Climate Change

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by Pierre

Yes, I wouldn’t dump the BP & Shell shares just yet. This country will look like Cuba in 30/40 years with people still running petrol/diesel motors long after they’ve stopped making them.

That probably depends on fuel prices and availability of petrol and diesel. If road pricing is introduced as anticipated then diesel and petrol cars could be expensive to run.

[Carth]

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

That probably depends on fuel prices and availability of petrol and diesel. If road pricing is introduced as anticipated then diesel and petrol cars could be expensive to run.

Nah, unless the Govt. tax it to the maximum it'll be a good price.
Look at around a year ago when nobody was buying it . . they were almost giving it away

[jonbxx]

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

It’s not like a thermostat! If we start interfering to this extent with natural processes, we could trigger the ice age that was predicted in the 1960s.

But do you agree or disagree on the science I listed;

• Does solar heating of the earth surface cause radiation of long wavelength infra red light?
• Is this light absorbed by the atmosphere or escape in to space? - some is absorbed by the atmosphere, some escapes in to space
• What molecules in the atmosphere absorb this light? - water, carbon dioxide, methane and ozone
• What happens when this light is absorbed? - it is re-radiated in all directions, including back to the surface
• Are these molecules effectively global insulation? - yes, the Earth should have an average surface temperature of -18°C
• Is it reasonable to expect the concentration of molecules that form this insulation will have an effect on the insulation effect - yes

If atmospheric greenhouse gasses are not the cause of the historical rise in global temperature, acknowledging that correlation and causation are not always linked, what else could be causing the global temperature rise?

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by Carth

Nah, unless the Govt. tax it to the maximum it'll be a good price.
Look at around a year ago when nobody was buying it . . they were almost giving it away

Once you've got a lot of second hand EVs available at good prices then it will be far cheaper to drive one than petrol vehicles, both in fuel costs and maintenance. And as new EVs become mainstream, their prices will reduce. Government's taxation will shift from fuel towards road pricing but it is unlikely to reduce tax on petrol and diesel.

[Carth]

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

Once you've got a lot of second hand EVs available at good prices then it will be far cheaper to drive one than petrol vehicles, both in fuel costs and maintenance. And as new EVs become mainstream, their prices will reduce. Government's taxation will shift from fuel towards road pricing but it is unlikely to reduce tax on petrol and diesel.

How long is the average battery life on an EV?
Can batteries be replaced on an EV?
What do we do with the old EV batteries?

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by Carth

How long is the average battery life on an EV?
Can batteries be replaced on an EV?
What do we do with the old EV batteries?

They can be replaced. Don't know what we do with EV batteries but rightly or wrongly, it's the direction we're going.
Importantly costs and performance will improve as it becomes mainstream.
At that stage the government is likely to introduce road tax.

Originally Posted by Carth

How long is the average battery life on an EV?
Can batteries be replaced on an EV?
What do we do with the old EV batteries?

Depends on the battery but range is likely to be a problem after 10 years.
Yes, the battery can be replaced.
They can be recycled although it’s a difficult process.
Google is your friend.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-56574779

[papa smurf]

Originally Posted by Carth

How long is the average battery life on an EV?
Can batteries be replaced on an EV?
What do we do with the old EV batteries?

Chuck em in the sea like we do with everything we don't want.

---------- Post added at 11:40 ---------- Previous post was at 11:15 ----------

And what does Greta say

https://www.theguardian.com/environm...at-cop26-video

[Pierre]

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

They can be replaced. Don't know what we do with EV batteries but rightly or wrongly, it's the direction we're going.
Importantly costs and performance will improve as it becomes mainstream.
At that stage the government is likely to introduce road tax.

Battery life, depending on the make/ model/ use etc is projected to be anywhere between 185,000 - 500,000 miles.

Cost of replacing a battery can be anywhere between £9K - 20K

So suddenly those cheap second hand EV's don't look so attractive.

That said, in the great scheme of things, it's not a million miles away from the kind of decisions you have to make with the economic life of liquid fuelled cars.

[OLD BOY]

Originally Posted by Carth

I've decided to play the game, as they do.

I declare, and promise, that by 2050 I will no longer use any type of power for heating, lighting and cooking. I will no longer leave electrical appliances plugged in overnight, and will no longer use transport of any mode to travel around. I will also no longer eat meat, fish, vegetables or drink the water that will (by then) probably be in short supply.

There, I think that's covered it . . go me

Do you not expect to be around in 2050, Carth?

Originally Posted by Pierre

Battery life, depending on the make/ model/ use etc is projected to be anywhere between 185,000 - 500,000 miles.

Cost of replacing a battery can be anywhere between £9K - 20K

So suddenly those cheap second hand EV's don't look so attractive.

That said, in the great scheme of things, it's not a million miles away from the kind of decisions you have to make with the economic life of liquid fuelled cars.

EVs are developing so rapidly I suspect their second hand value will plummet. If I were in the market for one now I think I’d be looking for a lease of some sort.

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by Chris

EVs are developing so rapidly I suspect their second hand value will plummet. If I were in the market for one now I think I’d be looking for a lease of some sort.

I think that's the way most new cars are sold these days. EVs are now comparable on leases cost-wise but have lower running costs.

[Pierre]

Originally Posted by Pierre

your correcting yourself there, as I was referencing Boris's speech and simply stating that we were told pretty much the same thing decades ago (I wasn't referring to nuclear armageddon) so don't let your personal bias spoil my diatribe.



I care, but my point, which you must have heard as it whistled over your head..... is that we've heard it all before, many, many ,many times.

and the end hasn't come. So all they do ratchet up the extreme rhetoric.

I'm not a climate change sceptic, how can you be ? Climate changes that's a fact. What I am is a politician and (some) scientists sceptic. As their track record isn't great.

Here's some of their greatest hits.

https://cei.org/blog/wrong-again-50-...c-predictions/

Has no one ever heard of the boy that cried wolf?

I'm all for a sensible non-sensationalist/ extremist debate on the future and what we can do and what technologies we can produce. As the debate is always around - drive less, fly less, eat less, buy less, build less - we are very resourceful and inventive mammal and I'm sure we'll work out solutions to problems.

We're heading in the right direction, but I don't agree we have to race there, or set arbitrary dates to reach certain targets.

We need to build several new nuclear plants, lets work on reducing the cost of those. Let's wait until the technology of air-source heat pumps is mature and we know they're going to work.

Let's invest in tidal power, the most overlooked renewable there is. Criminally for this island. As long as the Moon and Earth dance with each other we have a predictable power source. Invest in it. I'd rather have a tidal power plant than HS2.

This circus in Glasgow is virtue signaling of the most repulsive type, I actually agree with Greta it's all talk and no real action. Action on things that will really make a difference. Not penalising normal people for wanting to live their lives.

Caring about Climate change is a privileged position, for those that can afford to.

All of the climate change hysteria should be balanced out with input from others.

Note: this guy is not a climate change sceptic.

https://www.lomborg.com/

[Carth]

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

Do you not expect to be around in 2050, Carth?

I'd be 96 if I got there, probably wouldn't have a clue what was going on anyway

[Hom3r]

I'm not surprised the media has ignored this statement made by the late David Bellamy