UK & EU Agree Post-Brexit Trade Deal

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by Pierre

So from all of that there are two lines of information that are not just speculation.

I think I’ll still sleep easy tonight.

That's because it's not a GCSE history text book but a forward-looking document.

[Pierre]

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

That's because it's not a GCSE history text book but a forward-looking document.

Still speculative.

Change the could’s and may’s to will’s and have’s and it may be an article to take notice of.

[Carth]

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

Terrifying scoop from The Sun on Sunday. Shows why we need to extend the transisition period.

Found it difficult not to chuckle at the 'scoop' from the Sun . .

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

That's because it's not a GCSE history text book but a forward-looking document.

But that one had me laughing out loud, the cat still won't come near me

[OLD BOY]

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

You're right, The Sun will jump ship if sees it's heading towards an iceberg as it will only lose readers if it doesn't.

This could though be a deliberate leak to prepare the public for the worst.

I'll get my order in now for the Christmas turkey then..

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

I'll get my order in now for the Christmas turkey then..

Would be a better use of your energy to lobby Redwood for an extension.

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

Would be a better use of your energy to lobby Redwood for an extension.

[OLD BOY]

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

Would be a better use of your energy to lobby Redwood for an extension.

An extension will not get us any further. There has been quite sufficient time to get an agreement. The EU is just trying to wear us down and an extension will play into their hands. We're done with that game. We'll either get an agreement or we won't, but it would be amazing if the EU decided to shoot itself in the foot.

Of course, negotiations could be extended provided it did not prevent us from going it alone on the date already set. Perhaps we will get more reality into the situation negotiating as an independent country, underlining the fact that we no longer accept EU rules and asserting they will get no fishing rights whatsoever until a deal is done, etc, etc.

[Sephiroth]

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

An extension will not get us any further. There has been quite sufficient time to get an agreement. The EU is just trying to wear us down and an extension will play into their hands. We're done with that game. We'll either get an agreement or we won't, but it would be amazing if the EU decided to shoot itself in the foot.

Of course, negotiations could be extended provided it did not prevent us from going it alone on the date already set. Perhaps we will get more reality into the situation negotiating as an independent country, underlining the fact that we no longer accept EU rules and asserting they will get no fishing rights whatsoever until a deal is done, etc, etc.

Pretty much what I think.

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

An extension will not get us any further. There has been quite sufficient time to get an agreement. The EU is just trying to wear us down and an extension will play into their hands. We're done with that game. We'll either get an agreement or we won't, but it would be amazing if the EU decided to shoot itself in the foot.

Of course, negotiations could be extended provided it did not prevent us from going it alone on the date already set. Perhaps we will get more reality into the situation negotiating as an independent country, underlining the fact that we no longer accept EU rules and asserting they will get no fishing rights whatsoever until a deal is done, etc, etc.

Despite your previous confidence about multi-tasking the Government's shown itself to be incapable of handling the pandemic or Brexit effectively. Johnson promised a deal in July and the world-beating app in June. he's delivered on neither. Even Conservative Party supporters on this forum have stepped forward to acknowledge the Government's regrettable failings in handling the Coronavirus.

The Government needs to focus on the pandemic this year and can then focus on getting the best deal possible with the EU next year.

Of course, if we fully left the EU this year we would still have to negotiate tons of small deals with the EU in future years. But from a position of weakness and with reduced bandwidth as we deal with the issues of no-deal and minimal goodwill from the EU.

At the current rate, Johnson will just roll over again and concede to the EU at the last minute, as he did when he threw the DUP under the bus. Even he's not daft enough to entertain no deal but doubtless will have looked the other way when the no-deal document was leaked as it suggests to the EU we are serious about no-deal. His last card when negotiating with the EU.

[Carth]

In all seriousness, I would think that giving in to the EU and the 'Remainers' shouting for an extension would be political suicide.

Yes the Gov't are on shaky ground with some of the virus decisions taken, but that's a fluctuating mess in most countries.

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by Carth

In all seriousness, I would think that giving in to the EU and the 'Remainers' shouting for an extension would be political suicide.

Yes the Gov't are on shaky ground with some of the virus decisions taken, but that's a fluctuating mess in most countries.

The EU's not asking for an extension and we're all leavers now. It's not the 2016 contest all over again, it's about putting us in a better decision to negotiate and handle Covid, not giving into anyone.
We rank poorly with most of our Western European peers for Covid 19. Ireland's had an app for months, for example.

[Sephiroth]

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

The EU's not asking for an extension and we're all leavers now. It's not the 2016 contest all over again, it's about putting us in a better decision to negotiate and handle Covid, not giving into anyone.
We rank poorly with most of our Western European peers for Covid 19. Ireland's had an app for months, for example.

You're mixing it all up, though I understand that you purport to think that the government is not sufficiently competent to handle both Brexit and CV adequately.

But the political dimensions is very important. Any extension would unnecessarily shuffle even more dosh the way of the EU, on their terms and would strengthen the EU's negotiating position. That's enough ground for not extending. Indeed, going to the wire is a basic principle for this type of negotiation.

[GrimUpNorth]

Originally Posted by Sephiroth

You're mixing it all up, though I understand that you purport to think that the government is not sufficiently competent to handle both Brexit and CV adequately.

But the political dimensions is very important. Any extension would unnecessarily shuffle even more dosh the way of the EU, on their terms and would strengthen the EU's negotiating position. That's enough ground for not extending. Indeed, going to the wire is a basic principle for this type of negotiation.

Are you implying you believe the EU will 'fold' at the last minute? If so why, and what makes you think the UK wont blink first? At the end of the day there are plenty of other (none British) fish in the sea and if the EU stop buying our fish is Borris going to suggest that the government should 'let us eat fish' (in his best Marie-Antoinette voice)?

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by Sephiroth

You're mixing it all up, though I understand that you purport to think that the government is not sufficiently competent to handle both Brexit and CV adequately.

But the political dimensions is very important. Any extension would unnecessarily shuffle even more dosh the way of the EU, on their terms and would strengthen the EU's negotiating position. That's enough ground for not extending. Indeed, going to the wire is a basic principle for this type of negotiation.

I think the evidence has shown and indeed you have acknowledged that the government has not handled the Covid 19 crisis as well as it might. Track and trace, exams fiasco, PPE purchasing, non-working app, late lockdown, nursing homes scandal, high excess death rate...just one of these alone proves the point.

We can't win a good deal with the EU by going to the wire as the balance of power is held by the EU, as it is eight times larger than us. Only the EU can win by this tactic as we have more to lose so will blink first. We saw it with Ireland. The amount of money paid to the EU in 2021 would be outweighed by the disruption and reduced trade. Either pay more as universal credit and last-minute government contracts to airlift medicines and food and face Sir Keir in power in No 10 in 2024 or pay less to the EU and get a good, chaos-free deal with a chance of re-election.

Originally Posted by Sephiroth

You're mixing it all up, though I understand that you purport to think that the government is not sufficiently competent to handle both Brexit and CV adequately.

But the political dimensions is very important. Any extension would unnecessarily shuffle even more dosh the way of the EU, on their terms and would strengthen the EU's negotiating position. That's enough ground for not extending. Indeed, going to the wire is a basic principle for this type of negotiation.

It really isn’t - that’s just willy-waving, rather than negotiating...