The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 3

[Flyboy]

In fact, there has been twenty-three in the UK since nineteen eighteen. So not much difference between both systems.

[Xaccers]

Originally Posted by Flyboy

This is one of the strongest reasons not to allow the Tories back in. I draw a cold sweat and shudder with fear, when I think of Flyboy11, left to the mercies of a school system that could be comparable to that of fifteen years ago. His many learning difficulties would go ignored and untreated with teachers left alone to manage classes of thirty-five or more, with no assistants to help with students who struggle to keep up and cope with school life. No time to prepare lessons and review work. Crumbling buildings with areas of infrastructure closed because it is unsafe to teach in a hazardous environment. This is what can be expected from a Tory government.

Yes, lets view needing 100 new teachers ever year to replace those who've left as a good thing, rather than only needing 5 because the positons have been filled

My ex was a deputy head under labour, and her job changed from being able to spend time bringing in extra funding which more than covered her salary, to doing 14 hour days through increased classroom teaching and the school lost it's extra funding as she wasn't able to bring it in and the government weren't giving any extra unless you wanted it ringfenced for unrequired things.

[Ignitionnet]

Originally Posted by Damien

Now is probably the best chance to implement such reforms. As it stands the polls suggest that the result may be the perfect example of how screwy our current system is. Labour would well come 3rd in the popular vote and be the party with the most seats. Not to mention that it is looking likely that the Liberal Democrats are likely power-brokers in the event of hung parliament and they are the largest party in favour of voting reform.

The two main parties are unlikely want to change a system skewed in their favour if they had a majority. Public pressure and the need to make concessions to the Liberal Democrats is the only environment in which I can see reforms taking place.

Can we perhaps deal with this after the economy has been set on the right course and we aren't running nearly 400mn/day budget deficits, which isn't going to happen with the Lib Dems holding control?

---------- Post added at 15:14 ---------- Previous post was at 15:13 ----------

Originally Posted by Flyboy

In fact, there has been twenty-three in the UK since nineteen eighteen. So not much difference between both systems.

How about the past 8 years, bearing in mind that terms are 4 years in the Netherlands and 5 here, and in the context of what happened last time there was a hung parliament?

Originally Posted by Ignitionnet

Can we perhaps deal with this after the economy has been set on the right course and we aren't running nearly 400mn/day budget deficits, which isn't going to happen with the Lib Dems holding control?

It will never happen unless the Lib Dems do hold control. It's also quite conceivable that an alliance can take place if the Tories concede Civil Liberties and Voting reform and the Liberal Democrats let the Tories dictate economic policy.

[danielf]

Originally Posted by Ignitionnet

How about the past 8 years, bearing in mind that terms are 4 years in the Netherlands and 5 here, and in the context of what happened last time there was a hung parliament?

The last 8 years (which are not very representative of Dutch politics imo), saw 4 elections rather than the expected 3, though it has to be said that the current PM doesn't have a very good track record with 4 coalitions collapsing. Then again, UK politics isn't exactly having the best of times either...

[Ignitionnet]

Originally Posted by Damien

It will never happen unless the Lib Dems do hold control. It's also quite conceivable that an alliance can take place if the Tories concede Civil Liberties and Voting reform and the Liberal Democrats let the Tories dictate economic policy.

That would work so long as they do let the Tories do what needs to be done which is extremely unlikely to go down well given the socialist nature of many Lib Dems.

[danielf]

Originally Posted by Damien

It will never happen unless the Lib Dems do hold control. It's also quite conceivable that an alliance can take place if the Tories concede Civil Liberties and Voting reform and the Liberal Democrats let the Tories dictate economic policy.

I doubt the Tories would concede on electoral reform. The current system doesn't work in their favour, but under PR (or any representative voting system) they will face 2 parties on the left flank, which will seriously decrease their chances of getting in.

[Xaccers]

Originally Posted by danielf

I doubt the Tories would concede on electoral reform. The current system doesn't work in their favour, but under PR (or any representative voting system) they will face 2 parties on the left flank, which will seriously decrease their chances of getting in.

Lets see
PR - vote for the party not the candidate
STV - vote for the candidate you don't want the least
Equal population constituencies - every vote is equal, vote for the candidate not the party

[danielf]

Originally Posted by Xaccers

Lets see
PR - vote for the party not the candidate
STV - vote for the candidate you don't want the least
Equal population constituencies - every vote is equal, vote for the candidate not the party

I think this vote for the candidate thing is a bit of a misnomer. At the end of the day they get elected to run the country and party politics supersede local matters. It makes sense to vote for the party.

[Xaccers]

Originally Posted by danielf

I think this vote for the candidate thing is a bit of a misnomer. At the end of the day they get elected to run the country and party politics supersede local matters. It makes sense to vote for the party.

Really?
Tell that to those who've had to call on their MP for support.
MPs do not "run the country" unless in the cabinet, and even then it's the civil service under them that do the running.
A single backbencher in parliment has very little power in the HoC, but in the local area they can save lives.
If they're good of course.
You could be lumbered with someone like Margret Moran. Ask the Luton South constituents if they'd be happy to vote for her over a different candidate. I know several who would rather have their fingernails removed.

I'd rather the Tory idea of reducing the size of the HoC and resizing constituencies so they are equal.

[danielf]

Originally Posted by Xaccers

Really?
Tell that to those who've had to call on their MP for support.
MPs do not "run the country" unless in the cabinet, and even then it's the civil service under them that do the running.
A single backbencher in parliment has very little power in the HoC, but in the local area they can save lives.
If they're good of course.
You could be lumbered with someone like Margret Moran. Ask the Luton South constituents if they'd be happy to vote for her over a different candidate. I know several who would rather have their fingernails removed.

I'd rather the Tory idea of reducing the size of the HoC and resizing constituencies so they are equal.

Oh, I do like the link to local constituencies, but at the end of the day MPs do vote on the laws drawn up by the government, and the colour of your local MP does help decide what Government gets in, so it seems silly to just choose the candidate without considering if you agree with his/her party's plans.

[Xaccers]

Originally Posted by danielf

Oh, I do like the link to local constituencies, but at the end of the day MPs do vote on the laws drawn up by the government, and the colour of your local MP does help decide what Government gets in, so it seems silly to just choose the candidate without considering if you agree with his/her party's plans.

It depends whether your MP is likely to follow their own views or their party's.

[danielf]

Originally Posted by Xaccers

It depends whether your MP is likely to follow their own views or their party's.

It's more likely to be dependent on if the party allows a free vote.

[Xaccers]

Originally Posted by danielf

It's more likely to be dependent on if the party allows a free vote.

Many MPs ignore the whips.

(uh-oh! Where's Mr LoveMonkey?)

[Jimmy-J]

Jack Straw says sorry over Muslim veil comment sparking accusations of political opportunism

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...#ixzz0mG89sfJk

And...

THE Liberal Democrats came under fire yesterday for using a fake policeman in campaign literature just days after being forced to admit dressing up a party worker as a nurse.
The party was also forced to apologise after featuring supportive comments in campaign leaflets from a great-grandmother who turned out to be a Tory voter who had never uttered the words in question.
The admissions brought new accusations of “dirty tricks’’ by the party, whose leader Nick Clegg has claimed he will offer a new, cleaner politics.

http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/...icks-leaflets-