*ALL* ntl Cap Discussion (Part 3)

[sheka]

30GB is way too low for a cap in todays modern world.

legitimate content include;
HTTP Surfing, FTP, email, Video streaming (Shoutcast TV, Winamp Videos, MTV videos, movie trailers, game trailers), Linux DVDs, Music download services (Itunes, Napster, Virgin, HMV), Voice over IP, webcams, remote office working, Xbox Live, multiple PCs, distant relatives wanting the video of your summer holiday, managing your NTL web site, future services like BBC1/2 streaming, BBC TV Archive, enhanced mapping services (Google earth streams from the web). Bandwidth becomes even more precious when you have a family of 4/5/6 all with PCs....

It just seems too easy to get near or break the 30GB cap. Especially as that 3MB Itunes file will actually eat more than 3MB into your cap. You could probably add 10-20% onto that figure to allow for all the various network elements (MAC/IP/TCP headers/frame acknowledgements) to get that 3Mb 'payload' to your PC. You could take 10-20% off of that 30GB limit and say that that is your actual usable data allowance.

I don't mind capping but the levels should be set at a fair amount. Even VoIP uses approx 1.3MB a minute at G.711 codec. How many minutes does your household spend on the phone a month? It is the simple things that can eat into your allowance and at present I have no idea what I use...

just my 0.02......
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This is a list of game demos posted on gamespot over the last month...interesting amounts of data.....I am glad I am not a game junkie..

bet on soldier: blood sport single-player demo (download bos_sp_demo_setup.exe now!)
from kylotonn / 553.9mb / posted: 02-sep-2005
blitzkrieg 2 single-player demo (download bk2_singleplayer_demo.zip now!)
from nival interactive / 272.9mb / posted: 02-sep-2005
starship troopers demo (download starshiptroopersdemo.zip now!)
from n/a / 461.0mb / posted: 01-sep-2005 / 17,732 downloads
fifa 06 demo (download fifa06demoen.exe now!)
from ea canada / 219.0mb / posted: 31-aug-2005 / 8,153 downloads
ultima online: mondain's legacy client (download uoml_setup.exe now!)
from electronic arts / 779.7mb / posted: 30-aug-2005 / 352 downloads
gods: land of infinity demo (download gods_loi_demo.exe now!)
from cypron / 271.1mb / posted: 30-aug-2005 / 1,756 downloads
nhl 06 demo (download nhl06demo.exe now!)
from ea canada / 279.7mb / posted: 29-aug-2005 / 5,376 downloads
delaware st. john volume 1: the curse of midnight manor demo (download dsjv1demo.exe now!)
from bigtime games / 139.1mb / posted: 26-aug-2005 / 1,018 downloads
myst v: end of ages demo (download mystvdemo.exe now!)
from cyan worlds / 276.4mb / posted: 23-aug-2005 / 19,863 downloads
dark age of camelot 14-day trial (download daoc_14-day_trial_setup.exe now!)
from mythic ent / 1.9gb / posted: 22-aug-2005 / 13,950 downloads
nibiru: age of secrets demo (download nibirudemoen1-2.exe now!)
from future games / 143.0mb / posted: 19-aug-2005 / 8,039 downloads
squad assault: second wave demo (download saswdemo.exe now!)
from freedom games / 122.5mb / posted: 18-aug-2005 / 4,602 downloads
myst v: end of ages demo (mac) (download myst_v_demo.sitx now!)
from cyan worlds / 468.2mb / posted: 18-aug-2005 / 863 downloads
land of legends demo (download lol_setup_demo.exe now!)
from tiny hero / 68.5mb / posted: 17-aug-2005 / 1,257 downloads
gt legends demo (download gtlegends_demo.exe now!)
from simbin / 269.0mb / posted: 17-aug-2005 / 20,041 downloads
the star and the crescent demo (download tsatcdemo.zip now!)
from prosim / 48.6mb / posted: 16-aug-2005 / 784 downloads

[PC_Arcade]

I have now cancelled everything but the TV (which I was offered so cheaply I couldn't afford NOT to keep it!), the retention department person who I spoke to seemed genuinely concerned about the way I was treated by the AUP team, hopefully it'll get communicated back and they will learn some manners (although I doubt anything will change ).

Strangely NO mention was made of upcoming uncapped services, which I find odd as it would be a way to keep customers who state the cap as a reason for leaving, which leads me to believe the uncapped services ARE a lie (or a LONG way off).

It's much better for me though, i'll save money as I was on 3mb and I will actually have the option to CHANGE when / if I'm unsatisfied with my ISP. NTL need to wake up and realise that BT are NOT their only competitor.

It's a shame really, i've been with NTL for 7 years and they've gone from being the best ISP by a country mile to one of the worst

[orangebird]

Originally Posted by PC_Arcade

Utterly pathetic, I've just spoken to an unhelpful, rude and knowledgeless member of the AUP team and it seems there is NO means for me to monitor my usage. NTL are pathetic, not even BT (who haven't actually started writing to / capping their users yet) give you the means to check.

I'm willing to stay within 30gb, but I fail to see how I can ensure I do so.

I think the best option for me is to just disconnect the modem for the month of september as it's the only way that I as a multi PC household can be SURE not to go over this pathetic "cap".

What about dumeter?

[mcmanic]

Originally Posted by PC_Arcade

i've been with NTL for 7 years and they've gone from being the best ISP by a country mile to one of the worst

i've been with them longer and even due to these letters wouldn't call them one of the worst TBH, infact i've never had any probs in all them years so at present willing to lower my usage for September (am doing ok atm also, but finding it very hard not to download something, lol). If nothing appears about the unlimited services that was announced (i think they will) then i too will be forced to leave i think, because at the moment this watching of my interent usage is driving me nuts just like dailup days!!, there is no way me and my family can stay within 30gig a month at present if we wasn't watching are usage.

Personally i waiting for 10meg with 75gig ATM and gonna see how that goes before i make my final decision.

[astra_lestat]

Originally Posted by mcmanic

Personally i waiting for 10meg with 75gig ATM and gonna see how that goes before i make my final decision.

Same here. Although, I hope they will do the same for 2M connections as well, since I have no use for 3M speed. Otherwise I will be forced to leave as well
I don't want to though.

[Chrysalis]

Originally Posted by PC_Arcade

I have now cancelled everything but the TV (which I was offered so cheaply I couldn't afford NOT to keep it!), the retention department person who I spoke to seemed genuinely concerned about the way I was treated by the AUP team, hopefully it'll get communicated back and they will learn some manners (although I doubt anything will change ).

Strangely NO mention was made of upcoming uncapped services, which I find odd as it would be a way to keep customers who state the cap as a reason for leaving, which leads me to believe the uncapped services ARE a lie (or a LONG way off).

It's much better for me though, i'll save money as I was on 3mb and I will actually have the option to CHANGE when / if I'm unsatisfied with my ISP. NTL need to wake up and realise that BT are NOT their only competitor.

It's a shame really, i've been with NTL for 7 years and they've gone from being the best ISP by a country mile to one of the worst

Well I hope it isnt a lie as that is by no means the way to treat customers, the problem I got is I want to see how things go before taking any action but I will probably have to upgrade to £37.99 to get a decent cap whilst I wait for these unmetered packages, I feel £37.99 is very expensive for 75gigs of traffic. I would be suprised if the cap at the stage 10mbit is rolled out is still a soft cap.

[blenky]

Theres a lot of heated debate on what and how much people download. Isn't the real issue WHEN the download takes place? If someone is downloading a large amount of data in the wee small hours - does it really matter?

However if every ntl user decides to hit the web and surf at the same time wouldn't that bring the network to its kness- yet no-one would be breaking their cap!?

[Chrysalis]

Originally Posted by blenky

Theres a lot of heated debate on what and how much people download. Isn't the real issue WHEN the download takes place? If someone is downloading a large amount of data in the wee small hours - does it really matter?

However if every ntl user decides to hit the web and surf at the same time wouldn't that bring the network to its kness- yet no-one would be breaking their cap!?

Fully accurate in my view, but these points remain unaddressed.

[mcmanic]

agree,and all my downloads from now on will be during peak hours,

[PC_Arcade]

Originally Posted by orangebird

What about dumeter?

Who cares?? I'm off, to ADSL land where I don't have to monitor every byte in and out of my house and if it's changed so I have to I can change ISP's

The AUP team were so rude to me that they lost any chance of keeping me as a customer, I was TRYING to get some help to stay within the guidelines, but in all honesty it's pointless, there are plenty of ISP's with no / high limits where I wont have to.

I've always been put off by the £75 BT want to fit a line, but the saving i'll make on not having to pay £37.99 (I was on 3mb & ADSL is significantly cheaper - though slower) will make that back in ~6 months.

I hope enough customers leave and FORCE NTL to re-think this utterly stupid cap, it's unfair for a company to punish its customers due to it's own ineptitude. Is it the customers fault if NTL can't manage their network properly? No & yet all the burden seems to be on the customer to keep the network within its limits.

[DieDieMyDarling]

Originally Posted by orangebird

What about dumeter?

Is dumeter free? Or do Ntl offer it free, as part of the service now? Or maybe you expect customers to pay for their own software, to monitor a useage limit which ntl introduced, without the means to let their customers monitor it?

[Kaychsea]

Originally Posted by PC_Arcade

I hope enough customers leave and FORCE NTL to re-think this utterly stupid cap, it's unfair for a company to punish its customers due to it's own ineptitude. Is it the customers fault if NTL can't manage their network properly? No & yet all the burden seems to be on the customer to keep the network within its limits.

Isn't the cap an attempt to manage it's network properly? Damn them for trying to shift to an equitable charging regime!!

Bye bye.
__________________

Originally Posted by sheka

30GB is way too low for a cap in todays modern world.
...
I don't mind capping but the levels should be set at a fair amount. Even VoIP uses approx 1.3MB a minute at G.711 codec. How many minutes does your household spend on the phone a month? It is the simple things that can eat into your allowance and at present I have no idea what I use...

I appreciate your point, but the problem is who decides what is fair? 30Gb may well be an inappropriate cap for some, I don't get near that, but it might well be a fair cap for the provider at that price point.

[PC_Arcade]

Originally Posted by Kaychsea

Isn't the cap an attempt to manage it's network properly? Damn them for trying to shift to an equitable charging regime!!

Bye bye.

No, the cap is the punishing of customers because NTL CAN'T manage their network properly,if it was about being equitable, then surely they would provide higher limits off peak to try and avoid congestion at peak times, rather than just limiting everyone to 30Gb?

Originally Posted by Kaychsea

I appreciate your point, but the problem is who decides what is fair? 30Gb may well be an inappropriate cap for some, I don't get near that, but it might well be a fair cap for the provider at that price point.

30Gb in this day and age is nothing much IMHO, The latest full distribution (32 & 64 bit) of Suse Linux is 9.4 Gb, or 1/3 of your limit with one download :lol:

30Gb @ £37.99 (£1.26 per Gb) for NTL compared to
500Gb @ £24.99 (£0.04 Per Gb) for UKonline or unlimited for £24.99 (0.00 Per Gb) (bulldog, pipex, demon) etc
I can't see how £1.26 per Gb compared to the either of the above is a "fair cap at the price"

[rogerdraig]

[QUOTE=Kaychsea]Isn't the cap an attempt to manage it's network properly? Damn them for trying to shift to an equitable charging regime!!

Bye bye.
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nope its just yet another example of british companies trying to charge us more than any one else

[theNomad]

Hey see ya pc-arcade hope ya happy where you move too,no need to disrespect customers who have been using their service for as long as you.

30Gb @ £37.99 is shocking,just speaking with one of my net hang outs swedish members hes rolling on the floor thinking I'm making it up.

Surely theres some kind of govening body who stop companys over charging,like all the news reports on cd price fixing and how we live in rip off Britain.

Someone who I know online told me about this

"Brand-new Internet service provider Be Unlimited is on the verge of launching a 24Mbit/s broadband service - the fastest in the UK and triple the speed of the current leading competitor. Based on ADSL2+ technology (doubles the download bandwidth) and thanks to LLU (Local Loop Unbundling), Be Unlimited's new service should help to give the UK's broadband market a much-needed shake-up. The rollout will start in London, quickly expanding to the rest of the UK, according to the company."

I'm gonna stick it out hopefully ntl's current letters and scare tactics are as shallow as the ones we got 2 years ago and nothing else will happen,theyre also still not clearly pointing out its a capped service when advertising,if not maybe services like that be-unlimit one could prove a ray of light.