Another Cyclist Death

[Arthurgray50@blu]

http://www.itv.com/news/london/story...st-collisions/

Yet again we here of cyclist being killed on the London roads, and on the cycle tracks that are supposed to help cyclist.

To be honest with you all, l am totally surprised that there is not more either killed or seriously injured.

I cycle each day in my job, but 90% of the time cyclist's do not obey the law, either going through red lights or crossing busy jctns.

In London, there are police cyclist, that go and give out fines for them if they go through red lights.

In fact only yesterday l was driving down a busy road that runs between Gillete Corner and passed Warren Farm football fields, it was totally dark, and in front of me was a cyclist. NO lights, NO hi vis jacket yet just cycling.

I feel sorry for them if they get injured, but they MUST be seen, to avoid accidents.

The tragic accident that l have ever seen, was when a cyclist passed a Lorry on its left and there was a clear sign on the Lorry NOT to pass on his left. And the cyclist was trapped between the left side of the lorry and a road metal fence and she was crushed to death.

If they are to use the roads, then they must wear proper gear and lights. Tragic deaths can be avoided, and cyclist MUST be taught this. As l said l do cycle approx 20 miles per day.

Bows roundabout is not cycle friendly ,it definitely needs a bit of work.I have no problem at all with cyclists in london, think of the congestion if all those cyclists decided to drive cars but the time is approaching where they must be required to pass a test .Also it may be an idea to scrap cycle lanes

[Osem]

Originally Posted by martyh

Bows roundabout is not cycle friendly ,it definitely needs a bit of work.I have no problem at all with cyclists in london, think of the congestion if all those cyclists decided to drive cars but the time is approaching where they must be required to pass a test .Also it may be an idea to scrap cycle lanes

Around here we have some cycle-ways on the footpaths and they're hardly ever used by cyclists for some reason. My wife uses a couple of them regularly but hardly ever sees anyone else doing so.

There are so many more cyclists now that there are bound to be more accidents. As slower 'amateur' cyclists increasingly come into conflict with the courier variety and the lycra clad Tour de France wannabes, they are also put at risk by speed merchants darting in/out at speed from all angles in their quest to get where they're going as quickly as possible. This too can cause accidents.

I agree that drivers need to be more aware but being surrounded by people on bikes all trying to do their own thing, many of them ignoring the highway code and none of them indicating what their next move is going to be, life can become very difficult. Yes training is important but just as important is changing the mindset of that proportion of cyclists who act as though the rules are for everyone else and believe that accidents are never their fault. How we're going to do that is another matter. I guess prosecution is the only way to tackle the hard core but judging from the indignant attitude to criticism of many serious cyclists I can see it taking a very long time to make them see that they too need to behave responsibly on our roads. It's far easier to blame the motorist, the taxi driver, the bus driver the lorry driver and anyone else for that matter.

Yesterday we saw what I imagine is a common problem and the cause of many serious accidents. We were stuck at a junction with 2 buses in front of us wanting to turn left and indicating accordingly. A cyclist came up on the inside of us and tried to squeeze past the buses on the inside even though there was hardly any room to do so and his presence would either prevent the drivers from turning left until he was out of the way or quite possibly result in him being crushed under their wheels. There was plenty of room next to our car and he'd have been perfectly safe waiting there for the lights to turn green and the buses move off but for some reason that wasn't his choice and he found himself wedged between the bus and the railings. Did he see their indicators? Did he care? Did he realise what danger he was placing himself in? It's hard to imagine why he did such a stupid thing but IMHO it's stupidly like that which leads to a great many accidents involving cyclists.

[LondonRoad]

I see the aggressive law breaking cyclist all the time and it's a pity that all cyclists get tarred with the same brush.

I'm a great believer in cycling defensively. It's very difficult to argue the point that you are in the right if your brains are spread over a large area of tarmac!

I find professional drivers far more courteous and aware than most private motorists..... especially the school run platoon Most of them seem to think that cyclist require the same width of road as a cycle tyre.

[Osem]

Cyclists have been very good at recording and publishing incidents in which they've been the victims via headcams and the like. Increasingly we're going to get the other view as more drivers get dash cams and more footage starts to emerge of the crazy and dangerous things many cyclists do. Of course this will rarely lead to prosecution due to lack of ID but IMHO it will reveal that there is a serious issue with a significant proportion of cyclists and will help innocent drivers avoid unwarranted prosecution. If I were a regular city centre driver I'd definitely get front and rear cameras installed.

Originally Posted by Osem

I guess prosecution is the only way to tackle the hard core but judging from the indignant attitude to criticism of many serious cyclists I can see it taking a very long time to make them see that they too need to behave responsibly on our roads. It's far easier to blame the motorist, the taxi driver, the bus driver the lorry driver and anyone else for that matter.
.

Cyclists need to lose the attitude that they have priority over everything on the roads because they are saving the planet .I'm going down to liverpool street station in london later on today for delivery 10am tomorrow and the first thing i will do is turn my video camera on

---------- Post added at 10:11 ---------- Previous post was at 09:42 ----------

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-24936942

and another one ,this time involving a bus .Questions are now being asked about the safety of the cycle superhighways which imo have only served to increase congestion and endanger cyclists lives

[MovedGoalPosts]

Cyclists do need to accept they are vulnerable. Motorbike riders have generally learnt this. Neither has protection from any metal work to shield their body. If there is an accident, regardless of the reasons why, they will come off worst. It appears that too many cyclists ride aggressively, rather than defensively.

But there is a problem with many so called cycle routes. They can enhance a sense of invulnerability, and give a sense of false priority. Often the routes are badly designed, and frequently a waste of space. Many are simply a series of markings and at every junction the priority of the cycle route is lost, or even due to lack of space the cycleway ends throwing the cyclist into the main traffic route. It's often simpler for the cyclist to stay on the main road. But if there are give way markings they do need to be observed. Only yesterday I nearly collided with a speeding cyclist that had ignored the give way markings on his route as I turned right across a junction.

No one wishes there to be an accident. Somehow we all have to fit on the overcrowded road network, and that means we all have to be a little more patient with each other rather than the get there at any cost attitude that has started to prevail amongst all users whether drivers or riders.

London is certainly different to most none cities. I ride in a town and the only issues I have are drivers who just do not see me specially in poor light so I have bought new lights a cree torch and clip for my front light very bright and wide beam and a red led and laser light for my rear. Round here drives tend to be decent I have found and pretty much let me make maneuvers to turn right when needed and do not try to force me into the pot holes by the curb

[alferret]

Blimey Arthur, a post of yours that a, I agree with and b, makes sense.

Don't tell me there is a full moon tonight!

Anybody can jump on a bike, no lessons on road safety or etiquette, added to that there is no compulsory insurance requirement, no mot of the bike required, in fact it's only advisory that bike riders wear a helmet.
Maybe if laws were changed, not to make things difficult for cyclists but to make sure a level of competency is reached before people are legally allowed to take to the road.
Just think if motorcyclists carried on like some cyclists do there would be uproar!

Originally Posted by alferret

Blimey Arthur, a post of yours that a, I agree with and b, makes sense.

Don't tell me there is a full moon tonight!

Anybody can jump on a bike, no lessons on road safety or etiquette, added to that there is no compulsory insurance requirement, no mot of the bike required, in fact it's only advisory that bike riders wear a helmet.
Maybe if laws were changed, not to make things difficult for cyclists but to make sure a level of competency is reached before people are legally allowed to take to the road.
Just think if motorcyclists carried on like some cyclists do there would be uproar!

If motor vehicle drivers can be forced to wear seat belts for their own good ,have insurance and pass a test then i'm damn sure that cyclists could be forced to wear helmets ,hi viz for their own good ,have insurance and pass a test

[Arthurgray50@blu]

As l have said l cycle each day in my job, and do so for approx 6 hours of the day.

I have lights, high Vis etc. BUT to me cyclists have a responsibility to themself, to protect their health and also any other vehicles on the road.

When a person buys a cycle, they should register that cycle and then be FORCED to take out insurance in case of accident. Just like when you buy a Tv, your info is passed onto the relevant organisations.

I have seen some very stupid decisions by cyclists, BUT all these companies out there who say that WE must be vigilant towards cyclists. How can we if we cannot see them.

Cycling is very good healthwise for you - its also very dangerous when you go through traffic lights.

Originally Posted by Arthurgray50@blu

As l have said l cycle each day in my job, and do so for approx 6 hours of the day.

I have lights, high Vis etc. BUT to me cyclists have a responsibility to themself, to protect their health and also any other vehicles on the road.

When a person buys a cycle, they should register that cycle and then be FORCED to take out insurance in case of accident. Just like when you buy a Tv, your info is passed onto the relevant organisations.

I have seen some very stupid decisions by cyclists, BUT all these companies out there who say that WE must be vigilant towards cyclists. How can we if we cannot see them.

Cycling is very good healthwise for you - its also very dangerous when you go through traffic lights.

You cycle 6hrs a day

[alferret]

Originally Posted by martyh:35645113

You cycle 6hrs a day

He only works for 45 minutes, take off mandatory breaks and traveling to each customer/client/needy it only leaves time for a backside wipe and a cuppa

He is right tho, at point of sale info should be passed on (like as Arthur says same as tv license) bikes could be tagged with an I'd chip and third party insurance brought also at point of sale.

[Halcyon]

I know that both car drivers and cyclists are equally to blame but the amount of times on a daily basis I see cyclists fly through red lights....... Get's me real annoyed!

Originally Posted by Halcyon

I know that both car drivers and cyclists are equally to blame but the amount of times on a daily basis I see cyclists fly through red lights....... Get's me real annoyed!

I do not fly anywhere on my bike lol