Unpaid workschemes are illegal

[Gary L]

Originally Posted by martyh

you'll be wrong Article 4 was dismissed last year

http://www.guardian.co.uk/law/2012/a...wful-poundland

I know.
it was mostly a personal opinion.

Mr Justice Foskett, sitting at the high court in London, said that "characterising such a scheme as involving or being analogous to 'slavery' or 'forced labour' seems to me to be a long way from contemporary thinking".

Second time around.

---------- Post added at 22:28 ---------- Previous post was at 22:09 ----------

The European Court of Human Rights’ definition of forced labour in Article
4 is derived from Article 2 of the International Labour Organisation (ILO)
Convention 29.5 This defines forced labour as ‘all work or service which is
exacted from any person under the menace of any penalty and for which the
said person has not offered himself voluntarily’.

That judges reasoning was based on comparing a British person being put in the position of slavery by the British Government. and probably being distracted by the comparism of 'The British' and immigrants and such.

remember. before now it was always being made a point by Grayling and such that this workfare was a 'voluntary' thing. it's since been proved that it isn't, wasn't. and never was.

that is really weird now remembering how people made a point of saying that it was voluntary and not compulsory.
they went as far as to say that it was voluntary from the start. but once the 'volunteer' had commited, then it became compulsory.

we now know that the 'volunteer' never 'volunteered' in the first place.
it was compulsory from the start. enforced with threats of losing money.
which has now been ruled must be returned.

volunteering was the key thing in this scam.

we have a case.

[Arthurgray50@blu]

I wish to apologise for something that l have just read again - ('a large majority of the unemployed, have become so by fault of there own.'-)

This should have read ' alrge majoirty of the unemployed have become so no fault of there own'

As l have said l was unemployed due to redundancy, and you get no help whatsoever, the only help l got was by being told to go 'cold calling' at building sites, when you found out who was going to open there. My apologise again.(when l am wrong, l say l am wrong)

[danielf]

Originally Posted by Arthurgray50@blu

I wish to apologise for something that l have just read again - ('a large majority of the unemployed, have become so by fault of there own.'-)

This should have read ' alrge majoirty of the unemployed have become so no fault of there own'

As l have said l was unemployed due to redundancy, and you get no help whatsoever, the only help l got was by being told to go 'cold calling' at building sites, when you found out who was going to open there. My apologise again.(when l am wrong, l say l am wrong)

alrge majoirty?

(We knew what you meant Arthur)

[TheDaddy]

Cheers for clearing that up Arthur

[Gary L]

This 'benefit culture' is simply outrageous!!
Here's a documented case of a man, who has significant pesonal savings, claiming goods and furnsihings from the state - items ncluding;
£2,000 for “midsummer glow” carpets,
£1,715 for a dining table, chair, bookshelf and chest, £1,700 for a
boiler, £1,600 for
curtains, £749 for a TV, £650 for decorating, £478 for a washing
machine, £294 for a coffee table and lamp table, £249 for a vacuum
cleaner and £199 for a music centre.
Shocking stuff! - no wonder these people don't want to work for a living!
Oh, the claimant? - one Mark Hoban, currently in charge of the Ministry of Persecution....

[Gary L]

A4e employee tweets remarks about unemployed clients.

Thanks to those who pointed us to this conversation yesterday. Incredible, isn't it?
Let's just think about what was going on in Doncaster. It would be quite normal, in a group session dealing with, say, interviews, to talk about the need to be scrubbed up and well turned out. It could well be that one or two people in such a group have obvious problems with personal hygiene. It should then be up to the adviser to talk to those individuals privately. Maybe they are homeless. Maybe they have mental health issues. But the idea that you need to teach a "class" on washing and using toilet paper is extraordinary. I'd love to know the reactions of the vast majority of the class.
But then there's the issue of Olliff-Cooper actually tweeting this. What did he think he was doing? It's a vile insult to unemployed people forced onto the Work Programme with A4e. It says to potential employers that there's no point in even looking at these primitive savages. And that can't do much to help A4e's profits. This from the man who is A4e's director of policy and strategy!

Link to the quote above..

http://watchinga4e.blogspot.co.uk/20...se-tweets.html

[Gary L]

Thanks, Hugh.
distracted with other things and forgot to put it in.

Well the tories do think of us as the great unwashed can't blame us if we live upto it . Is it still one of dave's pals reaping the rewards of total carp such as this. Also this is not new when i was unemployed we had to attend various courses they called them and not one single practical thing did i or anyone else there learn it just seemed to be a way for the company responsible to pass the time say they had us and no doubt fire in the bill.

[Ramrod]

I know of one interviewee who, on being asked to 'take a chair', picked it up and asked where he should take it......
I once interviewed a woman (sent by the jobcenter) who turned up rather inappropriately dressed and with 'big boy' tattooed on one forearm
There are some people out there who are in need of guidance in negotiating aspects of life that most of us can handle without instruction.....

[colin25]

Originally Posted by Ramrod

I know of one interviewee who, on being asked to 'take a chair', picked it up and asked where he should take it......
I once interviewed a woman (sent by the jobcenter) who turned up rather inappropriately dressed and with 'big boy' tattooed on one forearm
There are some people out there who are in need of guidance in negotiating aspects of life that most of us can handle without instruction.....

Though in defence to the guy who actually took the chair, he was doing what was asked, fairly inteligent of him

[Gary L]

Originally Posted by Ramrod

I know of one interviewee who, on being asked to 'take a chair', picked it up and asked where he should take it......

See. classic case of being that used to being told what to do or his money will be stopped.

[Sirius]

Originally Posted by Ramrod

I know of one interviewee who, on being asked to 'take a chair', picked it up and asked where he should take it......
I once interviewed a woman (sent by the jobcenter) who turned up rather inappropriately dressed and with 'big boy' tattooed on one forearm
There are some people out there who are in need of guidance in negotiating aspects of life that most of us can handle without instruction.....

I bet she scared you as well.

Originally Posted by Gary L

See. classic case of being that used to being told what to do or his money will be stopped.

See - classic case of distorting a statement to support one's pet theory....

I read it as the person being asked to "take the chair" had never been involved in a meeting (or running a meeting), so didn't understand (and why should he) the colloquialism, so took the statement at face value (he took the chair, and asked where to place it).

[Gary L]

Originally Posted by Hugh

See - classic case of distorting a statement to support one's pet theory....

I read it as the person being asked to "take the chair" had never been involved in a meeting (or running a meeting), so didn't understand (and why should he) the colloquialism, so took the statement at face value (he took the chair, and asked where to place it).

I think he was being asked to sit down, Hugh.

why did you think all that happened?