Government & Post Election Discussion
08-11-2017, 19:06
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#661
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Rise above the players
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Re: Government & Post Election Discussion
Quote:
Originally Posted by Damien
The media and the opposition will always go after weakness in the government. The trick is how strong the government is, how much material they give them and how they act when something goes wrong. May seems unwilling or unable to take action.
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Any action Theresa takes could make a difficult situation even worse. I'm amazed that she has managed to keep her show on the road, given the devastating curse that she seems to be trying to take her out at every turn. Terrorist events in her election campaign, throat infection at her party conference, EU negotiators being complete arses - just about everything you could throw at her is being thrown. Yet with grim determination, she moves forward, steadily, surely. She'd get a medal if she was on the battlefield.
---------- Post added at 19:06 ---------- Previous post was at 19:00 ----------
Quote:
Originally Posted by Damien
The media and the opposition will always go after weakness in the government. The trick is how strong the government is, how much material they give them and how they act when something goes wrong. May seems unwilling or unable to take action.
---------- Post added at 18:59 ---------- Previous post was at 18:53 ----------
Maybe she shouldn't have called the election and then taken the electorate for granted. It's the Government's fault we're in this mess and that Corbyn has a realistic prospect of getting into No 10. No 10 and the Cabinet seem to be in total disarray with Minsters going freelance if they're not backstabbing each other. Expecting charity from the opposition and media is naive.
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That is ridiculous, with all due respect.
All the indications were that TM would sail home with a thumping majority, which would have given her the authority she needed to get on with Brexit. How can you blame her for taking advantage of that?
As it happens, the campaign was ill thought out by her advisors, and Jeremy was able to extract more votes out of the system by manipulating the young. Those were the two things that went wrong, so blame Theresa if you must, but you are aiming your accusations at the wrong person.
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08-11-2017, 19:09
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#662
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Remoaner
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Re: Government & Post Election Discussion
Quote:
Originally Posted by OLD BOY
Any action Theresa takes could make a difficult situation even worse. I'm amazed that she has managed to keep her show on the road, given the devastating curse that she seems to be trying to take her out at every turn. Terrorist events in her election campaign, throat infection at her party conference, EU negotiators being complete arses - just about everything you could throw at her is being thrown. Yet with grim determination, she moves forward, steadily, surely. She'd get a medal if she was on the battlefield.
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I felt for her with the speech, that was out of her control, but she needs to get a grip on the government otherwise this will continue. A lot of this is her own making by throwing away her majority and if she really is unable to to take action against her ministers then this is not a well-functioning government. At the moment she isn't so much moving forward as caught in a state of stagnation and she'll certainly be unable to get much though the commons at the moment.
Any moment now Patel will, finally, be out but only because it really did become untenable.
Really what else does May have to lose at this point? Might as well be bold and go for it since it's unlikely she leads the party into another election.
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08-11-2017, 19:11
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#663
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Inactive
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Re: Government & Post Election Discussion
Quote:
Originally Posted by OLD BOY
Any action Theresa takes could make a difficult situation even worse. I'm amazed that she has managed to keep her show on the road, given the devastating curse that she seems to be trying to take her out at every turn. Terrorist events in her election campaign, throat infection at her party conference, EU negotiators being complete arses - just about everything you could throw at her is being thrown. Yet with grim determination, she moves forward, steadily, surely. She'd get a medal if she was on the battlefield.
---------- Post added at 19:06 ---------- Previous post was at 19:00 ----------
That is ridiculous, with all due respect.
All the indications were that TM would sail home with a thumping majority, which would have given her the authority she needed to get on with Brexit. How can you blame her for taking advantage of that?
As it happens, the campaign was ill thought out by her advisors, and Jeremy was able to extract more votes out of the system by manipulating the young. Those were the two things that went wrong, so blame Theresa if you must, but you are aiming your accusations at the wrong person.
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Yes I don't think that anyone without the benefit of 20/20 hindsight can blame her for deciding on an election given the situation at the time. It was however a very poor campaign and she can be blamed for some of that. Frankly the lies Labour told during the campaign were a disgrace but a lot of people believed them. Many have since learned how wrong they were to do so. May has been as much under siege as Trump and it's been a severe test just to survive.
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08-11-2017, 19:13
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#664
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Rise above the players
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Re: Government & Post Election Discussion
Quote:
Originally Posted by Osem
Yes I don't think that anyone without the benefit of 20/20 hindsight can blame her for deciding on an election given the situation at the time. It was however a very poor campaign and she can be blamed for some of that. Frankly the lies Labour told during the campaign were a disgrace but a lot of people believed them. Many have since learned how wrong they were to do so. May has been as much under siege as Trump and it's been a severe test just to survive.
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The difference being that Trump deserves it. May does not.
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08-11-2017, 19:19
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#665
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Remoaner
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Re: Government & Post Election Discussion
Quote:
Originally Posted by OLD BOY
That is ridiculous, with all due respect.
All the indications were that TM would sail home with a thumping majority, which would have given her the authority she needed to get on with Brexit. How can you blame her for taking advantage of that?
As it happens, the campaign was ill thought out by her advisors, and Jeremy was able to extract more votes out of the system by manipulating the young. Those were the two things that went wrong, so blame Theresa if you must, but you are aiming your accusations at the wrong person.
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She is responsible for the campaign, she signed off on the manifesto, she hired the advisors and took their advice. It's not a secret that the rest of the party felt she shut them out and relied too much on Nick Timothy and Fiona Hill. The cabinet were only told of the social care policy the day of it's unveiling. How is she not responsible? In the end she threw away the majority.
As for the young well throwing things at the electorate is what parties do. Why do you think the Conservatives offered the triple-lock for pensioners and largely isolated them from the austerity program? That's no different to Corbyn offering stuff to the young. You can't expect the young not to react while the government does nothing for them and then patronise them by saying they're being manipulated when someone actually addresses their concerns. If there is a lesson from Brexit then that was it!
Besides there was also a swing in middle-aged voters in urban areas and a decline in the turnout of older people. It wasn't all young people.
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08-11-2017, 19:19
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#666
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Re: Government & Post Election Discussion
Quote:
Originally Posted by OLD BOY
The difference being that Trump deserves it. May does not.
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I don't suppose May feels any better at that thought...
Patel's just resigned it seems.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-41923007
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08-11-2017, 19:21
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#667
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Re: Government & Post Election Discussion
Wow the house of Tory's is falling apart..
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08-11-2017, 19:28
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#668
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Still alive and fighting
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Re: Government & Post Election Discussion
Quote:
Originally Posted by richard s
Wow the house of Tory's is falling apart..
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It was inevitable that she would have to tender her resignation as that was the only option given the PM's very weakened government.
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08-11-2017, 20:08
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#669
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Woke and proud !
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Re: Government & Post Election Discussion
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Originally Posted by denphone
It was inevitable that she would have to tender her resignation as that was the only option given the PM's very weakened government.
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She wants to be careful resigning, she won't qualify for job seekers allowance now
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08-11-2017, 20:15
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#670
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cf.mega poster
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Re: Government & Post Election Discussion
Quote:
Originally Posted by Damien
I think part of the story is the complete chaos that is the government right now.
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It feels like the last days of the Major government all over again - sex scandals, divisions over Europe, resignations etc.
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08-11-2017, 20:30
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#671
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vox populi vox dei
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Re: Government & Post Election Discussion
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1andrew1
It feels like the last days of the Major government all over again - sex scandals, divisions over Europe, resignations etc.
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nah bozzer will replace may before too long and then the real fun will begin
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08-11-2017, 21:44
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#672
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Re: Government & Post Election Discussion
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Originally Posted by papa smurf
nah bozzer will replace may before too long and then the real fun will begin
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Anyone other than Corbyn, or it's Venezuela MK II and no amount of food banks will save us from that socialism disaster.
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08-11-2017, 23:03
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#673
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Re: Government & Post Election Discussion
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mick
Anyone other than Corbyn, or it's Venezuela MK II and no amount of food banks will save us from that socialism disaster.
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Quite - you have all these people becoming apoplectic with rage about the fall in Sterling as a result of Brexit yet that'll all pale into insignificance if Corbyn and McDonnell were to be running the country. They won't admit that of course. They'll carry on whining as if the UK is Greece until Labour assume control then they'll blame the ensuing financial and social chaos on the Tories. Some things never change...
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08-11-2017, 23:36
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#674
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Re: Government & Post Election Discussion
Likely that we will soon see the end of Mayhem and the likely end of Brexit.
Bit sorry for Theresa May but she knows she's on a fool's errand but what politician doesn't want to become PM. Not sorry for incompetents like BoJo who has succeeded in getting one of our citizens an extended jail term in Iran by not mastering basic facts.
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09-11-2017, 03:50
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#675
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Cable Forum Team
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Re: Government & Post Election Discussion
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1andrew1
Likely that we will soon see the end of Mayhem and the likely end of Brexit.
Bit sorry for Theresa May but she knows she's on a fool's errand but what politician doesn't want to become PM. Not sorry for incompetents like BoJo who has succeeded in getting one of our citizens an extended jail term in Iran by not mastering basic facts.
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No he has not, you’re not good at mastering facts either so what gives ?
The extended jail term was an issue before Boris opened his mouth and guess what? - It is still an Iran prison issue.
Brexit was a democratic process, one of the biggest, it will still be happening, so dream on.
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