smoking and the pub

[clarie]

I am all for a ban on smoking in public places - indoors ones that is. I find it an awful smell, and it is obviously a risk to my health (passive smoking). It might well be enjoyable to have a pint and a fag (and as an ex-smoker who has converted I do know) but that enjoyment can hardly be weighed against the repulsive smells and high risks to those around you (not to mention you yourself although obviously if you want to take that risk its up to you). If people want to smoke they should go outside, and I don't see why that is such a difficult concept to grasp. Non-smoking areas don't work, the smoke still travels. In this day and age we know enough about the risks of smoking to the health for there to be crackdowns on smoking in public places. I hate coming home stinking of smoke and I hate fag ends all over the place. Just this morning I saw a woman sitting outside her house smoking, only to then chuck then butt onto the pavement rather than on her property.


Disgrace.

[Sarge]

We have had no smoking in government buildings for years, but I just heard that New York did the same thing. I am a non smoker but to be honest, I really don't care if people want to smoke in bars. My wife smokes a carton per week, but she does it in the basement. I don't sit in bars long enough to get cancer from second hand smoke, if I did, maybe I should think about my liver more than secondhand smoke.

I don't go into smoky environments much these days (usually I have two very young children in tow) but on Saturday we visited the Ideal Homes Show at the SECC in Glasgow, where smoking is permitted in the entire mall area outside the exhibition halls themselves (where there are cafes, toilets, shops etc). We were sat for a while having a coffee while Mrs T gave our wee girl her milk and it was dreadful. The woman at the next table was practically chain smoking and at least one person in each party that came and sat at any of the tables nearby was a smoker.

Smoking is a bigger problem here in Scotland than in England and I am so glad that the government here has decided to just get on and slap a ban on all smoking in public. It comes into force next year and I can't wait. I just don't understand why it is that the regime in Whitehall seems unable to take any similarly decisive action for England.

[Hom3r]

I think that there should be a total smoking ban inside all public places and no smoking within 5 metres of any building (where I worked they not only smoked outside the smoke would enter the biulding but they smoked outside a building that had highly flamible liquids.)

I have found the a large majority (Not all) think that its there god given right to some anywhere the want and stuff the people around them, I've had people blowing smoke into my direction because they had a non smoker around them and didn't want to upset them.

Smoking is a dirty and discusting habit which killed both my nans (they suffered strokes and took about six months to die)

[clarie]

Originally Posted by david.ewles

I think that there should be a total smoking ban inside all public places and no smoking within 5 metres of any building (where I worked they not only smoked outside the smoke would enter the biulding but they smoked outside a building that had highly flamible liquids.)

I have found the a large majority (Not all) think that its there god given right to some anywhere the want and stuff the people around them, I've had people blowing smoke into my direction because they had a non smoker around them and didn't want to upset them.

Smoking is a dirty and discusting habit which killed both my nans (they suffered strokes and took about six months to die)

Hear Hear. I gave up smoking, and not because I didn't enjoy it, but because I didn't want to damage my health any longer. Millions of people don't smoke because of the same reason. So it's not very fair for those who choose to continue to smoke to poison us with their smoke.

[orangebird]

Originally Posted by clarie

Hear Hear. I gave up smoking, and not because I didn't enjoy it, but because I didn't want to damage my health any longer. Millions of people don't smoke because of the same reason. So it's not very fair for those who choose to continue to smoke to poison us with their smoke.

Why don't you start a new thread about car fumes killing you too? And another one about how you're teetotal because of the potentially devasting effects that alcohol can have?

[clarie]

Originally Posted by orangebird

Why don't you start a new thread about car fumes killing you too? And another one about how you're teetotal because of the potentially devasting effects that alcohol can have?

Because that isn't what I want to discuss. Nor is it related to this thread. Smoking is something that we all know carries a very high risk to the health. And at the moment we have a choice to reduce that risk. Once an alternative is brought into the market for petrol-run cars, then we'll talk. As for alcohol, I drink very little of that these days, and my drinking it doesn't have a direct impact on someone else's health (unless I drove for example which I wouldn't do.)

[orangebird]

Originally Posted by clarie

Because that isn't what I want to discuss. Nor is it related to this thread.

Um, yeah, that's why I suggested starting another thread...

Smoking is something that we all know carries a very high risk to the health. And at the moment we have a choice to reduce that risk.

Yes, by voluntarily giving up. Not being bullied by a nanny state. Where's the choice for business owners to decide what their customers do on their own premises?

Once an alternative is brought into the market for petrol-run cars, then we'll talk.

There are already alternatives, LPG and electric just two of them. So, those who drive petrol cars are poisoning you, and they have the CHOICE not to. Want to talk about that now? In another thread of course.

As for alcohol, I drink very little of that these days, and my drinking it doesn't have a direct impact on someone else's health (unless I drove for example which I wouldn't do.)

Good for you.

[Hom3r]

Originally Posted by orangebird

There are already alternatives, LPG and electric just two of them. So, those who drive petrol cars are poisoning you, and they have the CHOICE not to. Want to talk about that now? In another thread of course.

Unfortunatley LPG isn't that widley available at the moment, (only 1 place where I lives sells it) also unless your car is fairly new you cannot get a grant to convert it, and will need to fork out around £2000

[clarie]

Originally Posted by orangebird

Quote:

There are already alternatives, LPG and electric just two of them. So, those who drive petrol cars are poisoning you, and they have the CHOICE not to. Want to talk about that now? In another thread of course.

Yes but they are not widely available are they? And they're not cheap. The people who poison me with cigarettes are actually paying for the privilege of doing so.

Originally Posted by orangebird

Yes, by voluntarily giving up. Not being bullied by a nanny state. Where's the choice for business owners to decide what their customers do on their own premises?

I was referring to passive smoking. I am not suggesting you should be forced into giving up. That, as you say, should be voluntary. But I don't think that prohibiting smokers from poisoning non-smokers with their smoke is 'bullying', it's just sensible.

[orangebird]

Originally Posted by david.ewles

Unfortunatley LPG isn't that widley available at the moment, (only 1 place where I lives sells it) also unless your car is fairly new you cannot get a grant to convert it, and will need to fork out around £2000

There are 1400 petrol stations that supply LPG. I wouldn't call that 'not widely available'.

As for the cost - so it comes down to 'I'll do my bit for the environment and everyone else's health as long as I don't have to fork out for it, or put myself out too much.....'

Originally Posted by orangebird

Why don't you start a new thread about car fumes killing you too? And another one about how you're teetotal because of the potentially devasting effects that alcohol can have?

I think it's a matter of degrees OB. Yes, cars and alcohol (amongst many other things) have a detrimental effect on health and/or the environment, but smoking is the single biggest cause of preventable, premature death in this country, by quite some way. The costs to society and the economy are vast, and I think banning smoking in public is a long overdue, but thoroughly proportionate, response to it.

[clarie]

Originally Posted by orangebird

As for the cost - so it comes down to 'I'll do my bit for the environment and everyone else's health as long as I don't have to fork out for it, or put myself out too much.....'

It's not always a choice though is it? I can't even afford a car at the moment, let alone an environmentally sound one.

Yet smokers are literally coughing up money every day to poison themselves and others.

[orangebird]

Originally Posted by clarie

It's not always a choice though is it? I can't even afford a car at the moment, let alone an environmentally sound one.

Yet smokers are literally coughing up money every day to poison themselves and others.

And the tax that is paid in cigarettes more than makes up for the cost.
__________________

Originally Posted by clarie

It's not always a choice though is it? I can't even afford a car at the moment, let alone an environmentally sound one.

Yet smokers are literally coughing up money every day to poison themselves and others.

I can afford to smoke and run a car. And with all the tax that I pay out for these luxuries, I should bloody well have a choice of what I can or can't do in my own local.

[clarie]

Originally Posted by orangebird

And the tax that is paid in cigarettes more than makes up for the cost.

Doesn't make up for the cost to my health! Or yours for that matter.

Originally Posted by orangebird

I can afford to smoke and run a car. And with all the tax that I pay out for these luxuries, I should bloody well have a choice of what I can or can't do in my own local.

The tax you pay on cigarettes is entirely voluntary and if you don't want to pay it there is a simple solution. The fact that you choose to spend ridiculous amounts of money on cigarettes does not, in my opinion, give you the right to smoke away in front of my nose. As I say this is just my opinion though.