School stands up for discipline and rules - Page 10

07-06-2005, 21:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by paulyoung666

i give up , you will always be right

, you will always be right , you will never be wrong , i hope you enjoy your perfect world

I didn`t say I've *never* made a mistake, only that I did not make a mistake in this particular instance. Yes, strictly speaking I acted incorrectly, but that was a deliberate act that led to victory. I simply cannot define that as a mistake.

**Paul** · 07-06-2005, 21:34

The personal arguments will stop now

Back on topic please.

nffc · 07-06-2005, 22:15

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Originally Posted by Graham

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Originally Posted by nffc

Bleh.... we don't know the history do we.

No, but then you immediately go on to speculate...!

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They'd presumably also been told to wear full school uniform

Speculation.

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and if they weren't, they'd be refused entry into exams!

Speculation.

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And let's not forget he was also offered a choice.

A "choice" that was not a reasonable choice at all.

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Spare shoes, that DID fit in the regulations- which he turned down for alleged "medical reasons".

"Alleged", implying that there weren't really reasons. More speculation.

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He had the choice to take the exam in the spare shoes or to not take it in his chavwear,

"Chavwear". Yet more speculation. (If they had been so blatantly "chavvy" I doubt very much he'd have got away with it for so long, but looking at the picture which, I presume, are the trainers in question, it's not as if they're bright white or similar.)

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he chose to walk out.

He was offered a "choice" between "wear someone else's shoes" (not something I would choose to do whether I had a medical condition or not) and "go home and come back", it isn't really much of a choice.

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Which provokes a few thoughts...

Read "speculations based on no evidence".

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He may have also had warnings about not wearing proper uniform *not necessarily footwear* in the past,

Any evidence of these? Nope. Just speculation.

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the school may also have a zero tolerance policy in exams.

In which case it should have been made perfectly clear, which doesn't sound as if it was the case from what the article says.

And, frankly, having ZT policies in exams but not for the rest of the school year sounds a pretty silly idea to me.

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As it stands, we have a brief one-sided account of the incident.

Yes, that is, at least, correct.

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It would be interesting to see detailed statements from both sides, and also if there's any history, because apart from what we know, there's little about the incident itself.

I agree.

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Personally I feel the school were right sticking up for the rules but OK, if others feel Little Johnny is able to get away with whatever he wants to and has a right to sit exams regardless, etc etc, than that's fair enough- but boy, the PC brigade is really beginning to really **** me off!

And boy, the "string them up brigade" are ****ing me off too.

Has *ANYONE* said that he should be "able to get away with whatever he wants to and has a right to sit exams regardless"? No.

Please don't try to put words into people's mouths it doesn't help your arguments.
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Quote:

Originally Posted by paulyoung666

it seems to me the ones who do not have kids are the ones making the stupid opnions!

Thank you for that constructive contribution to the debate.

err, excuse me whilst I choke on the irony

paulyoung666 · 07-06-2005, 22:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by nffc

err, excuse me whilst I choke on the irony

and i choke on this thread , time to unsubscribe methinks

Monster Jedi · 08-06-2005, 00:06

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Originally Posted by Incognitas

Well as a parent myself, to me, you are a bluddy nightmare...And if you ever tried to smack me in the mouth I'd lay you out.

bring it on
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No, you should go to anger management classes you plonker.[/QUOTE]

could I use you as a punchbag then

danielf · 08-06-2005, 00:09

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Originally Posted by Monster Jedi

bring it on
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No, you should go to anger management classes you plonker.

could I use you as a punchbag then

This is not an unpopularity contest you know?

08-06-2005, 00:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by danielf

This is not an unpopularity contest you know?

I know who is listening to baker street by gerry rafferty

Lord Nikon · 08-06-2005, 01:27

Quite frankly I think the school overreacted. Exam times can be stressful, and omissions like wearing the wrong shoes can be expected. Could have been worse. What (IMO) they should have done is told him to rectify it prior to his next exam, or the next day. Sounds like whoever made the decision was being a 'jobsworth' really.

At the end of the day, a certain amount of flexibility doesn't go amiss. But the situation gets blown out of all realistic proportion, with some kids going to court and gaining the right to wear a jibab at school, other kids being allowed to bend / break uniform regulations based on religion etc, if the rules are to be enforced they must be enforced for ALL pupils with no flexibility for certain ones, or they must be flexible for all. Uniform was created to bring uniformity to school atire. If they can state that all pupils were adhering 100% to the uniform rule at that school, and that he was the only exception, then yes, he was excluded from the exam justifiably, but I am willing to bet he wasn't the only one, merely the only one they excluded

Graham · 08-06-2005, 02:36

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Originally Posted by nffc

err, excuse me whilst I choke on the irony

To quote Inigo Montoya:

"You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means..."

allieyoung666 · 08-06-2005, 07:24

Look the parents mother must not think much to school rules if she sent that boy to school in traniners, it is disrespectful to the school and it faulnts the rules that the school has set out.
I agree with coggy and we are both hard work professionals anyone has a go I will gladly go and lay them out in the car park after work, hey it aint a problem!

08-06-2005, 08:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by allieyoung666

I agree with coggy and we are both hard work professionals anyone has a go I will gladly go and lay them out in the car park after work, hey it aint a problem!

Hardly a professional attitude if you claim you will "lay them out in the car park". In my mind the threat of violence is a lot worse than wearing incorrect shoes. I fear that you have your priorities all screwed up.

orangebird · 08-06-2005, 08:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by allieyoung666

Look the parents mother must not think much to school rules if she sent that boy to school in traniners, it is disrespectful to the school and it faulnts the rules that the school has set out.
I agree with coggy and we are both hard work professionals anyone has a go I will gladly go and lay them out in the car park after work, hey it aint a problem!

I'm a hardworking person too Allie. And no, I don't have children - but this does not make my opinion any less valid than yours. I did used to have to wear a school uniform when I was at school.. I didn't always get it perfectly right though. Mainly because money was tight for my parents back then and the option of owning school shoes & 'playing out' shoes wasn't really there, so I wore whatever were decent. But my parents would NEVER have accepted the school dismiss me from an exam just becaue I had the wrong colour/style of shirt/socks/shoes etc. Bullies get less discipline these days in school than the poor sod in this article did. I never realised there was such a bunch of little Hitlers on here

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Quote:

Originally Posted by dr wadd

Hardly a professional attitude if you claim you will "lay them out in the car park". In my mind the threat of violence is a lot worse than wearing incorrect shoes. I fear that you have your priorities all screwed up.

Bloody hell, have a greenie on me

**Maggy** · 08-06-2005, 08:54

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allieyoung666. Look the parents mother must not think much to school rules if she sent that boy to school in traniners, it is disrespectful to the school and it faulnts the rules that the school has set out.
I agree with coggy and we are both hard work professionals anyone has a go I will gladly go and lay them out in the car park after work, hey it aint a problem!

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dr wadd. Hardly a professional attitude if you claim you will "lay them out in the car park". In my mind the threat of violence is a lot worse than wearing incorrect shoes. I fear that you have your priorities all screwed up.

Don't drag me into this please.I merely suggested in response to one person who was suggesting that violence against teaching staff was a solution that if anyone DID attack me I would be most errr.. 'vigorous' in my response.

Pierre · 08-06-2005, 09:18

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Originally Posted by Graham

I'm not sure what your point is here. On the one hand we have the "Daily Mail" speculation that (paraphrased) "if we let the little buggers have an inch they'll take a mile and society will fall down around our ears" (something which doesn't actually seem to have happened) wheras on the other we have the evidence of children, especially those from minorities, being excluded from schools and, having nothing better to do/ no better guidance and ending up becoming criminals.

Perhaps you just jumped to a conclusion there?

Not at all,it was just an aside that I found amusing.

You were quite happy to deride the poster as a Daily Mail reader (the proposed chain of events he posted was not a quote from the Daily Mail) for logging a possible but not a totally likely, or proven, chain of events that might happen if we don't enforce rules onto children.

And in the same post was quite happy to take on board and equally unproven and equally improbable
chain of events that might happen by disciplining the child as your counter argument.

There is certainly no more evidence in the quote you posted to prove that excluded children all go on to be criminals than there was in the other post to prove that society would crumble.

allieyoung666 · 08-06-2005, 09:37

really sorry for being a swot when I was at school then. It isnt that hard to stick to a uniform is it?? Sorry Coogy didnt mean to drag you in. I have a very professional atitude thank you very much and people always comment on it when I am at work. What sort of Dr are you??? I do not think you a medical? so what sort are you???
It is down to respect and rules and before you bleat on about dont you ever break them, well no as it is more than my jobs worth and I enjoy doing it, so why risk losing it!
Outside of work is totally different as I let my hair down, so breaking a few rules wont hurt! Please do not make comments about my priorities as you do not know me and to be honest I couldnt give a damn. Like Paul said before are you perfect as you seem to think you are making rude comments like that. The boy needs to be taught rules, and that is simple.