Brexit

Originally Posted by nomadking

So what have the Remain side done that HASN'T blocked Brexit? Unless you are suggesting that it has been the Brexit side that has been blocking it.

To be fair, the ERG has been blocking Brexit, because it thinks May’s deal isn’t Brexity enough.

[nomadking]

Originally Posted by Chris

To be fair, the ERG has been blocking Brexit, because it thinks May’s deal isn’t Brexity enough.

It's not Brexit in any shape or form. What utter moron allowed "to apply unless and until an alternative arrangement implementing another scenario is agreed," into the WA, which means a customs union stays in place until the EU kindly through the goodness of it's heart, allows otherwise.

[ianch99]

For the last few days I have been in the far north of Scotland and sitting & looking at the views at Cape Wrath

2019-05-19 14.00.12.JPG

Brexit seemed a long way away. Back home, reality creeps back in

Here's a depressing example: Femi is an ardent Remain campaigner who tries to argue the case for Remain/2nd Vote in a calm and constructive way. He never insults anyone and is always calm and respectful.

Here he is at a rally where he is offering to debate the case for No Deal with anyone who wants to talk to him:

https://twitter.com/Femi_Sorry/statu...66941236498434

Watch the video and see the sort of Britain what may await us ..

I don't mind Right-Wing thugs chucking their drinks on me.
I don't mind them poking me in the face with a flagpole.
I do mind that Nigel Farage is set to WIN the European Elections on Thursday, by calling anyone who opposes a form of Brexit he said would never happen, "traitors".

Here he is wanting to debate with people and he gets water thrown at him, gets called "F***king Traitor, Treacherous ****, etc"

Welcome to Farage's Britain ..

[ianch99]

Another terrible example:

https://twitter.com/Femi_Sorry/statu...64628081696768

[nomadking]

All that was started and promoted by REMAIN.
May 2016

UKIP leader Nigel Farage had to cancel a planned bus visit to Northampton town centre because of protesters.

May 2013

The Ukip leader was finally whisked away in a police riot van under a tirade of abuse from a crowd of about 50 young demonstrators – students, anti-racist campaigners and activists in the radical left pro-Scottish independence movement – after being forced to retreat not once, twice or three times, but four times.

[OLD BOY]

Originally Posted by Chris

To be fair, the ERG has been blocking Brexit, because it thinks May’s deal isn’t Brexity enough.

The ERG has not been blocking Brexit, it has been blocking Brino.

---------- Post added at 14:45 ---------- Previous post was at 14:43 ----------

Originally Posted by ianch99

For the last few days I have been in the far north of Scotland and sitting & looking at the views at Cape Wrath

Attachment 27878

Brexit seemed a long way away. Back home, reality creeps back in

Here's a depressing example: Femi is an ardent Remain campaigner who tries to argue the case for Remain/2nd Vote in a calm and constructive way. He never insults anyone and is always calm and respectful.

Here he is at a rally where he is offering to debate the case for No Deal with anyone who wants to talk to him:

https://twitter.com/Femi_Sorry/statu...66941236498434

Watch the video and see the sort of Britain what may await us ..



Here he is wanting to debate with people and he gets water thrown at him, gets called "F***king Traitor, Treacherous ****, etc"

Welcome to Farage's Britain ..

I wouldn't condone that, but people who are not democratic cannot expect an easy ride in this country when they spout forth.

[papa smurf]

Originally Posted by ianch99

For the last few days I have been in the far north of Scotland and sitting & looking at the views at Cape Wrath

Attachment 27878

Brexit seemed a long way away. Back home, reality creeps back in

Here's a depressing example: Femi is an ardent Remain campaigner who tries to argue the case for Remain/2nd Vote in a calm and constructive way. He never insults anyone and is always calm and respectful.

Here he is at a rally where he is offering to debate the case for No Deal with anyone who wants to talk to him:

https://twitter.com/Femi_Sorry/statu...66941236498434

Watch the video and see the sort of Britain what may await us ..



Here he is wanting to debate with people and he gets water thrown at him, gets called "F***king Traitor, Treacherous ****, etc"

Welcome to Farage's Britain ..

Why was he at a Brexit rally, was he looking to provoke people?

[RichardCoulter]

Ex pats in France have been complaining that their EU election postal votes have arrived too late for them to vote. Apparently, it's because some local authorities in the UK sent them via the Netherlands because it's cheaper to do so.

Could it be a possibility that this could be used to declare the results to be invalid?

I'm not sure why they can't let them arrive late in the circumstances as they aren't usually counted on the day of election itself, last time our EU votes weren't being counted until the following Sunday. Perhaps it's something to do with electoral law ie all postal votes must be received on or before election day itself??

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by nomadking

All that was started and promoted by REMAIN.
May 2016

May 2013

Strange post. Doubt it's possible to prove who started it but the main thing is to condemn it regardless of which viewpoints are held.

[ianch99]

Originally Posted by papa smurf

Why was he at a Brexit rally, was he looking to provoke people?

Sort of sums up where we are now

All you can comment on is why is someone wanting to engage in civil debate.You are not interested in what they did or what they said to him.

---------- Post added at 15:16 ---------- Previous post was at 15:11 ----------

Originally Posted by Sephiroth

Best to leave without a deal, imo.

There is no mandate for No Deal I am afraid. The official Leave campaign did not endorse or promote No Deal in 2016.

Now, if you want to present this new plan to the people, then I am in 100% agreement with you.

[papa smurf]

Originally Posted by ianch99

Sort of sums up where we are now

All you can comment on is why is someone wanting to engage in civil debate.You are not interested in what they did or what they said to him.

Strange you only example a remainer, sort of sums up where we are.

[jonbxx]

Originally Posted by gba93

... and so we enter into the realms of the EU solution to all problematic referendums; if you don't get the answer you want keep going until you do get it and then, and only then, do you stop ~ that's EU democracy for you.

Do you have examples of this? I do see the examples of Ireland and Denmark being used by others but the got the opt outs/changes they wanted such as;

Denmark Maastricht Treaty - Economic and Monetary Union, Union Citizenship, Justice and Home Affairs, and Common Defence

Ireland Treaty of Nice - exclusion of common defence

Ireland Lisbon Treaty - numbers of Commissioners, common defence and abortion rights

So in each case where a referendum was run again, the situation was different. There have been other referendums where a 'no' has stopped the process altogether (see 2005 European Constitution referendums in France and Netherlands)

However, it possible I have missed something...

[ianch99]

Originally Posted by jonbxx

Do you have examples of this? I do see the examples of Ireland and Denmark being used by others but the got the opt outs/changes they wanted such as;

Denmark Maastricht Treaty - Economic and Monetary Union, Union Citizenship, Justice and Home Affairs, and Common Defence

Ireland Treaty of Nice - exclusion of common defence

Ireland Lisbon Treaty - numbers of Commissioners, common defence and abortion rights

So in each case where a referendum was run again, the situation was different. There have been other referendums where a 'no' has stopped the process altogether (see 2005 European Constitution referendums in France and Netherlands)

However, it possible I have missed something...

Examples are not necessary. This is folklore now.

---------- Post added at 15:32 ---------- Previous post was at 15:30 ----------

Originally Posted by papa smurf

Strange you only example a remainer, sort of sums up where we are.

Show me an example of the reverse where people asking to debate the issues are called "Treacherous ****" and worse and I will be more than happy to condemn it.

I just ask you to do the same. Over to you ..

[Pierre]

Originally Posted by ianch99

Sort of sums up where we are now

All you can comment on is why is someone wanting to engage in civil debate.You are not interested in what they did or what they said to him.

---------- Post added at 15:16 ---------- Previous post was at 15:11 ----------

It’s a commonly used tactic, go onto you tube and see infowars or similar where American conservatives attend Leftist anti-trump rallies.

And see how the “American Liberal Left” react to someone with a different opinion wanting to engage in civil debate.

No one can claim moral superiority in this type of thing.

There is no mandate for No Deal I am afraid. The official Leave campaign did not endorse or promote No Deal in 2016.

Now, if you want to present this new plan to the people, then I am in 100% agreement with you.

I would be quite happy for the question of deal or no deal be put to the public, then we’ll see if there is a mandate or not. There’s certainly no mandate in parliament, but as we know parliament is not representative of the people.

Originally Posted by ianch99

There is no mandate for No Deal I am afraid. The official Leave campaign did not endorse or promote No Deal in 2016.

Now, if you want to present this new plan to the people, then I am in 100% agreement with you.

The referendum simply gave HMG a mandate to take us out of the EU. The idea that it mandated any specific way of doing that is just remainer wishful thinking.

None of the Leave campaigns represented either government or official opposition. The official status of one leave campaign was a legal device designed to regulate funding and access to TV airtime. It did not designate their campaign material as a kind of quasi-manifesto.

You may feel the whole thing was appallingly sloppy and unfair but it was legal, and the result - a simple, naked mandate to leave the EU - was valid.

I’m afraid that arguments based on the exact nature of the mandate granted in 2016, great as they may sound, are not valid.