School Leavers Unfit For Work 2011 Edition

[Caff]

Originally Posted by Ignitionnet

You made a really quite sharp funny, apparently without noticing!

I did,I did. That's me - I do it all the time - it amuses no end of people I'm an easy target
I thought you were name-calling

Originally Posted by Maggy J

Standards have declined because behaviour and discipline have declined.This is as a result of children and parents now exclusively regarding their own rights as paramount.The rights of educators to do their job unimpeded and other students to get a hassle free education don't even figure.

Also business and would be employers are always complaining about this every decade..they said the same during the period of Grammar schools.They tend to see education as being only for turning out a trained workforce that they can then put straight to work without any expenditure on their part.

It's not too much for employers to want a workforce that can read and right and do basic maths to an acceptible level .The last few years i have been shocked at the standard of basic education from some of my apprentices/labourers .I do accept that there has always and always will be an element that will never achieve or want to achieve any kind of educational standard but that element of society has got bigger over the last few years imo .

Originally Posted by martyh

It's not too much for employers to want a workforce that can read and right and do basic maths to an acceptible level .The last few years i have been shocked at the standard of basic education from some of my apprentices/labourers .I do accept that there has always and always will be an element that will never achieve or want to achieve any kind of educational standard but that element of society has got bigger over the last few years imo .

And I told you why. Behaviour and discipline are at fault.Add to that unrealistic aims and goals and you have a recipe for disaster.
Thanks to X Factor and reality shows there are many who fail to see that the best way to succeed is to study/train/practice as hard as they can.One only has to glance at the rejects from such shows to see how deluded they are at thinking all they need to do is appear on TV.

The number of argu..err discussions I've had with youngsters who are going to be acting,singing,dancing for a living who think they need only to study drama,dancing or music and they will make it.

As Ignitionnet says it an old chestnut dragged up every decade.School leavers could leave with top grades and crystal clear received pronunciation and would still be found wanting by prospective employers.

I'd also like to point out that your own presentation in this thread has some spelling errors.Plus it is correct grammar to use a capital letter when referring to oneself in the singular mode.

[Lew]

Originally Posted by martyh

It's not too much for employers to want a workforce that can read and right and do basic maths to an acceptible level .

Uhhh…

Originally Posted by Maggy J

And I told you why. Behaviour and discipline are at fault.Add to that unrealistic aims and goals and you have a recipe for disaster.
Thanks to X Factor and reality shows there are many who fail to see that the best way to succeed is to study/train/practice as hard as they can.One only has to glance at the rejects from such shows to see how deluded they are at thinking all they need to do is appear on TV.

The number of argu..err discussions I've had with youngsters who are going to be acting,singing,dancing for a living who think they need only to study drama,dancing or music and they will make it.

As Ignitionnet says it an old chestnut dragged up every decade.School leavers could leave with top grades and crystal clear received pronunciation and would still be found wanting by prospective employers.

I'd also like to point out that your own presentation in this thread has some spelling errors.Plus it is correct grammar to use a capital letter when referring to oneself in the singular mode.

I agree that discipline at school and in the home has a great deal to do with the problem ,and hopefully ,with schools getting new powers with discipline or at least confirmation of existing powers that will get better .That isn't the only problem though ,we have record numbers of children leaving school with record numbers of qualifications year after year and yet basic skills are still lacking so somewhere there is a problem with the government figures .I also think that a lot of teachers haven't got the dedication they used to have, either because they have had it knocked out of them by the system or simply because they aren't in the profession for the right reasons

@the spelling police ,i was going through my year end accounts when i wrote the above post so

[Ignitionnet]

Originally Posted by Maggy J

As Ignitionnet says it an old chestnut dragged up every decade.School leavers could leave with top grades and crystal clear received pronunciation and would still be found wanting by prospective employers.

I think the problem is that they are leaving with top grades but the standard of their basic skills is abysmal.

Employers have every right to complain if people leaving school and applying to them for jobs aren't able to do maths, read and write to expected standards.

The argument that we perhaps need to wind our neck in on education and stop with the more 'exotic' aspects of subjects and concentrate on the basics rather than a collection of tick boxes to satisfy a curriculum is a good one. Without the basic communications skills even someone with the skills to do a job won't be able to present themselves articulately to an employer.

All well and good teaching pupils a wide curriculum but entirely pointless if the extent of their ability to deploy this knowledge is a multiple choice exam paper or a clearly framed question they have been able to practice via mocks and given guidance on how to answer for best results.

That requires nothing beyond the ability to learn by rote and recite information when certain stimuli are provided. Life generally requires a bit more than that.

Originally Posted by martyh

I agree that discipline at school and in the home has a great deal to do with the problem ,and hopefully ,with schools getting new powers with discipline or at least confirmation of existing powers that will get better .That isn't the only problem though ,we have record numbers of children leaving school with record numbers of qualifications year after year and yet basic skills are still lacking so somewhere there is a problem with the government figures .I also think that a lot of teachers haven't got the dedication they used to have, either because they have had it knocked out of them by the system or simply because they aren't in the profession for the right reasons

@the spelling police ,i was going through my year end accounts when i wrote the above post so

And yet you still refer to yourself in the first person with a lower case instead of a capital letter.

Possibly the passion for texting is to blame?I suspect that speed being the main motivator in working these days and technology playing a larger life may be another reason.

I also wonder how many homes possess a dictionary or thesaurus?

And finally we get the education we pay for. If we want our children to really parse their English correctly then we need to train the teachers to do so and lay more emphasis upon it in schools than is done at present.Trying to do this while getting an increasing minority to sit down and STFU while you teach is possibly what is at the basis of what goes wrong.