smoking and the pub

Originally Posted by SlackDad

Just me then. And I live on a busy street and my son hardly ever goes into pubs.

No, not just you. But go and start a thread on vehicle emissions instead of diverting a discussion on smoking!

[lippy]

Originally Posted by clarie

How am I 'stamping my feet' and how am I not making much sense? Can you really imagine many non-smokers (people who choose not to smoke because of the negative effects) choosing to enter a room that is sealed and designed specifically for smokers, when there large part of the pub is smoke free?

Hard to imagine isn't it,
non-smokers wanting to enter a place which (again by law) allows smoking.
But then again,it would be a public place where non-smokers have rights.

Please carry on,you're making your own points worthless in this debate.
You and the anti smokers who take kids into pubs,knowing what they are subject to!

[SlackDad]

Originally Posted by Chris T

No, not just you. But go and start a thread on vehicle emissions instead of diverting a discussion on smoking!

It wasn't diverting but comparing and just suggesting whether the priorities were in the right place and asking for opinions on that.

Originally Posted by Xaccers

There's also the issue that with breaking motoring laws such as dangerous driving, you could spin off the road and take out a pedestrian, whereas with smoking, passive smokers have a choice whether to be in danger or not.

Umm, no, I could decide it's not worth the risk being a pedestrian and stay at home, which is what smokers seem to think those of us who want to drink in a smoke-free pub should be doing. That is plainly silly, as it remains a cold, hard fact that smokers are the minority, and yet seem to think it's still their right to expect the majority to accommodate them.

Originally Posted by Pia

Can i just say... How long do any of you even spend in the pub??

Hardly ever nowadays. Didn't you know 'staying in is the new going out'

People will have to agree to disagree on this thread topic. Can't see it ever ending otherwise!

[Xaccers]

Originally Posted by clarie

Please remember that you are not currently allowed to smoke in shops, many cinemas, many shopping centres, and many airports, and no one seems to complain about that.

How long do people spend visiting those places compared to the pub?

What about private clubs which serve food to members?
Non-members cannot enter, so why should members who accept the smoking conditions either have to leave their club to smoke, or no longer be able to get food there?
__________________

Originally Posted by Chris T

Umm, no, I could decide it's not worth the risk being a pedestrian and stay at home, which is what smokers seem to think those of us who want to drink in a smoke-free pub should be doing. That is plainly silly, as it remains a cold, hard fact that smokers are the minority, and yet seem to think it's still their right to expect the majority to accommodate them.

Ah but walking down the road you are not choosing to be a target are you?
Sure you are exposing yourself to risk, but you are not choosing to definitely suffer that risk.
Going into a smokey environment you are choosing to passive smoke.

If you want to visit a pub which currently allows smoking, why not get a petition together and write to the landlord to show them the number of people who would drink there if it became a no-smoking establishment?

[clarie]

Originally Posted by lippy

Please carry on,you're making your own points worthless in this debate.
You and the anti smokers who take kids into pubs,knowing what they are subject to!

I am not making my own point worthless at all. If I go into a smoking room, the smoke will be much more concentrated than if I go into a pub with smokers in it, as there is a smaller volume of air and a higher concentration of smokers. Does that clear it up?

[orangebird]

Originally Posted by Chris T

Umm, no, I could decide it's not worth the risk being a pedestrian and stay at home, which is what smokers seem to think those of us who want to drink in a smoke-free pub should be doing. That is plainly silly, as it remains a cold, hard fact that smokers are the minority, and yet seem to think it's still their right to expect the majority to accommodate them.

Smokers are in the minority nationally, yes. But they are a majority in my local. I'm not expecting every pub to accomodate me as a smoker. But I don't think it's unreasonable for the landlord to be allowed to choose who they accomodate for.

Originally Posted by Xaccers

Non-smokers do not have to expose themselves to passive smoking.
So what's the problem?
Why the need for the ban?

Should we ban base jumping? It can lead to death, and although I can protect myself by not partaking in it, I may slip up and paticipate and risk my life!
Or how about underwear? People die in underwear incidents every year, I can protect myself by choosing to go commando, but what if my gf leaves her knickers on the floor and I trip on them and fall down the stairs to my death?

Actually, base jumping is illegal in the UK (insofar as you can't legally jump from Buildings, Antennae and Spans (bridges)). All you're left with is Earth. So, E jumping is legal.

Regardless of that, though, your analogy falls down on the issue of scale. Exactly how many people are injured in underwear-related accidents each year, and how many might be avoided with the introduction of *effective* legislation?

Originally Posted by Chris T

..... and yet seem to think it's still their right to expect the majority to accommodate them.

And it seems vice-versa.

[SlackDad]

Originally Posted by SlackDad

It wasn't diverting but comparing and just suggesting whether the priorities were in the right place and asking for opinions on that.

I've also noted that no one has bothered to answer the question re prioities.

[Pia]

Originally Posted by Xaccers

What about private clubs which serve food to members?
Non-members cannot enter, so why should members who accept the smoking conditions either have to leave their club to smoke, or no longer be able to get food there?

Don't exaggerate, I am sure 'smoking' places will still have a no smoking area.

I get the impression people are envising a dark room completely filled with smoke to the point where you can't see!
It's not as bad as people are making out now, so it won't be much differet when the ban comes in.
A lot of people will stop smoking, it's a good reason to, especially if a lot of others are stopping.

[orangebird]

Originally Posted by Xaccers

How long do people spend visiting those places compared to the pub?

What about private clubs which serve food to members?
Non-members cannot enter, so why should members who accept the smoking conditions either have to leave their club to smoke, or no longer be able to get food there?
__________________



Ah but walking down the road you are not choosing to be a target are you?
Sure you are exposing yourself to risk, but you are not choosing to definitely suffer that risk.
Going into a smokey environment you are choosing to passive smoke.

If you want to visit a pub which currently allows smoking, why not get a petition together and write to the landlord to show them the number of people who would drink there if it became a no-smoking establishment?

Because out stupid **** money wasting nanny governing goverment have already done it for them without the courtesy of a petition

[punky]

Originally Posted by Xaccers

Non-smokers do not have to expose themselves to passive smoking.
So what's the problem?
Why the need for the ban?

I think its because both sides believe they have the divine right to dictate to each other how they should live. Both are wrong, in that respect.

Live and let live.

I don't smoke, but I don't believe in nany state legistlation. Let free market capitalism decide. If non-smoking is what people want, then that's what pubs will cater for. If smoking is what people want, then that's what pubs will cater for.

Let the public decide what they want. Wether a non-smoker wants to sit with smokers enjoying themselves, or a smoker sitting with non-smokers enjoying themselves. Let people decide. Let's not have this "I'm right.... no, I'M right" mentality.

Originally Posted by NEONKNIGHT

And it seems vice-versa.

Not at all, smokers are not the majority. Even in a pub, where most of the regulars may smoke, all you are getting is a self-selecting group made of people who don't object to the smoke.