Coronavirus

[pip08456]

Originally Posted by Itshim

The vaccine, stroke 24 hrs after injection, listed as contributing factor. 8 stone max , didn't smoke, drink. Quote doc last person " I know that was likely to have one"

I know it doesn't help but possibly had an undiagnosed heart problem?

[Itshim]

Originally Posted by pip08456

I know it doesn't help but possibly had an undiagnosed heart problem?

No our doctors words were it's that b....dy vaccine. Like myself had yearly medical. And I mean full , no problems what so ever. Had PM it was a stroke.

[Pierre]

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

Agreed; let's hope those sellers of PPE that was not fit for purpose are prosecuted.

Let’s hope those that told us we had to wear it are prosecuted.

In regards to PPE not “fit for purpose”, you do recall we were told we could use a neck scarf, or any kind of material as a face covering? Can we prosecute those who advised that too.

Vaccines are not risk free, I dont think anyone has ever (sensibly) claimed they are.
Some people just want you to believe is its a higher risk than there appears to be evidence for.

There are probably many studies around this by now.
I found one done in Georgia (US) that covered about 5 million people.
It found that about 0.011% had a stroke within a 21 day period after being vaccinated.

Overall, 473 (9.498 per 100 thousand) had ischemic stroke, and 87 (1.747 per 100 thousand) subjects had developed hemorrhagic stroke within 21 days post-vaccination.

It didnt (as far as I could tell) mention how many of these died (strokes are not always fatal).
It could not of course confirm the stroke was related to the vaccine, simply that they had one within 21 days.

It did note that approximately 9% had COVID-19 infection prior to receiving the vaccine, and 0.4% had acquired the infection during the 21 day post-vaccination period. Covid itself is known to increase the risk of strokes.

[Pierre]

Originally Posted by Paul

Vaccines are not risk free, I dont think anyone has ever (sensibly) claimed they are.
Some people just want you to believe is its a higher risk than there appears to be evidence for.

There are probably many studies around this by now.
I found one done in Georgia (US) that covered about 5 million people.
It found that about 0.011% had a stroke within a 21 day period after being vaccinated.



It didnt (as far as I could tell) mention how many of these died (strokes are not always fatal).
It could not of course confirm the stroke was related to the vaccine, simply that they had one within 21 days.

It did note that approximately 9% had COVID-19 infection prior to receiving the vaccine, and 0.4% had acquired the infection during the 21 day post-vaccination period. Covid itself is known to increase the risk of strokes.

I think it turned out that anyone under the age of ……..60……as long as they were fit and healthy didn’t need the vaccine. There’ll be some variance there.

It pretty much turned out that, if you should’ve already been dead by now, this will just help you along.

I took the jab because I wanted to fly and play golf in Spain.

But, I never vaxed my kids, and anyone that did was a lunatic.

Originally Posted by Pierre

I think it turned out that anyone under the age of ……..60……as long as they were fit and healthy didn’t need the vaccine.

Based on what evidence ?

Originally Posted by Pierre

It pretty much turned out that, if you should’ve already been dead by now, this will just help you along.

Having read this three times, I still dont understand it.

Originally Posted by Pierre

But, I never vaxed my kids, and anyone that did was a lunatic.

That was your choice, however calling anyone who did "a lunatic" is just uncalled for.

[TheDaddy]

Originally Posted by Paul

Having read this three times, I still dont understand it.

Think he's saying that covid was basically harmless unless you were already really ill, I'm not sure that was true at the start anyway, iirc it mutated overtime to not be as lethal so as not to kill the hosts it could reinfect later and thus not die out itself.

That was your choice, however calling anyone who did "a lunatic" is just uncalled for.

[Dude111]

Originally Posted by Itshim

The vaccine, stroke 24 hrs after injection, listed as contributing factor. 8 stone max , didn't smoke, drink. Quote doc last person " I know that was likely to have one"

Oh my I didnt realise..... I am so sorry.. I know it doesnt help but it does to know you have people who love you and care..

[Pierre]

Originally Posted by Paul

Based on what evidence ?

all the evidence.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/...ge-and-gender/

I'm saying that link is all the evidence, but go search yourself if you doubt it.

Having read this three times, I still dont understand it.

It was a glib comment, basically you were at risk if you already had one foot in the grave

That was your choice, however calling anyone who did "a lunatic" is just uncalled for.

Well anyone that injects their kids with some something they don't need, that could have adverse side effects, would fit that description.

---------- Post added at 13:09 ---------- Previous post was at 13:07 ----------

[Stephen]

Originally Posted by Pierre

all the evidence.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/...ge-and-gender/

I'm saying that link is all the evidence, but go search yourself if you doubt it.



It was a glib comment, basically you were at risk if you already had one foot in the grave



Well anyone that injects their kids with some something they don't need, that could have adverse side effects, would fit that description.

---------- Post added at 13:09 ---------- Previous post was at 13:07 ----------

So we shouldnt give kids any vaccines or any medication then? As all medications and vaccine have side effects and some people can be allergic to them.

[nffc]

Originally Posted by Stephen

So we shouldnt give kids any vaccines or any medication then? As all medications and vaccine have side effects and some people can be allergic to them.

Not saying I totally agree with this but in general the risk to a child of catching covid has always been lower than an adult, and much lower in terms of getting an illness requiring hospital treatment or worse. However, the vaccines (which is common to all vaccines to an extent) won't prevent illness entirely, nor will they stop the virus spreading, as well as having their own side effects which can be more severe in younger age groups.


It then becomes a balance where the difference in not vaccinating and letting them get the virus and whatever happens from that has to be worked against the possible effects of having the vaccination. If it gets to the stage where the vaccine is more likely to harm than getting the disease it vaccinates against, then vaccines should still be available but with enough information to allow the patient (or their parents if it's a child) to make their own decision if they want it or not.


For a lot of things such as the MMR vaccine (which has had its own controversies) and other conditions which children are routinely vaccinated against, the vaccines have been used for years, as opposed to under five years, and the effectiveness and side effects are known, generally they have a higher chance of preventing symptoms of the disease and its spread too, which makes the benefit more obvious.


I guess there are points to vaccinating a child against a disease where the vaccine is going to neither stop them getting nor spreading the disease, and the vaccine may cause them short or longer term, maybe even permanent concerns...

Originally Posted by nffc

For a lot of things such as the MMR vaccine (which has had its own controversies).

The MMR was never controversial. It suffered at the hands of a quack, wilfully bad research, credulous newspapers who made money off lurid headlines and other moral cowards who preferred to “both-sides” the debate rather than seriously engaging with the issue.

The controversy was not the MMR, but rather the lamentable way misinformation about it was given credibility and allowed to spread in ways that had real-world effects in the lives of children who suffered, and in some cases died, as a result.

[Stephen]

All vaccines are designed to inform the immune system of what the virus is and to help it generate antibodies so it knows how to fight it off.
Vaccines will never stop you getting it or spreading it but they greatly reduce the risk of doing so.

Look at the US right now with a big drop in child vaccinations of past years there have been outbreaks of measles in multiple state. Something that hasn't happened for a long time.

Originally Posted by Pierre

all the evidence.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/...ge-and-gender/

I'm saying that link is all the evidence, but go search yourself if you doubt it.



It was a glib comment, basically you were at risk if you already had one foot in the grave



Well anyone that injects their kids with some something they don't need, that could have adverse side effects, would fit that description.

---------- Post added at 13:09 ---------- Previous post was at 13:07 ----------

Or…

Those statistics show that, since the vast majority of people were vaccinated against COVID, it helped reduce the death rates for all age groups, especially amongst the under-65s…

And the fact that most people were vaccinated, it reduced the viral load & infection rate/severity.

Comparative deaths from COVID in the USA, by age groups under 65, vaccinated vs unvaccinated

https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/u...ination-status

[nffc]

Originally Posted by Chris

The MMR was never controversial. It suffered at the hands of a quack, wilfully bad research, credulous newspapers who made money off lurid headlines and other moral cowards who preferred to “both-sides” the debate rather than seriously engaging with the issue.

The controversy was not the MMR, but rather the lamentable way misinformation about it was given credibility and allowed to spread in ways that had real-world effects in the lives of children who suffered, and in some cases died, as a result.

Yes it was, but it's much easier once misinformation had been put out (intentionally or otherwise) for it to remain in people's minds and even if later things correct it, it doesn't reverse the initial damage. You only need to look at where this has happened elsewhere to see this.


The MMR was not causing kids to develop autism, they likely had it anyway but it wouldn't come out until that age, so some people thought there was a correlation there when there was none. Can we say the same about people developing heart issues or having strokes after vaccinations (although covid can do that too)? It's still possible there the evidence hasn't built up enough, either way.