*ALL* ntl Cap Discussion (Part 3)

[ian@huth]

Originally Posted by Hartleys

Can any of you so called normal users that dont use your cap usage give me one good reason as to why you need a 10 meg connection.
I was on 3 meg now on 10 meg so can tell the difference in like sending emails with content.
My average usage is anything from 30gig to 150gig month depends on whats out at the time.

Having a faster connection gives you two options. You can download more in the same time or you can download the same in a shorter time. I don't download a great deal but would prefer the little that I do download to be done quicker.

[Hans Gruber]

Originally Posted by ian@huth

Having a faster connection gives you two options. You can download more in the same time or you can download the same in a shorter time. I don't download a great deal but would prefer the little that I do download to be done quicker.

A bit like owning a Ferrari just to do the weekly shop then.

[Hartleys]

Ok thats a good answer but my lad d/l some talking books thay came in at around 300k/s you could get that speed from a 3 meg line. d/l at fast speeds all depends on the server your getting it from.
im more interested in what usage you use to be classed as normal user.

[Stop It]

I download a bit, ( maybe up to 50gig a month on a heavy month), and I enjoy having it download at 1100+K/s, but it doesnt give me the sudden urge to download the internet, maybe if I downloaded the games Ive bought this month (Call Of Duty 2, Quake 4, AoE3, NFSU:2, FEAR), and downloaded the DVD I bought, I would download more, but, until viable services come out I can't, my internet usage will spike however, when MyBBCplayer is released, on demand BBC shows, brilliant

[Ignition]

Originally Posted by jimmy.riddle

ignition you maybe right on 1 or 2 points but what do you use the internet for ? 1 i certainly don,t need it for porn or to wa*k and if i caught my kids d/l porn id ban them from the computer . and take their ipods off them.im not a hoarder i d/l games for kids (keeps them quiet) as for my wife i like to think the only thing she hoards is my credit cards . the real point here is the companys such as ntl having the balls to rip us off . i have been on the internet a long time and paid for it for a long time and never d/l a thing till now and im not saying im entitled to it but im going to use it like ive no tomorrow .. ntl and other providers need to learn there is more than one person in households useing the same or more than one computer also what about people that don,t know much about computers with wireless conections . i know that in my street there are 5 as i scanned for wireless connections with a pda and found all 5 and if i wanted used these connections as they were all open ..

Unless you pay more for your connection than a single person you can't really expect to be treated any differently.

Downloading games doesn't use much really, sounds more like you're downloading for the hell of it, you said as much, which won't change ntl's mind it'll just get you reduced to the 512k tier at best if not kicked off the service entirely.

In any case those people who don't know how to secure their wireless aren't their ISP's problem, those who have multiple people using the connection aren't the ISP's problem.

I have 3 people who use the net in this household including myself, however I pay the same as a single man, or a family of 10 and don't expect any different treatment. Regardless of how many use it to the ISP it is one connection, governed by one contract.

[Chrysalis]

Originally Posted by Ignition

Weird, my family don't even manage 60, actually not even 10 hrm.

Not realy ntl's problem if the entire family have different tastes in downloading dodginess to be honest, either deal with it or move elsewhere, that's your choice and right.

Being frank again extreme downloading isn't necessary by anyone for any reason, those who do are likely to be

a) Unemployed chavs with nothing better to do than leech and watch movies / play games / watch porn and masturbate 24x7.
b) Hoarders with an obsession to download the internet, which is more of a mental issues thing or:
c) Ignorant people who don't even hoard the stuff and just download because they 'pay for it 24x7 and should use it as such'.

Note my use of the word extreme before you jump on me. Even a couple of hundred gigs a month can be used depending on what you're downloading, but when you get into the hundreds it just gets silly.

Anyway even those of you on 512k download have a somewhat faster service than me, a certain company having completely fecked up my order I'm now without any high speed internet until 16th December.

Haha yeah but you are bringing up the extremes there, I think there needs to be better catering for people who might need to download say 75-150 gig a month.

---------- Post added at 15:43 ---------- Previous post was at 15:35 ----------

What I am finding frustrating is I would expect an isp that doesnt bother with caps to let things go to pot when they upgrade speeds (demon great example) but if an isp has caps set I expect them to maintain a good quality connection in return for caps been upheld. But ntl are going to pot anyway, numerous paths are saturated causing obscene lag, I have downloaded less then 5 gig during the last 2 weeks and have have varied results one download has gone faster then I would have got over my old 2mbit during peak time (creative driver download) everything else has been WORSE ssh lag, ftp downloads etc. Web browsing is about the same since when you reach 256kbit it doesnt feel any faster as you increase speed.

I keep saying it again and again, the caps need to be time of day based, if ntl cant do that they need to get their finger out spend some £ÃÆ ’‚£Ãà¢Ã¢â€šÂ¬Ã…¡Ãƒâ€šÃ‚£ and upgrade their peering connections so when I want to use my 75gig it is at least better then my old speed.

Ntl most of my downloading when done is non http traffic this means external, please allow me to use it at a decent speed outside of twilight hours thank you.

[Mauldor]

Lets Break up some facts and see why, what and where-for type of thing.
An ISP will dedicate so much bandwidth per XX Households. Think of it a bit like a Airline that Overbook, in the hope that not everybody will turn up for flights - in the same way they don;t expect everybody to be downloading at once. The problem comes about when people find out other ways to use there connection, be it News Servers, P2P Apps or Servers. All of these can be run without the person siting in front of the PC at all so is irrelevent if the person is working or not working.

Once too many people in one area start doing this (use there connection too much) it staurates the bandwidth and the speeds come flying down. people then start to complain, they are paying for XX Connection yet rarely see this at all - they might as well be paying for the next Tier down for exmaple.

The higher the speeds get, the bigger the files people will go and find - example On Dial up it would be madness to download a complete DVD though can be done *eventually* - on 10mbit a 4.5 GIG DVD suddenly looks good to grab as it takes a lot less time etc.

So how can An ISP manage this 'Over-use' and give all customers a fair slice of the pie? The easiest one to chuck in seems to be Caps but in all fairness they have not provided a means to see how much you have downloaded etc. Now somebody in a 12 months contract will be bound by having 512K, the same if all you can get in your area is Cable - but what about the people who fall outside this?? Basically NTL need to look into a better way to manage the Caps such as Off-Peak 'Not counted' method and Im sure all the Leechers can work around downlaoding through the night sort of thing.

The nottom line is this - as it stands, this CAP is solving nothing, I could go and GRAB 75GIG + easy right now in peak time and still be within the restrictions of my service but on the upshot effecting everybody on the Same UBR. I also am none to happt that my downloads vary from 30K to 4Mbit, always tending to be on the Slower side. I am seriously thinking of Saving myself some money soon and going BACK to 2mbit regradless of the said CAP - It *used* to be faster but who knows, i might downgrade and it might now be uber slow due to everybody downloading / Speed testing etc.

[Hans Gruber]

I'm going back to 2mbit in a few days, after a month of exciting new speeds I really see no benefit in it for me, other than streaming high definition videos (which has been a fair few during the Xbox 360 launch madness). Maybe Mr Branson will bring us some more sensible packages, and some content to use all the speed on.

[Griffin]

anyone know what the wording is with the 75gb cap?
The old 30gb cap was just on download only but if the 75gb cap is on bandwidth, ie upload & download combined then its not as big an increase as it looks

[mcmanic]

also i find it annoying that i pay top price for a only 6/7meg service whilst others who pay the same and get full 10meg download, and for NTL to turn round and say their is nothing they can do as its a upto 10meg service. So who's being ripped off?

[Ignition]

Originally Posted by mcmanic

also i find it annoying that i pay top price for a only 6/7meg service whilst others who pay the same and get full 10meg download, and for NTL to turn round and say their is nothing they can do as its a upto 10meg service. So who's being ripped off?

No-one, 'up to' 'contended service', etc, etc, feel for all the people on ADSL who pay for x service but get it 4+Mbps slower than that bloke down the road because their D-side cable takes roundabout route.

Originally Posted by Griffin

...The old 30gb cap was just on download only...

No it wasn't. The 30GB cap is a usage allowance (upload & download). I think it changed from being a download only allowance when the cap was changed from 1GB/day to 30GB/month.

http://www.home.ntl.com/page/userpolicy&source=ntlworld

scroll to bottom of page to see the table.


.

[Griffin]

Originally Posted by XFS03

No it wasn't. The 30GB cap is a usage allowance (upload & download). I think it changed from being a download only allowance when the cap was changed from 1GB/day to 30GB/month.

http://www.home.ntl.com/page/userpolicy&source=ntlworld

scroll to bottom of page to see the table.


.

Nice of them to let us know they had changed t/c's again, this is yet another example of why i was going to leave. When i first signed up with NTL they were unlimited, first i knew about the caps was from on here. Now yet again i find from on here that they changed again. (For anyone wondering why i didn't leave i was offered a good deal.)

[Hitcher]

I'm on 10Meg now but would like to know where I can check what I've used of my limit please?

[Mauldor]

Originally Posted by Hitcher

I'm on 10Meg now but would like to know where I can check what I've used of my limit please?

Basically NTL have not put into place anything that allows the end user to see (Via a web page) how much you have used. They expect you to use some external program to keep track of your useage and if you do get a Letter saying you have used XXX - then you have no option but to beleive them, what was counted and so forth.

I can see them printing a Lot of letters from that Laser printer as people floor there connection since they now have 10mbit