The state benefits system mega-thread.

[nomadking]

There are still some circumstances where GPs are required to take part in the appeals process for benefits claimants as part of their contracts. But only if they are written to by medical professionals from Atos, the private company assessing benefits.

They are still required to provide info to the DWP etc, just not for a specific patient request.

Fiona Howells, who lives in Ferndale in the Rhondda, said her doctor had initially agreed to write a supporting letter for a £20 fee, but then withdrew that offer.

well according to Nick and Margaret on BBC the nation average is still 5 people unemployed for every job and then there are those in work after changing jobs according to documentary tonight in some areas there are 45 applicants for every low paid job

[peanut]

Bad news buried behind 'major' news...

'Disabled benefits claimants test: Atos reports found 'unacceptably poor'.'

http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/20...os?INTCMP=SRCH

I can't seem to find anything on this on the BBC etc.

[Sirius]

Originally Posted by tizmeinnit

Breaching the Hippocratic oath the very thing they stand for

Why,

The NHS are there to save lives not fight for people's benefit claims. Since when has the hippocratic oath covered supporting benefit claims.

My doctor would not sign my passport application when i asked because he said it was not part of his job role, which was to cure people's illnesses. Sso why should he spend time filling out forms and writing letters to the benefit office.

[Osem]

Originally Posted by peanut

Bad news buried behind 'major' news...

'Disabled benefits claimants test: Atos reports found 'unacceptably poor'.'

http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/20...os?INTCMP=SRCH

I can't seem to find anything on this on the BBC etc.

The company which carries out "fitness-for-work" tests on disabled people has been told to improve its services, after an "unacceptable reduction" in the quality of its written reports.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-23405339

[peanut]

Originally Posted by Osem

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-23405339

I looked but couldn't see anything.

---------- Post added at 08:11 ---------- Previous post was at 08:01 ----------

Originally Posted by Sirius

Why,

The NHS are there to save lives not fight for people's benefit claims. Since when has the hippocratic oath covered supporting benefit claims.

My doctor would not sign my passport application when i asked because he said it was not part of his job role, which was to cure people's illnesses. Sso why should he spend time filling out forms and writing letters to the benefit office.

I take it you haven't the need for any help in trying to fight your own cause, because without that help you're screwed basically.

It's odd when the forms you fill in ask for evidence from your GP and also the full details of your GP and consultants, so now you're saying they shouldn't get involved. So what would happen then? Just leave it to ATOS to screw you over royally, do you think that's fine? Just because you think that those that know your history shouldn't be allowed to do their jobs? Without the letter from my GP I doubt wouldn't have been able win (such a bad word to convey such an 'award') my claim.

If ATOS did a proper job, then they would get info from your GP and consultants and they would take it into account but they don't. So we have to fight our own corner and produce the evidence needed, where you do think we should get this evidence from? Instead they ignore medical information and then it goes to the appeals which all adds to the cost of the taxpayer.

What a strange attitude you have.

As for the passport, most have a charge to sign those type of docs. It seems you have one of a few practices that just sounds crap.

[Russ]

Originally Posted by Sirius

My doctor would not sign my passport application when i asked because he said it was not part of his job role, which was to cure people's illnesses. Sso why should he spend time filling out forms and writing letters to the benefit office.

If he's willing to be paid for it (many doctors charge £20 for a signature in such matters) then I don't see why he won't do it.

In my day job if someone asked me to 'officiate' a pro wrestling match then of course I'd refuse. While at work (my main role) I'm there to do a job. But outside of those hours if someone wants to book me to ref a show then I'll do it, providing I get paid for it.

Doctors could easily do the same. Many of them have second jobs (private practices, consultancy work etc) so why don't they offer a 'signature' service as well? They can ensure they get paid for it (and not getting in to a debate about whether £20 is value for money for a scribble) so as far as I can see the only doctors who refuse to offer this are the ones who don't want to.

Originally Posted by Sirius

Why,

The NHS are there to save lives not fight for people's benefit claims. Since when has the hippocratic oath covered supporting benefit claims.

My doctor would not sign my passport application when i asked because he said it was not part of his job role, which was to cure people's illnesses. Sso why should he spend time filling out forms and writing letters to the benefit office.

Because it harms the patient and therefore breaches the Hippocratic oath. The end results could lead a mentally ill patient to suicide or other forms of harm. Making sure you can go abroad is totally different

---------- Post added at 09:30 ---------- Previous post was at 09:24 ----------

ATOS are working to DWP / Gov guidelines the policies ATOS are following are not theirs there prime purpose in life is to get people off ESA/incap and onto JSA in a cash cutting ploy.

A recent documentary shows that there is 1 job for every 5 applicants however a lot of applicants for these jobs are already in employment and looking to move. Lower paid less skilled jobs have seen approx 45 applicants per job so the urinating in the wind continues

The long term unemployed IMO should be allowed a year in full time education and as long as they apply themselves and turn up then they should get benefits at least this way there will be more people with training available later on

And so I will again repeat myself. ESA and Incap is less than 10 billion a year this year the government have given away 11 billion in foreign aid and the state pension has cost 75 billion. ATOS themselves have 3 billion in gov contracts

It is no wonder IDS and Cameron's shoes are wet I tell you

[Sirius]

Originally Posted by Russ

If he's willing to be paid for it (many doctors charge £20 for a signature in such matters) then I don't see why he won't do it.

In my day job if someone asked me to 'officiate' a pro wrestling match then of course I'd refuse. While at work (my main role) I'm there to do a job. But outside of those hours if someone wants to book me to ref a show then I'll do it, providing I get paid for it.

Doctors could easily do the same. Many of them have second jobs (private practices, consultancy work etc) so why don't they offer a 'signature' service as well? They can ensure they get paid for it (and not getting in to a debate about whether £20 is value for money for a scribble) so as far as I can see the only doctors who refuse to offer this are the ones who don't want to.

Thats was the case, he does not do it at all even paid.

---------- Post added at 11:56 ---------- Previous post was at 11:54 ----------

Originally Posted by peanut

:What a strange attitude you have.
.

I could say the same for you. Everyone posting on this forum has a right to post how they feel about a subject, therefor i did and have.

[Gavin78]

My brother has been in a bad situation, He worked for the Royal Armouries since leaving school at 16 he worked for them for about 15 years then got made redundant in 2011.

Since then he has struggled to find work as when he left school he left with not much qualifications and never expected to the inside of a dole office. but here we are but because of government cut backs the house he lives in is private rent and is around £460 a month while working it wasn't a problems he's never been in debt.

But because he is under 35 (34) this year he is classed as only being able to get shared accommodation rent (£61) a week which doesn't cover his rent neither does the dole money he gets every 2 weeks make up for the rest as he uses that for food, gas/elec, water etc.

He's spoken to the local councilor and gone through a break down of his general living and he's agreed the outgoings far exceed his living.

He's applying for 1 bed flats through the council and managed to get moved to band B giving him a better chance. but no luck yet and he's struggling with jobs. his CV is fine but I think its the masses applying.

The housing officer has suggested that he sell his his stuff and move into a hostel. I was well annoyed over hearing that. he's spent years building his house up and 33 I don't see why he should give it all up because at 35 you seem to be classed as ok to get £100 a week towards rent. which it would have stopped him getting in so much debt.

So he is about 2k in debt with rent now the landlord has been ok with it and understands his circumstances but even he has said that he can only take it for so long and he'll be kicked out so it's just a matter of time.

So he can't get any help at all times have got hard

Originally Posted by Gavin78

My brother has been in a bad situation, He worked for the Royal Armouries since leaving school at 16 he worked for them for about 15 years then got made redundant in 2011.

Since then he has struggled to find work as when he left school he left with not much qualifications and never expected to the inside of a dole office. but here we are but because of government cut backs the house he lives in is private rent and is around £460 a month while working it wasn't a problems he's never been in debt.

But because he is under 35 (34) this year he is classed as only being able to get shared accommodation rent (£61) a week which doesn't cover his rent neither does the dole money he gets every 2 weeks make up for the rest as he uses that for food, gas/elec, water etc.

He's spoken to the local councilor and gone through a break down of his general living and he's agreed the outgoings far exceed his living.

He's applying for 1 bed flats through the council and managed to get moved to band B giving him a better chance. but no luck yet and he's struggling with jobs. his CV is fine but I think its the masses applying.

The housing officer has suggested that he sell his his stuff and move into a hostel. I was well annoyed over hearing that. he's spent years building his house up and 33 I don't see why he should give it all up because at 35 you seem to be classed as ok to get £100 a week towards rent. which it would have stopped him getting in so much debt.

So he is about 2k in debt with rent now the landlord has been ok with it and understands his circumstances but even he has said that he can only take it for so long and he'll be kicked out so it's just a matter of time.

So he can't get any help at all times have got hard

yeah these age things are stupid . I lived in shared housing for years as a young man that was fine then but I was 24 when I got a flatlet self contained and it was heaven I still partied hard but I had the choice on if it was at mine or not. 25 is a more realistic figure if one has to be used not 35 when you should be settled

[Gavin78]

I guess 35 is the new 21 not classed as an Adult in the governments eyes till then

[iFrankie]

Well ive had a bad few months due to incapacity changing over to ESA my mental health went pretty bad again due to worrying constantly.

Received my letter today saying i have been awarded ESA and placed in the support group, this is without a medical so this is a huge relief and now i can restart on getting help again.

I do have the say the system is wrong! i find it unfair that i didn't need to go for a medical but someone with a terminal illness has to and they get refused it and sadly they pass away, how is this right? of course i am not well but i think i should of gone for a medical.

[Taf]

If other medical persons have backed up your sitution, then further medicals aren't really necessary.

Best wishes for your future.

[peanut]

Originally Posted by iFrankie

Well ive had a bad few months due to incapacity changing over to ESA my mental health went pretty bad again due to worrying constantly.

Received my letter today saying i have been awarded ESA and placed in the support group, this is without a medical so this is a huge relief and now i can restart on getting help again.

I do have the say the system is wrong! i find it unfair that i didn't need to go for a medical but someone with a terminal illness has to and they get refused it and sadly they pass away, how is this right? of course i am not well but i think i should of gone for a medical.

Consider yourself lucky that you didn't need a medical, otherwise there would have been a good chance you wouldn't be in the group you're in now. Then your health would probably have gotten worse with all the stress of the appeal(s) etc.

I understand where you're coming from though.

Also congrats on getting this far and for your result.