Virgin Media signals major Wi-Fi expansion

[Kushan]

Originally Posted by Carlos Carboni

(Hot) Spot on. In Queen Mary Uni, students were sharing a file of BT passwords/usernames. living in a dense flat population at the East End , BT wifi connections were abused.... One student gave his password to his mate and then the mate gave it to another mate....

This isn't something to bother concerning yourself with. Your connection will be separated off. It's not in Virgin's interests to encourage people to leave them and pay less, anyway.

[thenry]

How much bandwidth will be allocated to each wifi hotspot hub or connection to hotspot?

[techguyone]

As a non Virgin mobile user, would I still be able to benefit out and about?

[SnoopZ]

Originally Posted by techguyone

As a non Virgin mobile user, would I still be able to benefit out and about?

If you have VM broadband then you get to use the wifi hotspots.

[qasdfdsaq]

Originally Posted by Kushan

It's both street cabs and superhubs.

Ah

---------- Post added at 01:13 ---------- Previous post was at 01:12 ----------

Originally Posted by Chris

Given that you have clearly only read half the OP, I think you're somewhat wide of the mark.

Ah



---------- Post added at 01:12 ---------- Previous post was at 01:11 ----------

Originally Posted by Kushan

Oh my god, does this mean that qas was......wrong...about something?

Is this a thing now? Am I not allowed to be wrong? Or am I just so good at covering up when I'm wrong that you actually think it's a rare occurrence?

---------- Post added at 01:19 ---------- Previous post was at 01:13 ----------

Originally Posted by nomadking

Several neighbours could have a mobile broadband dongle for just £5.12/month and use my WiFi and Broadband connection that I pay a lot more for. Passers by and short term light use is one thing but the potential for longer term heavy usage is another.

They use your router's WiFi, yes, but they do not use your broadband connection.

---------- Post added at 01:20 ---------- Previous post was at 01:19 ----------

Originally Posted by JPAC

I foresee gangs of teenagers hanging around wi-fi enabled cabinets, could be a new social phenomenon?

No. You don't see gangs of teenagers hanging around WiFi-enabled park benches, phone booths, or bus stops do you?4

If anything, teenagers tend to hang around areas with USB ports. I regularly see lines of teenagers sitting against the wall in a bus station with their phone chargers plugged in. There are even pubs equipping USB sockets on their tables now to entice teenagers in.

---------- Post added at 01:25 ---------- Previous post was at 01:20 ----------

Originally Posted by nomadking

Half a dozen people each with 5Mb, is going to add up. In peak times what will that do to a 30Mb or less capacity?

There is nowhere on VM's network that only has "30Mb or less capacity"

---------- Post added at 01:27 ---------- Previous post was at 01:25 ----------

Originally Posted by Ignitionnet

Absolutely. That's unavoidable.

Actually it's avoidable, though not with current hardware. This would be a perfect use case for those "AC3200" routers (dual-band tri/quad-radio)

---------- Post added at 01:31 ---------- Previous post was at 01:27 ----------

Originally Posted by thenry

If The Telegraph meant stressing the SH and/or overall network capacity then fine but then they should better word what is actually going on and even then be specific so nobody gets to thinking the SH will start falling over again!

What everyone seems to be missing (or making up the opposite) is that there isn't going to be any real change in overall network utilisation hence no real impact on overall network capacity.

All you are doing is, if anything, relocating the same load. Nationwide internet usage isn't magically going to go up the instant some free WiFi hotspots are available. Most heavy users already have their own connections, not to mention this service is only free to people who already have their own VM connections. Any traffic they send over a guest WiFi hotspot is traffic not being sent over their own home connection.

---------- Post added at 01:33 ---------- Previous post was at 01:31 ----------

Originally Posted by Gavin78

So will we have access to the router side of this wifi hotspot once it's enabled so we can see what is happening and how will they be able to split the bandwidth from the same cable coming into the house?

The same way they split the same cable coming into the cabinet into dozens of houses.

[nomadking]

Originally Posted by qasdfdsaq

They use your router's WiFi, yes, but they do not use your broadband connection.


There is nowhere on VM's network that only has "30Mb or less capacity"

Would they be able to do it if I didn't have a BB connection? No, so they are using my BB connection. They could be getting unlimited mobile BB for £5/month on the basis that I am paying a lot more for non-mobile BB.

I supposedly have a 152Mb connection and for most of the time I can achieve that. Peak times it is a lot less. Mobile BB could end up being the bottom tier of unlimited BB.


Although these might help mitigate my concerns.

What is the download limit?
A fair usage policy applies, but WiFi is great for downloading files, streaming entertainment, sharing photos and keeping in touch on the move.

Does Virgin Media block any content while I am using Virgin Media WiFi on the move?
Yes. Virgin Media has a responsibility to ensure that the content available is suitable for young people to access themselves, or to look at over someone else's shoulder.

[roughbeast]

Originally Posted by nomadking

Would they be able to do it if I didn't have a BB connection? No, so they are using my BB connection. They could be getting unlimited mobile BB for £5/month on the basis that I am paying a lot more for non-mobile BB.

I supposedly have a 152Mb connection and for most of the time I can achieve that. Peak times it is a lot less. Mobile BB could end up being the bottom tier of unlimited BB.

Although these might help mitigate my concerns.

This is my understanding of the arrangement. VM will not not use YOUR broadband connection for this arrangement. They use your SH router and an additional broadband connection.

The VM coax that enters your house is capable of carrying many modulated signals. It carries your TV signals, your telephone and broadband and can carry extra broadband signals. Your SH similarly can process more than one signal in, ( WAN side), and out, (LAN side). VM plans, through a softaware upgrade, to enable your router to manage your usual broadband signal and WiFi needs whilst using an additional broadband signal and creating an additional WiFi signal for the hot spot.

For example I have had a pure FON router for 10 years now, piggy backed on my main router. This enables me to use FON spots worldwide and BT Fon spots nationwide. It sends out a private signal for me if I want it and a public signal, which folk have to log into. The router has built in capacity to do this. In my case I have chosen to share my single broadband supply because this is my own custom arrangement. As it happens only two people have ever logged into it during those 10 years. In VMs case you get your broadband and a backup channel running alongside that do not compromise each other.

I am told insistently that the speed upgrades have nothing to do with the WiFi development. They neither enable the WiFi development, by providing extra capacity, or act as a sweetener for those who opt to have a hotspot.

Not convinced? Then you have the choice of opting out, but that will mean you won't be able to access VM's WiFi network for calls or broadband.

[Kushan]

Originally Posted by qasdfdsaq

Is this a thing now? Am I not allowed to be wrong? Or am I just so good at covering up when I'm wrong that you actually think it's a rare occurrence?

It is a rare occurrence, you're clever and know your stuff so it's all the more fun to poke at you when you do (occasionally) get it wrong :P

Originally Posted by roughbeast

This is my understanding of the arrangement. VM will not not use YOUR broadband connection for this arrangement. They use your SH router.

The VM coax that enters your house is capable of carrying many modulated signals. It carries your TV signals, your telephone and broadband and can carry extra broadband signals. Your router SH similarly can process more than one signal in and out. VM plans, through a softaware upgrade, to enable your router to manage your usual broadband signal and WiFi needs whilst using an additional broadband signal and creating an additional WiFi signal for the hot spot.

For example I have had a pure FON router for 10 years now, piggy backed on my main router. This enables me to use FON spots worldwide and BT Fon spots nationwide. It sends out a private signal for me if I want it and a public signal, which folk have to log into. The router has built in capacity to do this. In my case I have chosen to share my single broadband supply because this is my own custom arrangement. As it happens only two people have ever logged into it during those 10 years. In VMs case you get your broadband and a backup channel running alongside that do not compromise each other.

I am told insistently that the speed upgrades have nothing to do with the WiFi development. They neither enable the WiFi development, by providing extra capacity, or act as a sweetener for those who opt to have a hotspot.

Not convinced? Then you have the choice of opting out, but that will mean you won't be able to access VM's WiFi network for calls or broadband.

Hmm, not quite. The telephone does actually come through a separate, standard copper cable. If you look closely at the black cable entering your house from outside, you'll see the two separate cables that eventually split off.

HOWEVER, VoIP is on the horizon and we may even see it with this next hardware trial.

[roughbeast]

Originally Posted by Kushan

Hmm, not quite. The telephone does actually come through a separate, standard copper cable. If you look closely at the black cable entering your house from outside, you'll see the two separate cables that eventually split off.

HOWEVER, VoIP is on the horizon and we may even see it with this next hardware trial.

Thanks for putting right my omission, but this does not undermine my main point.

I was aware of the double cable entering my house. Does this double arrangement run all the way back to the street box or node or does the split from a single cable occur at the pavement connection?

[qasdfdsaq]

Originally Posted by nomadking

Would they be able to do it if I didn't have a BB connection? No

Yes, actually they can, and they will.

---------- Post added at 11:24 ---------- Previous post was at 11:22 ----------

Originally Posted by roughbeast

This is my understanding of the arrangement. VM will not not use YOUR broadband connection for this arrangement. They use your SH router and an additional broadband connection.

The SH router is VM's property, not the user's. Same goes for VM's cab.

---------- Post added at 11:25 ---------- Previous post was at 11:24 ----------

Originally Posted by Kushan

It is a rare occurrence, you're clever and know your stuff so it's all the more fun to poke at you when you do (occasionally) get it wrong :P

So poking fun at me when I'm wrong is a sport now? I HAVE FEELINGS YOU KNOW, I'M ONLY HUMAN *sobski*

Hmm, not quite. The telephone does actually come through a separate, standard copper cable. If you look closely at the black cable entering your house from outside, you'll see the two separate cables that eventually split off.

Not for long!

HOWEVER, VoIP is on the horizon and we may even see it with this next hardware trial.

-May
+Will

[Kushan]

Originally Posted by qasdfdsaq

So poking fun at me when I'm wrong is a sport now? I HAVE FEELINGS YOU KNOW, I'M ONLY HUMAN *sobski*

Don't lie! You're a robot (Probably manufactured by Cisco, if you as the General :P).

[nomadking]

Originally Posted by qasdfdsaq

Yes, actually they can, and they will.

How? If I don't pay for my BB there wouldn't be a shub to piggy back on.

[roughbeast]

Originally Posted by qasdfdsaq

[COLOR="Silver"]



The SH router is VM's property, not the user's. Same goes for VM's cab.[COLOR="Silver"]

Jeez qasdfdsaq so picky!! Grrrr. You know what I meant. 'YOUR' as in the one installed in YOUR house. Take the anal retention pills quick! lol

[Ignitionnet]

Originally Posted by nomadking

No, so they are using my BB connection.

They are no more using your broadband connection than the person next door.

They are using the Superhub Virgin Media have provided you, which they generally retain ownership of, to access the Virgin Media network. The demarcation point between what's yours and what's Virgin Media's as far as your broadband connection goes is the end of the Ethernet cable connecting to the Superhub, or the WiFi signal, which in the case of the guest network is segmented at the Superhub.

You are connected to the Virgin Media network at about 400Mb, you are capped by the service tier you pay for to 152Mb. The WiFi uses its own 'service' on the same cable. It will not impinge on your service unless the area is congested.

---------- Post added at 14:21 ---------- Previous post was at 14:19 ----------

Originally Posted by roughbeast

Thanks for putting right my omission, but this does not undermine my main point.

I was aware of the double cable entering my house. Does this double arrangement run all the way back to the street box or node or does the split from a single cable occur at the pavement connection?

You have a dedicated link to a street-side MSAN. Not dissimilar from how BT deliver FTTC, except in the case of VM it carries telco service only.

---------- Post added at 14:24 ---------- Previous post was at 14:21 ----------

Originally Posted by nomadking

Although these might help mitigate my concerns.

The connection any WiFi user has is nothing to do with yours and wouldn't be traced back to you in any event.

They will not have the same public IP address you do.

Any attempt to trace illegal activity on the WiFi would come back to whomever was using it, not the person whose Superhub they were connecting through, that's irrelevant.

[qasdfdsaq]

Originally Posted by roughbeast

Jeez qasdfdsaq so picky!! Grrrr. You know what I meant. 'YOUR' as in the one installed in YOUR house. Take the anal retention pills quick! lol

It's not an issue of pickyness. In this case it is actually the core distinction. VM could contractually force you to have the equipment in your house and not allow you to use it, if you had any other VM services. They could run it from their STB, or phone, or anything else. It's in your house, but it's their equipment and they can do whatever they want with it - your only choice would be to cancel all VM services.

Not much different to cable TV. If you have cable TV, your TV box also gets its own internet connection to VM's network. You don't pay for it, you can't use it, you can't control it, you can't cancel it, even if you cancel your broadband. To get the service you want, you are forced to have the second internet connection that you have no control over. You simply must tolerate that connection in order to receive other VM services you want. Yet you don't hear people complain about their set top box stealing "their" broadband...

---------- Post added at 15:23 ---------- Previous post was at 15:21 ----------

Originally Posted by nomadking

How? If I don't pay for my BB there wouldn't be a shub to piggy back on.

1) Using their street cabinets

2) They can force you to have a Shub even if you cancel your BB. They don't, but they can. Hell, they could put a micro Superhub to run it from inside your junction box. And you'd have to pay them to remove it.

As Ignition explained, it's nothing to do with your broadband connection.