Russia has invaded Ukraine

[joglynne]

Originally Posted by Hugh

https://wapo.st/48cTI6b

Straight from the horse’s mouth (to the horse’s arse)

You couldn't make this up.

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by joglynne

You couldn't make this up.

Carlson gets hits to his YouTube, Trumpeters will lap it up and Putin gets closer to a more compliant US President in the White House.

[jfman]

Presumably the Washington Post position is that only America should be allowed to install puppet regimes around the world?

Originally Posted by jfman

Presumably the Washington Post position is that only America should be allowed to install puppet regimes around the world?

The WP position is that it reported what Putin said - it was a news report, not an editorial comment…

Are you stating that the USA installed the current Ukrainian Government as a puppet regime?

[jfman]

Ukraine is a democracy, and Zelensky, who was overwhelmingly elected president in 2014, is of Jewish descent, as are other top officials. Putin’s real goal, many analysts say, is to oust Zelensky in favor of a Russian puppet regime.

This is editorial spin masquerading as journalism.

---------- Post added at 12:26 ---------- Previous post was at 12:13 ----------

Originally Posted by Hugh

The WP position is that it reported what Putin said - it was a news report, not an editorial comment…

Are you stating that the USA installed the current Ukrainian Government as a puppet regime?

Are you stating America has never overthrown the legitimate Government of a state to further it’s own geopolitical interests in a region?

[pip08456]

Originally Posted by jfman

This is editorial spin masquerading as journalism.

---------- Post added at 12:26 ---------- Previous post was at 12:13 ----------



Are you stating America has never overthrown the legitimate Government of a state to further it’s own geopolitical interests in a region?

Are you saying this is what happened in Ukraine?

Originally Posted by pip08456

Are you saying this is what happened in Ukraine?

You’ll never get him to state it explicitly. I think he knows how distasteful such a statement would be. Pretty much as impolite as opining on Russia’s ‘legitimate security interests’. But I’ve long concluded that this is exactly what he thinks.

Bear in mind that Russia’s propaganda effort has been extensive amongst the Nat movement here in Scotland. It’s no accident that they had a propaganda news agency (called ‘Sputnik’) in Edinburgh, and our former first minister presenting a show on Russia Today, a channel now banned in the UK and across the EU. It’s part of the same campaign that has convinced MAGA republicans that cheering for Putin is somehow patriotic and makes Tucker Carlson think he’s an ace reporter for letting Putin lecture him on (bad) middle school history live on Xitter.

[jfman]

Originally Posted by Chris

You’ll never get him to state it explicitly. I think he knows how distasteful such a statement would be. Pretty much as impolite as opining on Russia’s ‘legitimate security interests’. But I’ve long concluded that this is exactly what he thinks.

Bear in mind that Russia’s propaganda effort has been extensive amongst the Nat movement here in Scotland. It’s no accident that they had a propaganda news agency (called ‘Sputnik’) in Edinburgh, and our former first minister presenting a show on Russia Today, a channel now banned in the UK and across the EU. It’s part of the same campaign that has convinced MAGA republicans that cheering for Putin is somehow patriotic and makes Tucker Carlson think he’s an ace reporter for letting Putin lecture him on (bad) middle school history live on Xitter.

Oh I’ll say that America will have been somewhere in the background pulling the strings of the Maidan revolution. It’s not particularly distasteful, and naive in the extreme to think they wouldn’t be.

I’m not really sure your issue with Russia’s security interests unless your contention is that only America has the right to topple democracies around the world and Russia, China and other interested parties should simply tolerate it.

Originally Posted by jfman

Oh I’ll say that America will have been somewhere in the background pulling the strings of the Maidan revolution. It’s not particularly distasteful, and naive in the extreme to think they wouldn’t be.

I’m not really sure your issue with Russia’s security interests unless your contention is that only America has the right to topple democracies around the world and Russia, China and other interested parties should simply tolerate it.

I think everyone’s should take issue with Russia’s security interests following Putin’s lecture at Tucker Carlson this week. It’s plain naive even to use the phrase ‘security interests’ and assume everyone uses it in the same way. Security interests within a general acceptance of the world’s international security architecture and legal definition of nation states is one thing, Russia’s self image as eternal and unbounded should be deeply troubling and chilling to anyone who bothers to listen.

Here’s a (lengthy) discussion on what Putin actually thinks about Russia and the world based on that interview, from an actual historian. Well worth the 10-15 minute read.

https://snyder.substack.com/p/putins...=true&r=1tgh1t

[jfman]

If anything is eternal and unbounded it’s America ability to flexi t’s muscle throughout the world, through almost every year of it’s existence, with it’s own propaganda apparatus in the media and in academia that will always find a way to justify any action, anywhere.

You go right on trying to sell moral equivalence between American foreign policy and Russia’s present ‘Special Military Operation on the territory of Ukraine’*. You’re making my point rather well.

*Much of which it now says always has, in fact, been the territory of Russia, but if those naughty Ukrainians were squatting on the ancient birthright of the Rus I suppose Russia has reason to kidnap their kids, burn Ukrainian language books, rape women into submission and then re-sell vacant property to Muscovites.

[pip08456]

Originally Posted by jfman

Oh I’ll say that America will have been somewhere in the background pulling the strings of the Maidan revolution. It’s not particularly distasteful, and naive in the extreme to think they wouldn’t be.

I’m not really sure your issue with Russia’s security interests unless your contention is that only America has the right to topple democracies around the world and Russia, China and other interested parties should simply tolerate it.

Maidan occurred because the then Government turned away from signng articles of agreement with the EU and turned back to Russia and the Federation deal. How America did that would be a master stroke.

If only you knew the history of Ukraine instead of what Russia purports you would have a different opinion and not make claims of US interference.



According to Russia Ukraine does not exist, nor ever has.

[jfman]

Originally Posted by pip08456

Maidan occurred because the then Government turned away from signng articles of agreement with the EU and turned back to Russia and the Federation deal. How America did that would be a master stroke.

If only you knew the history of Ukraine instead of what Russia purports you would have a different opinion and not make claims of US interference.



According to Russia Ukraine does not exist, nor ever has.

Of course, the CIA always put out a statement when they topple a democratically elected government. I should have known that.

---------- Post added at 21:43 ---------- Previous post was at 21:39 ----------

Originally Posted by Chris

You go right on trying to sell moral equivalence between American foreign policy and Russia’s present ‘Special Military Operation on the territory of Ukraine’*. You’re making my point rather well.

*Much of which it now says always has, in fact, been the territory of Russia, but if those naughty Ukrainians were squatting on the ancient birthright of the Rus I suppose Russia has reason to kidnap their kids, burn Ukrainian language books, rape women into submission and then re-sell vacant property to Muscovites.

America has no moral authority considering what it is arming in Gaza. Something far closer to a genocide than any of the allegations thrown in Russia’a direction.

At least they are getting kids out of the combat zone rather than slaughtering them with sniper fire I guess.

[Pierre]

Originally Posted by jfman

America has no moral authority considering what it is arming in Gaza. Something far closer to a genocide than any of the allegations thrown in Russia’a direction.

Harsh but fair…

Originally Posted by jfman

Of
America has no moral authority considering what it is arming in Gaza. Something far closer to a genocide than any of the allegations thrown in Russia’a direction.

At least they are getting kids out of the combat zone rather than slaughtering them with sniper fire I guess.

Do please keep it up. You’re exposing yourself superbly well.