Muslims to march in London - Page 7

kronas · 10-02-2006, 18:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ramrod

.....are you sure that he's not fanatical?

If thats a non-fanatical muslim then we are in deep sh*t in the west.....

im sure of it, i have known this guy for about three years now consistently and hes just your average guy, doing his business.

10-02-2006, 18:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by picapo

If there were no organised religion then this wouldn't be happening!!!

I'm sure that the millions of factions of various forms of theism that would exist in the place of 'organised religion' would have found plenty of things to argue about, and even more to get violent about.

The religion is not to blame, it is the men(/women) that abuse their positions of authority by corrupting the ideals of the religions.

Fundamentally Christians, Jews and Muslims should be more like brethren, rather than 'opponents'. Their religions share so much history and so many of the ideals that promote peaceful co-existence. Yet, for some reason, there is a schism between them that threatens everyone.

While there are plenty of theological differences between Jews and Christians, they have found a way to set those aside and to coexist (relatively) peacefully for quite a long time now.

At the same time, Muslims seem to have moved further and further away from the common ground they could occupy with the 'people of the book'.

In fact, if they were as vehement about following the Koran's directions in this respect as they are in their fervour for following the Hadith (i.e. NOT a direction from the Koran) about imagery, we'd all be a lot better off - including Muslims.

Ramrod · 10-02-2006, 18:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Saaf_laandon_mo

Response from the muslim world following the 9/11 bombings can be found here:

http://groups.colgate.edu/aarislam/response.htm

Thank you for that, thats a bit more like it! I'm paticularily impressed by the "1 million Palestinian students in the Palestinian Territory, including East Jerusalem, stood five minutes in silence to express their solidarity with the hundreds of American children who have been struck by this tragedy"

Escapee · 10-02-2006, 18:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by ScaredWebWarrior

I'm sure that the millions of factions of various forms of theism that would exist in the place of 'organised religion' would have found plenty of things to argue about, and even more to get violent about.

The religion is not to blame, it is the men(/women) that abuse their positions of authority by corrupting the ideals of the religions.

Fundamentally Christians, Jews and Muslims should be more like brethren, rather than 'opponents'. Their religions share so much history and so many of the ideals that promote peaceful co-existence. Yet, for some reason, there is a schism between them that threatens everyone.

While there are plenty of theological differences between Jews and Christians, they have found a way to set those aside and to coexist (relatively) peacefully for quite a long time now.

At the same time, Muslims seem to have moved further and further away from the common ground they could occupy with the 'people of the book'.

In fact, if they were as vehement about following the Koran's directions in this respect as they are in their fervour for following the Hadith (i.e. NOT a direction from the Koran) about imagery, we'd all be a lot better off - including Muslims.

Some religions however contain many brainwashed followers, some of these can be persuaded to go to any lengths in the name of religion. I agree these fanatics would find another way of causing trouble if religion didn't exist, but these fanatics have a huge target audience amongst muslim followers.

Although non-religious people like myself are usually a bit tougher to convice there are virgins waiting in heaven for me, if I strap a bomb to my body and kill some westerners. To start with if you dont believe heaven or hell exists, its a waste of time trying to tempt me with virgins.

It's all down to religions brainwashing people and the fanatics taking advantage.

I will expect a flaming for my sensible view on religion!

10-02-2006, 19:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Saaf_laandon_mo

This thread looks like its degenrating into Muslims Vs Brits (and people fail to see that a large amount of muslims in the Uk are actually born here. making them British) or Kick Out The Muslims or Im Afraid The Mulsims will take over parliament and establ;ish Khalifah in the UK.....

What I have been tryinf to argue/debate/explain in this thread and the other one relating to pictures, apart from why offence has been caused, is that the rioters are a small minority of islam and not a representation of the muslim faith in general. if we look atr it from the placards displayed on the demo in London, 200 idiots do not represent the muslim faith in the UK, and nor do groups such as Hizbut Tahir or Al Majouroon.

As for condemnation of 9/11; Madrid; London bombings, all the mainstream muslim representatives in the UK have condemned such action. Just because it didnt appear on the front page of the Sun or the Daily Mail does not mean it didnt happen.

They may not be representative of the faith as a whole, I do wuite agree, but as a member of that faith they are shaking their responsibility to the faith and their co muslims by behaving like a bunch of.....animals.

And it has come down to brits V muslims, thats got more to do with the attitude of some of the marchers than it has with many of the brits.
We are not perfect, yet why should I stand back and not voice my concern, my oppinions and my feelings?
If I dont like them I dont like them, I say them, it could be it, her, him, species, religion basically whatever. I do not likew the attitude of some perhaps a high proportion of muslims in this country, purely because they have no desire, no inclination to even accept or understand our ways.
But in return thjey experct us to alter our behaviour to accomdate them.
To the majority of brits we dont have to do anyhting to accomodate them, we just go about our business as usual.

I've never personally met anyone I hate, many I dislike, many I get angered at, especially when they shove you out of the way in a supermarket, I will ask them where their manners are....or shove them back, but I would do that to anyone.

The very fact they want to march and cause further disruption shows they dont care how the rest of the country see's them, they will carry on regardless and expect no repercussions form it because they are muslims and any repercussion would obviously be the racist white majority attacking islam.

Lew · 10-02-2006, 19:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by basa

Have you ever seen a asian shop / restaraunt employ whites ?

Yup. My brother and I used to work for one of the local Indian takeaways. Guess what religion the owners were.

Escapee · 10-02-2006, 21:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by kronas

before i rollock you which i wouldnt dream of doing publicly spare a thought for the NHS, did you know doctors/nurses are coming from abroad to fill the shoes of those so called 'white people' who wont fill the job ?

before your ignorance and bigottedness overcomes you i dont see a problem with muslims employing their own people, infact one takeway near me employers a white lady and it is a muslim restaurant!

you dont also realise that many immigrants actually do comply with british law and also pay taxes and help the economy grow, sure there are a few rouges in this country but its not related 'because they are asian' because there some in every race.

I have an opinion on this because my girlfriend is Asian (not Muslim though)and works for the health service, she will tell you that she works for the health service because so many of the lazy white nurses are off on the sick.
On the other hand she laughs when the liberals say people like her are here to help the economy, she will tell you straight "I am here to earn lots of money and buy property back home the same as all my collegues"

There are however some things for them that are not fair, she has been paying NI for the three years she has been here. the unfair bit is that she has no entitlement to NI benefits if she is out of work, nor does she officially have entitlement to sick pay. Although she will then say that filipinos dont call sick just cos they feel like a day off.

I do not pidgeon hole Asian and Muslim, because Asian does not neccesarily mean Muslim and Muslim doesnt always mean trouble. I do however consider that when backs are against the wall, Muslims good and bad will stick together instead of siding up with a white western person.

Ramrod · 10-02-2006, 22:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Escapee

I do however consider that when backs are against the wall, Muslims good and bad will stick together instead of siding up with a white western person.

.....and there is nothing wrong with that, imo we are genetically programmed to act like that.

NitroNutter · 10-02-2006, 23:34

Doesnt look like its mainly peacuful expression to me.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/4692518.stm

Dont hold out much hope for tomorrows march remaining so either, not that it should even go ahead anyway. Theres been one, its been heard, end of, nope I doubt it.

Ramrod · 11-02-2006, 00:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by kronas

no, wrong! ill stick to whoever i deem to be right

Good for you! I try not to as well....but many wouldn't--through no fault of their own.....human nature.

etccarmageddon · 11-02-2006, 12:36

I dont think it's appropriate for a march today after last weekends disgraceful activities. If they are going to march it should be a demo regarding their contempt for the extremism first as the violence and intimidation expressed by the nutter element is a lot more offensive and bad for their beliefs/religion than the cartoons.

Russ · 11-02-2006, 13:26

Thread reopened. Off topic posts will be removed.

Xaccers · 11-02-2006, 13:35

It will be very interesting if they do march and then choose not to when the next atrocity takes place "in the name of islam"

herbert clinker · 11-02-2006, 13:49

ok i'll be nice.
why do they want to protest,no cartoons where published in this country.
it happened a couple of weeks ago.
why not just let it go, its history.
and if they must protest why don't they protest about how the muslims have behaved in other countries burning embassys national flags etc.
if they want to show the west there with us rather than against us shout out to the other muslims in the world that there wrong to do these things.

Paul K · 11-02-2006, 13:57

The cartoons were not published here in papers but were shown on a national news program briefly.
Does that mean that anyone that wants to protest should fly to the country that the problem is based in before they can be allowed to protest?
History causes more conflict than most other causes so saying it's history is not a good thing.
Many have voiced their condemnation for how some protestors have behaved, not all muslims are fanatics baying for blood. All religions/ nations have their idiots/ zealots/ racists/ fascists etc
Think you will find many muslims have spoken out against the behaviour of some of the protestors.