ntl:HD?

[alexcopeland]

My Samsung HD ready LCD television is gagging for a HD signal to be connected to it!

The Xbox 360 does demonstrate an extremely rich and impressive image but when I watch ntl: digital I get a reminder that although the signal is strong and always on, it is SD.

I was in my local Sony Centre just having a look at the latest LCD screens for something to do when I saw the BBC HD preview channel showing Wimbledon and I must say it looked incredible.

When I got home later that evening I then thought I'd check the cable forum for any news on ntl:HD but couldn't find much at all.

I'm a very happy customer of ntl: and have a triple package. The service is always very good from ntl: but it would be even more greater to appreciate the HD signal that other digital TV service providers are broadcasting.

Ntl: must have a state of the art network and surely its possible to pipe the HD signal from BBC through it. I'm a TV licence payer so I should be able to receive this and view it on my Samsung HD ready LCD TV.

When are ntl: likely to provide this service?

[Stuart]

Last I heard it was early to mid 2007..

[alexcopeland]

I hope it'll be worth the wait. Maybe they're testing equipment as we speak!?

[sherer]

well they haven't even rolled out VOD yet so don't expect them to rush with a HD rollout

[Neil]

Originally Posted by alexcopeland

My Samsung HD ready LCD television is gagging for a HD signal to be connected to it![/quote[

www.sky.com/hd is where you need to go then!

The Xbox 360 does demonstrate an extremely rich and impressive image but when I watch ntl: digital I get a reminder that although the signal is strong and always on, it is SD.

Wait until you see HDTV!

Originally Posted by alexcopeland

I was in my local Sony Centre just having a look at the latest LCD screens for something to do when I saw the BBC HD preview channel showing Wimbledon and I must say it looked incredible.

Yep-a lot of people can't wait for the World Cup Final.

Originally Posted by alexcopeland

When I got home later that evening I then thought I'd check the cable forum for any news on ntl:HD but couldn't find much at all.

1) http://www.cableforum.co.uk/article/...-definition-tv

2) http://www.cableforum.co.uk/board/sh...ad.php?t=47732

Originally Posted by alexcopeland

I'm a very happy customer of ntl: and have a triple package. The service is always very good from ntl: but it would be even more greater to appreciate the HD signal that other digital TV service providers are broadcasting.

Sky's is good, but Telewest's is fairly limited channel wise.

Originally Posted by alexcopeland

Ntl: must have a state of the art network

Originally Posted by alexcopeland

and surely its possible to pipe the HD signal from BBC through it.

I'm afraid this is ntl we're talking about here.

Originally Posted by alexcopeland

I'm a TV licence payer so I should be able to receive this and view it on my Samsung HD ready LCD TV.

HDTV is not a God given right you know!

If you want it that badly, get Sky.

Originally Posted by alexcopeland

When are ntl: likely to provide this service?

See link #1 above, but as with all things ntl "Early 2007" will probably mean 2008....

[alexcopeland]

Hopefully there will be a wide range of good quality channels and programming to watch when it is released in 2007. I hear that the amount of content seems to be limited at this time, unless you like animals ripping each other to shreds.

There are issues with HD broadcasting at this time but I understand there will always be teething problems with the release of new technology.

Hopefully ntl: are working on this to ensure only the best level of service is delivered to the customer.

Thank you for the reply Neil I appreciate the links you have given and your views.

The Sky option is very tempting but to raise £300 for the box alone is a bit too much. I understand the new kit is usually more expensive, but still.

[Stephen]

Originally Posted by sherer

well they haven't even rolled out VOD yet so don't expect them to rush with a HD rollout

Well I have had VOD since Jan 05.

The PVR STB should be out early 2007. It will be the same box as the Telewest TV Drive.

[Neil]

Originally Posted by DarthYoda

Well I have had VOD since Jan 05.

Good for you-what about the rest of ntl's customers?

Originally Posted by DarthYoda

The PVR STB should be out early 2007. It will be the same box as the Telewest TV Drive.

Which is using inferior technology (MPEG 2) to Sky's (MPEG 4).

[alexcopeland]

Maybe when it's released in 2007 they may adopt MPEG4?

[Stuart]

Doubtful.

---------- Post added at 11:26 ---------- Previous post was at 11:23 ----------

Actually, the difference between MPEG 2 and MPEG 4 is greater compression on MPEG 4. IIRC, this is a more significant problem for Sky, as bandwidth is more limited on Satellite than it is on Cable.

[Tribuna DelCavo]

Originally Posted by Stuart C

Doubtful.

---------- Post added at 11:26 ---------- Previous post was at 11:23 ----------

Actually, the difference between MPEG 2 and MPEG 4 is greater compression on MPEG 4. IIRC, this is a more significant problem for Sky, as bandwidth is more limited on Satellite than it is on Cable.

See

http://www.apple.com/quicktime/techn.../h264/faq.html

"HD MPEG-2 content at 1920x1080 traditionally runs at 12-20 Mbps, while H.264 can deliver 1920x1080 content at 7-8 Mbps at the same or better quality. H.264 provides DVD quality at about half the data rate of MPEG-2."

Bandwidth difference is significant buy how are they getting better quality?

[Stuart]

Originally Posted by Tribuna DelCavo

Bandwidth difference is significant buy how are they getting better quality?

I never said that either Sky or NTL would get better quality. Bandwidth is the only significant matter really, as, AFAIK, Sky have relatively limited bandwidth available (compare to Cable).

The only way Quality might come into it is if someone has to convert from one compression to the other at some point. Say, for instance, a broadcaster encodes as an MPEG 2 file and sends to all the platforms. Sky would have to recode the program, so there would be a slight quality loss on that platform. If the broadcaster encodes as MPEG 4, then sends that, NTL and Telewest would have to recode as MPEG, so there would be a slight quality loss on Cable. Similarly, if the broadcaster sends an MPEG 2 programme to Sky (who recode as MPEG 4), then Cable recieves the Sky broadcast and recodes again as MPEG 2.

Another area where quality loss comes in is simply that most Audio/Video compression system are "lossy". Audio/Visual compression systems work by not encoding data that doesn't change from frame to frame, and also not encoding audio frequencies outside the range of human hearing. Thus, they lose that data. The trick is not to alter the sound or video we percieve too much. Data compression systems (such as ZIP) have to reproduce a perfect copy of a file, so they work differently.

H.264 is a very good compression system. *Much* better than MPEG 2. It's more efficient at keeping the sound and video apparently the same, while compressing them..

[altis]

Looks like they're going to use MPEG4-AVC and DVB-S2. Check out DVBscene magazine #16 here:

http://www.dvb.org/

[popper]

Originally Posted by altis

Looks like they're going to use MPEG4-AVC and DVB-S2. Check out DVBscene magazine #16 here:

http://www.dvb.org/

yea, thats what we have been saying for a very long time now, the fact is, AVC/H.264 was always going to be better quality per bit rate as thats what it was intended to do from the very beginning and the lossless part of AVC will be used more and more as time and the whole EU get going, the new DVB-H (handheld) will also become the industry standard for lower than SD (CIF 384x288 or Widescreen versions of that?)or perhaps even SD.

when/if all the commercial streaming TV stations dump the old and antiquated MS codec's and start using AVC/H.264 the better for everyone as it just gives far better quality even at CIF sizes scaled to full screen monitors.

if the OP wants to see more use of their 'HD ready' TV then they might look to getting one of the new 'HD ready' PC gfx cards coming to market and stuff all the PC content through that, while not really HD, it will be far easyer to scale the output to HD type forms than anything NTL in the 80% non TW area's can produce for some time yet.

also they might look to getting the FTA (free to air) sat pci/USB DVB-S2 card (but DVB-S will do for know at least until/if they change to the S2 format later in the test)
and then they can also get the BBC/itv/c4/c5 HD trials , although your going to need a really fast dual CPU and coreAVC codec to display it at the required 25fps.

iv not seen anything much on DVB-C2, DVB-T2 or DVB-H2 for that matter, does anything exist yet for them?.

not that its ever likely that NTL will ever let you rent or buy a DVB-C(2) card to put your payed for smart card into and just take the .ts content directly to your monitor or HD ready display and hence get a far better quality picture without the anologue conversion that the SD STB does today.

[Stuart]

Originally Posted by popper

not that its ever likely that NTL will ever let you rent or buy a DVB-C(2) card to put your payed for smart card into and just take the .ts content directly to your monitor or HD ready display and hence get a far better quality picture without the anologue conversion that the SD STB does today.

Err, the TV Drive (which is similar to what NTL will be using) supports HDMI. Thus, you can attach the box to your HD Ready display and have an entirely digital signal.