Unpaid workschemes are illegal

Iain duncan smith is an idiot of the highest order this is not exactly new information in fact most of the current government love lecturing people on things they themselves would never do but feel it perfectly acceptable to tell others to do it. More i see of this lot more i lean to the argument they haven't got a clue about normal life. Look i am all for work experience in areas where someone can get a job and i haven't found a single unemployed person who doesn't support that. But stacking shelves for a couple of months with no job at the end of it is not work experience it's free labour for private companys and that i do have a problem with.

More so when the same company keeps taking people for it, if it needs doing that bad employ one of them and solve the problem the right way. Also this debate is full of people in decentish jobs telling all unemployed to take these "opputunities" even though if they were honest and the worst did happen they would not take them either.

[colin25]

Originally Posted by RizzyKing

Iain duncan smith is an idiot of the highest order this is not exactly new information in fact most of the current government love lecturing people on things they themselves would never do but feel it perfectly acceptable to tell others to do it. More i see of this lot more i lean to the argument they haven't got a clue about normal life. Look i am all for work experience in areas where someone can get a job and i haven't found a single unemployed person who doesn't support that. But stacking shelves for a couple of months with no job at the end of it is not work experience it's free labour for private companys and that i do have a problem with.

More so when the same company keeps taking people for it, if it needs doing that bad employ one of them and solve the problem the right way. Also this debate is full of people in decentish jobs telling all unemployed to take these "opputunities" even though if they were honest and the worst did happen they would not take them either.

I agree. Work experience is one thing, cheap labour another. This is blatant cheap labour

[darren.b]

I don't have a problem with people working for their benefits in principle but I am against the way it is currently being done.

The taxpayer foots the bill for these benefits, so the taxpayer should see something for their money. All across the country city centres are a mess. Broken roads, litter, grafitti etc. Why not have Local Authorities (councils) have the welfare recipients "work" for a set number of hours in relation the amount of handouts they get including housing and council tax benefit. If you receive a total benefit award of say £170 per week all in, then £170/<min wage> = your "community employment hours". Like a real job, failure to attend sees a deduction in your benefits.

Let's get them doing something useful and also learning skills, mending roads and so on instead of sitting at home watching Jeremy Kyle and moaning.

There are probably flaws in my idea, but there are flaws in the current system too

Originally Posted by darren.b

I

There are probably flaws in my idea, but there are flaws in the current system too

There are several flaws in your hypothesis. There are a number of shirkers who have no intention of doing a day of hard graft. There are those whom would prefer to work, but are unable to do so.

Originally Posted by jempalmer

There are several flaws in your hypothesis. There are a number of shirkers who have no intention of doing a day of hard graft. There are those whom would prefer to work, but are unable to do so.

I'd rather they did darren's idea than allow corporate business's get free labour gratis of the taxpayer.

[Arthurgray50@blu]

I will make several points on this concerning 'shirkers' and unpaid labour.

What this idiot from the Tories is trying to do is prove a point about the unemployed. Some will refuse to work as they are paid more on benefits and some that cannot get work.

When l was out of work for TWO years, yes l was on beneift, yes l was ordered to do schemes by the JC, BUT these schemes are a total waste of time, all they do is teach you how to approach an employer, how to write a CV, if you see a building site go and enquire who will be there ie supermarkets etc.

The scheme that you work for a company for FREE for up to a month or more to get your benefit. This to me is slave labour and should be totally banned. Companies get paid by the government to run these, companies are not stupid, if they know they will get a quid out of it they will.

My son who is diabled got a job with a well known store and was treated like a leper - yes not every company is the same.

IF that company gives you a contract at the end of the scheme - which is remote, then the schemes are not worth it.

My biggest theory is that new jobs of today are normaally through agencies, and the pay is rubbish and thats why people think that why should l work for nothing.

I worked very hard to get of the employment register and they still said l didn't work hard enough to get work - l loost two jobs due to the JC insisting that l signed on first.

[Gary L]

We need to stop looking at it the way they want us to.
it's not 'work experience and highly enjoyable' to those who are against it.

it's a scam to make companies who take advantage of the free slaves, extra profit by not having to pay somebody to do the work.
they're doing the exact same work non stop every day, all week, and every week till they get replaced by the next slave. that a person who they employ and pay a few hundred quid a week too.

so you're talking around £1,000 a month they've saved on every single slave they take from the government scam.
if they employed them at the end of the 'experience' then that particular company would be out the scam by now because there's just no room to take on anymore staff on the floor.

another thing that is interesting about all this, is whether the companies insurance policy is covering those that are not official employees on the premises.

we are all part of the scam by being ignorant to what's going on and going along with the it's punishment for them.
companies are saving millions of pounds of unpaid labour. and giving us horsemeat instead of beef!

'Slave' - get real.

[Gary L]

Originally Posted by Hugh

'Slave'

Yes. slave.

If something is done under threat doesn't slave work quite well end of the day even now we are told there are skill shortages and still no government will setup applicable training so we can fill those skills from within our own population why not. Nah far better to get more people in from abroad and make the unemployed in this country stack shelves and mop floors for poundland makes total sense doesn't it. Vast majority of people are not looking for a free ride they just want something good and something worth striving for it's not a lot to ask. Hell if we binned these private companys involved in the welfare system not only would we save a fortune but the money coould be put towards setting up proper training in those areas where we are short.

Originally Posted by RizzyKing

If something is done under threat doesn't slave work quite well.

Hardly ,the threat of losing money for not doing something is not even close to slavery and that sort of ridiculous comparison does nothing for the argument against government work schemes ,which as you say could be better .Many companies are offering apprenticeships ,the ones i have been involved with are in construction .The biggest problem i have found is that the trainees want big bucks from the get go and do not accept that they have to learn first

[Gary L]

Originally Posted by martyh

Hardly ,the threat of losing money for not doing something is not even close to slavery

That's most likely because you're thinking of the extreme slaves. like chained up and beaten.
which does nothing for the argument of slaves who are not chained up and beaten.



Slavery is a system under which people are treated as property to be bought and sold, and are forced to work.

Check.
The governments property. and distributed amongst employers and forced to work.

Slaves can be held against their will from the time of their capture, purchase or birth, and deprived of the right to leave.

Check.
If you walk off the site you get punished.
if you want to eat this week, then carry on working.

Opponents hope slavery can be eradicated within 30 years.

Check.
at least outside the UK anyway.

---------- Post added at 21:07 ---------- Previous post was at 20:52 ----------

Put it another way.

if thousands of these 'slaves' had their say for once. instead of various government faces saying (which they try to pretend is the feeling amongst all the slaves) they enjoy it! it gives them confidence! (slight glimpse of a worker being struck in the background) it makes them feel that they're bettering themselves!

if they were given a chance to speak out for themselves. and they said we're treated like slaves. we're doing hard work that the person we're working along side is getting £300 a week whilst we're doing his job for £71.

many people would say "you're not supposed to like it you lazy bums. it's meant to punish you for being the lazy bums that you all are!"

Slaves being punished.