Should cooing at babies be banned?

Originally Posted by Incognitas

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/talking_point/4285862.stm

I can understand about preventing cross infection.But human rights? That's a bit OTT.

According to this morning's Metro, the hospital only came out with the 'cross infection' line after they realised they were in a bit of a PR nightmare over the real reason, which is 'human rights'.
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Originally Posted by Angua

Whoever these "jobs worths" are they need to go back to school and actually learn something rather than try out ill conceved theories on vulnerable babies.

The jobsworth in this case is Debbie Lawson, who is apparently the neo-natal manager at the hospital's special care baby unit. I wonder what other hare-brained schemes she has implemented by way of justifying her share of our taxes?

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Originally Posted by Graham

Oh dear, not only is this ridiculous, but it's brought the "it's all the fault of the lefties/ PC brigade/ I don't like "human rights"" crew out of the woodwork again...

That's a rather negative approach to your fellow posters. Let's not go looking for a fight, eh?

[Graham]

Originally Posted by Chris T

That's a rather negative approach to your fellow posters. Let's not go looking for a fight, eh?

But Sir! They started it Sir...!!!

[punky]

Originally Posted by Graham

Oh dear, not only is this ridiculous, but it's brought the "it's all the fault of the lefties/ PC brigade/ I don't like "human rights"" crew out of the woodwork again...

Well, I doubt they were righties, or members of the anti-PC brigade/anti-human rights crew.

Moot point though, this is ridiculous whatever your political persuasion/activist intrests are.

[AndrewJ]

Hmm disaster across the world.

I know we will ban people from cooing at babies.

What a left handed crock of bull****ting moronic PC brigade mother in law styled goverment.

[Ramrod]

Should cooing at babies be banned?........perhaps we should look at abortion first-surely thats more of an infringement of their human rights!

[Salu]

According to BBC Radio Leeds this discussion has escalated exponentially without all the facts. Evidently the guidance from the hospital is for the babies on the Special care Baby unit (SCBU) which is a newborn Intensive care unit. Visitors were visiting the unit and bending down to other babies as they were "cute" and mostly premature so they were small, diddy and cute. Some would even try to touch.

"Coochy coo" is the phrase adopted to sum up what the general public should not do to the other babies but really it is about upholding the rights of the baby to get better and not stopping other people from enjoying cuteness. There is a significant risk of infection for premature babies anyway without Joe public breathing/touching them...

[me283]

Originally Posted by Salu

According to BBC Radio Leeds this discussion has escalated exponentially without all the facts. Evidently the guidance from the hospital is for the babies on the Special care Baby unit (SCBU) which is a newborn Intensive care unit. Visitors were visiting the unit and bending down to other babies as they were "cute" and mostly premature so they were small, diddy and cute. Some would even try to touch.

"Coochy coo" is the phrase adopted to sum up what the general public should not do to the other babies but really it is about upholding the rights of the baby to get better and not stopping other people from enjoying cuteness. There is a significant risk of infection for premature babies anyway without Joe public breathing/touching them...

I don't know much about babies or baby wards. But I would have thought that if they were ill or at risk, they would be in an incubator (if very young) or in some kind of isolation? Not in a public ward where all and sundry can come and peer and prod?

[sir_drinks_alot]

This is political correctness gone ****ing mad there's nothing wrong with cooing.

[Hom3r]

Watching City hospital this morning they asked a doctor about this.

She said that it only applies to babies that are born pre term (premature)as this can startle them and can cause them to stop breathing.

Once the baby reaches term it will be OK.

[Shaun]

Great! Maybe now we will also see a ban on old women pulling at the cheeks of grown children and (what is surely one of the greatest offences to human rights this country has ever seen) spitting on tissues in order to clean wayward toddlers' faces. Lock 'em up and throw away the key - that's what I say!

[Orior]

Originally Posted by marky

I hated it with my kids, when you are in a supermarket you turn for a second and there is a total stranger leaning into the pram

What a strange thing. I assume you live in a city and choose your friends very carefully.

I was brought up in the country. I believe I was taught respect and manners and to be hospitable. When I eventually moved to the big city for work, I could not believe it when people walked past me without saying hello. (Yeah, visualise a Crocodile Dundee thing). But if there is only two people on the street, do you keep your eyes down and avoid contact at all costs? Cities are cold horrible places.

The same thing happens with grannies and saying hello to little babies. Would you rather they walked past and avoid contact?

Originally Posted by Orior

What a strange thing. I assume you live in a city and choose your friends very carefully.

I was brought up in the country. I believe I was taught respect and manners and to be hospitable. When I eventually moved to the big city for work, I could not believe it when people walked past me without saying hello. (Yeah, visualise a Crocodile Dundee thing). But if there is only two people on the street, do you keep your eyes down and avoid contact at all costs? Cities are cold horrible places.

The same thing happens with grannies and saying hello to little babies. Would you rather they walked past and avoid contact?

Having complete strangers drawn to your kids to talk to them (and to complement you on their behaviour, hopefully) is one of the great things about being a parent ... swelled with pride and all that.

Here in Scotland things are still a little less paranoid than they seem to have gone down south. Random grannies in cafes still press 50 pence pieces into my son's grateful palm around here (and once, a king-size mars bar, which mum had to swiftly intercept 'to give to him later'). It never once happened when we lived in Hemel Hempstead.

[marky]

Originally Posted by Orior

What a strange thing. I assume you live in a city and choose your friends very carefully.

I was brought up in the country. I believe I was taught respect and manners and to be hospitable. When I eventually moved to the big city for work, I could not believe it when people walked past me without saying hello. (Yeah, visualise a Crocodile Dundee thing). But if there is only two people on the street, do you keep your eyes down and avoid contact at all costs? Cities are cold horrible places.

The same thing happens with grannies and saying hello to little babies. Would you rather they walked past and avoid contact?

You missed the bit from my other post ,

Marky
but in saying what i did, a simple "may i look at the baby" makes a whole lot of difference,

And i do say hello to people i dont know when passing in the street,
Farnworth nr Bolton is a very warm freindly place,

[Salu]

Originally Posted by me283

I don't know much about babies or baby wards. But I would have thought that if they were ill or at risk, they would be in an incubator (if very young) or in some kind of isolation? Not in a public ward where all and sundry can come and peer and prod?

The SCBU isn't a public ward but the hospital have obviously felt the need to address the disturbances that are happening. The hospital has said it has no problem in people cooing at full term babies providing the ward rules are followed and the parents don't mind.

Originally Posted by sir_drinks_alot

This is political correctness gone ****ing mad there's nothing wrong with cooing.

Apart from the pre-term/SCBU babies the hospital isnt' saying that there is....

Originally Posted by david.ewles

Watching City hospital this morning they asked a doctor about this.

She said that it only applies to babies that are born pre term (premature)as this can startle them and can cause them to stop breathing.

Once the baby reaches term it will be OK.

There are many reasons why bans like this are put in place. The above although true would be unlikely but they are better resting than being stimulated, pre-term babies also lack in surfactant which can lead to respiratory distress etc etc..

Originally Posted by Chris T

Having complete strangers drawn to your kids to talk to them (and to complement you on their behaviour, hopefully) is one of the great things about being a parent ... swelled with pride and all that.

Here in Scotland things are still a little less paranoid than they seem to have gone down south. Random grannies in cafes still press 50 pence pieces into my son's grateful palm around here (and once, a king-size mars bar, which mum had to swiftly intercept 'to give to him later'). It never once happened when we lived in Hemel Hempstead.

I agree it does make you proud....

I've noticed a general introspection with in public. We mostly tend to conduct our business as if there was noone else there. You see it in supermarkets and on the pavement. I've often found someone stop dead as you approach them and wait for you to circle round them before carrying on. You don't notice it much as we are used to it. When you go to the States or Canada it becomes very apparent as people talk to each other everywhere. At first you want to shout at them to leave you alone an mind their own business but you then realise what a grump you are....

Originally Posted by Salu

The SCBU isn't a public ward but the hospital have obviously felt the need to address the disturbances that are happening. The hospital has said it has no problem in people cooing at full term babies providing the ward rules are followed and the parents don't mind.

The thing is, none of this came to light initially. It appeared that the ban was universal. Granted we haven't seen the original press release or been privy to any interviews the hospital may have given to the Press, but what was in all the headlines yesterday was that the hospital felt it was striking a blow for the human rights of newborn babies. This is what makes me very, very suspicious of the hospital's subsequent 'clarifications' of the issue. It seems very strange to me that an institution primarily concerned with the health of its inmates should choose to highlight human rights as a reason for doing something, and then to insist on the good clinical reasons only after the story hit the headlines.

I tend to think that what we have here is a ridiculous piece of overzealous bureaucracy by a middle manager desperate to justify her pay grade, who, to her credit, told the truth behind her policy when initially challenged. When it became clear that the hospital was being made to look very stupid indeed, the PR department got involved and issued a 'clarification' that this applied only to the SCBU and was for clinical reasons. The thing is, you would have thought that in those circumstances such a policy was nothing new, not controversial and something the hospital was doing anyway. So what on earth moved Ms Lawson to invoke 'human rights' in the first place?

At the very least this demonstrates why hospitals should be under the management of experienced clinicians and not bleeding heart public sector bureaucrats.