Russia has invaded Ukraine - Page 60

**Hugh** · 08-03-2022, 22:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pierre

Whilst I can appreciate the parallels with 1938, this is not the same as 1938.

NATO is a defensive alliance. Supplying small arms etc is one thing, supplying jets is quite another.

Putin is not going to attack NATO but if we keep giving him a reason to……………

This is a bad idea.

---------- Post added at 20:20 ---------- Previous post was at 20:17 ----------

It’s only not, whilst Putin decides it’s not. If he believes NATO is attacking him ( which would be a fair conclusion if NATO are supplying Ukraine jets)

Then World War 3 it could easily become.

---------- Post added at 20:23 ---------- Previous post was at 20:20 ----------

There may not be very many survivors from the next world war.

What was it Arthur C Clarke or Carl Sagan said. Something like. I don’t know what what weapons will be used in WW3, but the next war after that will be fought with sticks and stones.

Einstein

Quote:

. “I don’t know what weapons might be used in World War III. But there isn’t any doubt what weapons will be used in World War IV.”

“And what are those?” a guest asked.

“Stone spears,” said Einstein.

**Mick** · 08-03-2022, 22:09

Coca-Cola latest company to suspend business operations in Russia

**Damien** · 08-03-2022, 22:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul

Again, I will remind all the hysterical war-mongers among you.
This is not our war, and Im really not sure why some of you seem keen to get involved.
Wars only tend to end one way ... badly.

History shows us isolationism ends badly as well. What happens in Europe eventually impacts us and we can't have an aggressively expansionist Russia on our doorstep and the ultimate conclusion of failing to punish them is they'll expand further.

We're not going to war with them but we are well within our rights to make it extremely costly for them to the point they can't rebuild their army effectively and to put pressure on them to rid us of Putin.

**Mick** · 08-03-2022, 22:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mick

Coca-Cola latest company to suspend business operations in Russia

Count Starbucks in on halting its business operations in Russia.

---------- Post added at 21:24 ---------- Previous post was at 21:18 ----------

Transport Secretary Grant Shapps just now:

Quote:

BREAKING: I have made it a criminal offence for ANY Russian aircraft to enter UK airspace and now HMG can detain these jets. We will suffocate Putin's cronies’ ability to continue living as normal while thousands of innocent people die.

Pierre · 08-03-2022, 22:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hugh

Einstein

**Mick** · 08-03-2022, 22:30

BREAKING: U.S Under Secretary of State Nuland says Poland's decision to put its Mig-29 fighter jets at disposal of the U.S was not 'pre-consulted' with Washington - The Spectator Index.

Pierre · 08-03-2022, 22:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien

We're not going to war with them

We give the Ukraine jets, and we just might.

**Mick** · 08-03-2022, 22:49

Russia Suspends sale of foreign currencies until September 9th. - AFP News Agency.

**Damien** · 08-03-2022, 22:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pierre

We give the Ukraine jets, and we just might.

We've already given them lots of weapons. If Putin wants a pretext he'll find it. He has already told us that our sanctions were a declaration of war and that he 'won't forget the UK's part' in all this. This is a country that deployed weapons on our own soil and killed people doing so. How much more do we let slide?

Mr K · 08-03-2022, 22:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mick

Russia Suspends sale of foreign currencies until September 9th. - AFP News Agency.

What are they going to use then, turnips? Their own currency is increasingly worthless.

**Paul** · 08-03-2022, 22:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien

History shows us isolationism ends badly as well.

We are not in isolation, we are in NATO, which has about 30 countries, Ukraine is not one of them.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien

We're not going to war with them but we are well within our rights to make it extremely costly for them to the point they can't rebuild their army effectively and to put pressure on them to rid us of Putin.

Why exactly are we within our rights ? Ukraine really is not on our doorstep, at all.
Russia cannot expand very far without bumping into, and going to war with, NATO, not quite the same prospect as taking on one country.

Supplying NATO war planes (dont fool yourself, that is what this would be) is a step to far.
Russia is already doing badly, giving them a legitimate excuse to lash out is a very bad idea.

I'm sure its all great fun in computer games, this is not a game.

**Hugh** · 08-03-2022, 22:59

Pepsi halting it’s soft drinks business in Russia

https://www.reuters.com/business/ret...sj-2022-03-08/

Quote:

PepsiCo Inc (PEP.O) said on Tuesday they are suspending sales of their sodas in Russia, becoming the latest high-profile Western consumer brands to curtail operations in the region following Moscow's invasion of Ukraine.

Coca-Cola said its business in Russia and Ukraine contributed about 1% to 2% of the company's net operating revenue in 2021.

PepsiCo, whose colas were one of the few Western products allowed in the Soviet Union prior to its collapse, said it would continue to sell daily essentials, such as milk and other dairy offerings, baby formula and baby food, in Russia.

RichardCoulter · 08-03-2022, 23:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hugh

Pepsi halting it’s soft drinks business in Russia

https://www.reuters.com/business/ret...sj-2022-03-08/

They all seem to be withdrawing business from Russia now

Much ado has been made about Coca Cola, it was reported by Sky's website an hour ago that they too have temporarily pulled out of Russia:

Apart from Ukraine, these companies may well be afraid that they won't get paid for their stock by franchisees, that stock won't sell and staff get paid for doing nothing as money gets tighter or that stores may be broken into and stock stolen as people get more desperate as the economy collapses.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/news.sk...e-war-12560435

**Damien** · 08-03-2022, 23:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul

Russia is already doing badly, giving them a legitimate excuse to lash out is a very bad idea.

They're doing badly in part because we're arming Ukraine and imposing sanctions. Putin doesn't need a legitimate excuse, he never does, he just makes it up and does what he wants. I am talking more about sanctions than giving them planes which I haven't thought a lot of about today.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul

I'm sure its all great fun in computer games, this is not a game.

There isn't any need to be patronising, I am aware this is not a game. I am just even more pessimistic than you on this, I don't think he'll stop if we let him take Ukraine without it taking a heavy cost. This needs to be the end of it or he'll keep pushing and pushing and there is only so long we can let him do that because we're at the same stage anyway.

Pierre · 08-03-2022, 23:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien

We've already given them lots of weapons.

Small arms ( In the great scheme of things) stuff they could probably procure from anywhere.

It’s not provocative because if it didn’t come from NATO/ NATO nations, it could come from anywhere.

Jet fighters however, are not the kind of thing you just pick up on the black market from arms dealers……you can …….but maybe one or two and god knows the age /quality….but Poland has offered operational MIGs, to the US to give to the Ukraine in return for US jets.

That is not small arms and equipment, and it’s NATO, whatever way you spin it.

I don’t think it will happen, I hope it doesn’t.