead of at least two taking an item simultaneously. This is adding upwards of half an hour to the job of tipping each trailer.

I recall reading somewhere that the virus doesn't do well outdoors...and we practically are, because the loading bays are usually always open to the external yard and there is no internal heating. In fact it often feels colder in the warehouse than it does outside. So I'm not sure we're really that much at risk, to be honest. I may be wrong, I'm no expert, but that's the way it seems to me.

However, this possibly unnecessary measure wasn't what made me think the world's slipped a gear. That came when I caught the bus (now an hourly service, aaarrggghhh!!!) - and several of the seats were taped off, so you couldn't use them. In effect, the buses can't carry more than maybe a quarter of capacity, even though they're virtually empty anyway when I travel (late at night to work, and early in the morning from work).

So yeah, stop the world, I wanna get off!

[papa smurf]

Originally Posted by Anonymouse

Does anyone else here feel we've reached the stage where you can't help but think "Stop the world, I wanna get off"? I know I have. I reached it this morning.

To explain:

I happen to be a Key Worker; I even have a letter to that effect in case I'm stopped en route to work by the police (and yes, this is happening; at least two of our lads I know of have been stopped). This is because I work for a very large online electrical retailer, and someone has to load the delivery vans. That's us.

We receive trailers from Crewe stuffed with fridge freezers, washers, cookers and the like; we then truck these off each trailer as it arrives, sort out which item is going on which van, and load them accordingly. We don't have any stock on hand; we're what's known as an outbase, in Heywood. There are similar outbases in Spennymoor, Yaxley, Croydon and a few others - nine in total, I think.

All well and good so far, but here's where sense takes a left turn: last night we were shown a notice from Rochdale Borough Council, requiring our workplace to practice social distancing at work. Among other things, this means that only one person can be on a trailer at one time...so every time someone goes on there, the other two or three unloaders (tippers, we call 'em) have to wait until he's off, instead of at least two taking an item simultaneously. This is adding upwards of half an hour to the job of tipping each trailer.

I recall reading somewhere that the virus doesn't do well outdoors...and we practically are, because the loading bays are usually always open to the external yard and there is no internal heating. In fact it often feels colder in the warehouse than it does outside. So I'm not sure we're really that much at risk, to be honest. I may be wrong, I'm no expert, but that's the way it seems to me.

However, this possibly unnecessary measure wasn't what made me think the world's slipped a gear. That came when I caught the bus (now an hourly service, aaarrggghhh!!!) - and several of the seats were taped off, so you couldn't use them. In effect, the buses can't carry more than maybe a quarter of capacity, even though they're virtually empty anyway when I travel (late at night to work, and early in the morning from work).

So yeah, stop the world, I wanna get off!

Stay on it's just temporary.

[Pierre]

Originally Posted by heero_yuy

This is an extract from a transcript of yesterdays R4 World at One interview with the former supreme court justice Johnathan Sumption QC:



When we call for action we should be careful what we wish for, we might just get it.

He's right about this point.

The real problem is that when human societies lose their freedom, it's not usually because tyrants have taken it away. It's usually because people willingly surrender their freedom in return for protection against some external threat

Dictators are usually welcomes with open arms by the population........ at first.

I'm not suggesting were going down that road, but start nibbling away at freedoms and it can be bloody hard to get back.

I was thinking though, all the people that advocate "stop and search" but suddenly when it's them targeted...not such fans.

A little light-hearted fun.

[joglynne]

Keeping up with Hugh's more light-hearted take on this stressful subject I give you a link to one families take on social distancing.

https://www.kentonline.co.uk/faversh...uccess-224818/