TiVo : 1 week in, my initial thoughts...

[caph]

Originally Posted by alexcopeland

The picture quality isn't worse when watching HD channels after recalibrating the picture via your TV remote control and I'd well recommend everyone having TiVo installed take the time to do this.

Believe me Alex, I tried to convince myself the same thing after I got my Tivo, I spent a week trying all different settings all the time telling myself, well it's not quite as bad now. Then I go round a friend's house with a budget 32" TV and an SA V+ and I see straight away how pin sharp the HD used to be when I had my SA V+. The fact is that HD is slightly blurred on the Tivo, whether this is deliberate or not I don't know, certainly some people don't seem to mind the softer HD as much. I prefer it pin sharp. It's just personal perference.

[alexcopeland]

I have a Sammy plasma and switched off the mpeg filtering and Digital noise reduction and increased the sharpness to 80. I hope this might help. I have a SA V plus box in another room so might swap them over and see what you mean. Also and most importantly ensure you TV is set to show the whole picture with no over scan. The setting you use may say screen fit or 1:1. This dramatically improved the picture quality on my plasma.

[greeninferno]

Originally Posted by caph

Believe me Alex, I tried to convince myself the same thing after I got my Tivo, I spent a week trying all different settings all the time telling myself, well it's not quite as bad now. Then I go round a friend's house with a budget 32" TV and an SA V+ and I see straight away how pin sharp the HD used to be when I had my SA V+. The fact is that HD is slightly blurred on the Tivo, whether this is deliberate or not I don't know, certainly some people don't seem to mind the softer HD as much. I prefer it pin sharp. It's just personal perference.

that is no real test for how sharp HD pictures are.

[Itshim]

My thoughts are well documented in other posts. How ever here they are again.

Good points -its smaller.
it holds more programmes.

Bad points - no reminders. No red button ( you all know what I mean I am sure)

It can cost more per month ( Ok again not for me)

Sum up I would stick with the V+ if it was the only PVR I had, and NO way would I pay more for it. Over hyped & over here to coin an old phase. Sorry but as yet it has not changed my mind. O yes the picture is FINE !!!

[HD Boy]

Originally Posted by Itshim

My thoughts are well documented in other posts. How ever here they are again.

Good points -its smaller.
it hold more programmes.

Bad points - no reminders. No red button ( you all know what I mean I am sure)

It can cost more per month ( Ok again not for me)

Sum up I would stick with the V+ if it was the only PVR I had, and NO way would I pay more for it. Over hyped & over here to coin an old phase. Sorry but as yet it has not changed my mind. O yes the picture is FINE !!!

Full red button/interactive service will be available on Tivo by end of Q1 next year (by the end of march)
http://www.cableforum.co.uk/board/35...-post5770.html


You could be waiting a while for reminders IMO. ( I do not care either way)

[stereohaven]

I don't know, you go away for a few days and all hell breaks loose...

Originally Posted by HD Boy

So in other words not got a brain.

I've let the Wife know some of you think she doesn't have a brain and she deems it the opinion of an uninformed, narrow minded idiot, and I tend to agree.

Contrary to common gadget geek opinion, the vast majority of PVR users are a long way off caring about the additional functionality the TiVo can provide because they don't need it or (understand why they would) want it.

All they are interested in are series links that work, an EPG that is accurate, recordings that are easy to access and for things to work as quickly as possible.

So it's important that the TiVo does the basics as quickly and reliably as possible because *NEWSFLASH*, most people ain't like the rest of us techno freaks!

Get the fundamentals right and users will warm to the other functions over time.

Telling people they must be stupid if they think TiVo is more complicated than what they are used to or even need is just rude and quite frankly childish.

Originally Posted by muppetman11

It's a PVR nothing more nothing less , the majority couldn't care less they just want their favourite shows recorded, something TIVO , V+ , Sky+HD and many freeview recorders do. Forums like this will always have tech fanatics like us however the vast majority of people look for simplicity.

Agree 100%.

And Virgin Media must remember that in everything they do with TiVo. Yes it can be/is the most powerful PVR on the market but that doesn't mean it's the best.

Arguably the best is the one everyone knows how to use because if you want to succeed in pay TV your PVR product needs to be simple and easy to use for the majority.

If TiVo becomes as simple as Sky+ to use yet still has all the added advanced functionality that many of us like then it could be a real winner.

Originally Posted by Digital Fanatic

It's likely you knocked the SLOW button on the remote. this toggles the Video window on/off.

Thanks for that useful information, I think that is what happened as I didn't realise the button had a dual purpose...

Originally Posted by greeninferno

How many times have people sat and said where have i seen his face? - now you can check

Not often!

I'm not being facetious, honestly, but this illustrates my point perfectly, just because that extra functionality is important to you and some others, it doesn't mean that every PVR owner is drooling over the idea.

Originally Posted by greeninferno

I couldn't believe how lmited and old fashioned it made the Sky interface look.

I agree the look is very pleasing on the eye, however the SD menus (or whatever you call them) are yuk and should be removed ASAP.

[HD Boy]

Originally Posted by stereohaven

I've let the Wife know some of you think she doesn't have a brain and she deems it the opinion of an uninformed, narrow minded idiot, and I tend to agree.

It was not the best words to use , sorry. I just think it is not complicated. It is easy use once you get used to it.

[stereohaven]

Originally Posted by HD Boy

It was not the best words to use , sorry. I just think it is not complicated. It is easy use once you get used to it.

She said "apology accepted", but she wasn't upset really (it is just an anonymous internet forum after al!), but trying to make a point that it's easy to make assumptions based on how you are coming at something and not considering that other people don't view a product in the same way.

I don't think it is complicated either, but then I like to tinker.

[muppetman11]

Originally Posted by stereohaven

She said "apology accepted", but she wasn't upset really (it is just an anonymous internet forum after al!), but trying to make a point that it's easy to make assumptions based on how you are coming at something and not considering that other people don't view a product in the same way.

I have now used V+HD , TIVO , Sky+HD and BT Vision , in my eyes the Sky+HD box is easily the most intuitive with the V+ a close second , TIVO is great and the many available features are great but if it's a simple intuitive PVR you want then in my opinion Sky+HD and V+ take some beating.

[stereohaven]

Originally Posted by muppetman11

I have now used V+HD , TIVO , Sky+HD and BT Vision , in my eyes the Sky+HD box is easily the most intuitive with the V+ a close second , TIVO is great and the many available features are great but if it's a simple intuitive PVR you want then in my opinion Sky+HD and V+ take some beating.

Couldn't agree more.

My parents have had a V+ for about 2 years now, do you know how much stuff they have recorded in that time?

Nothing, nada, zilch, zero!

They do use the Catch Up TV though so it's not like they don't get what the box can do, they just don't feel the need to use it that way.

[zekeisaszekedoes]

Originally Posted by LexDiamond

Some people find the fact that there are certain aspects of the Tivo that they cant control as making the PVR more complex.

A beautifully succinct explanation of TiVo technophobia. Good job!

Originally Posted by muppetman11

It's a PVR nothing more nothing less

Oh, I'd argue it's far more than that. I have a Humax FoxSat PVR and while it's a great unit (allows transfer of recordings too) compared to a TiVo it's nowhere near as useful or fully featured. The WishList feature alone makes TiVo a more powerful platform.

Originally Posted by greeninferno

My first reaction to Tivo was wow look how much more TV it opens up to you

Exactly. As I've mentioned already, before TiVo I couldn't watch broadcast TV at all.

I think the problem could partially lie in age and previous experience with technology. To generalise a bit, your average person in their mid-forties or older tends to have trouble moving away from the broadcast schedule TV model. Indeed, when I lent my TiVo to someone else in the house who was considering getting another on the account and fits that age range, they didn't make a single recording or use the catchup facility even after I'd provided them with the manual and given them a whistlestop tutorial of fairly rudimentary TiVo features. Not once in the whole month. They just couldn't get their head around the whole "on demand via streaming or recording" thing that TiVo does.

Originally Posted by kop32

Well this is right up there with your most useful posts,,when are you going to get the message???

Probably never. It's amusing that he is quite often guilty of the very thing he accuses other people of so bluntly.

Originally Posted by andy_m

I'd just like to place on record my thanks to the OP, and those who have posted similar reviews. TiVo falls down in my opinion on the amount of instructional information available from Virgin, which is a big reason, I think, why people consider the product so complicated. Threads like this are invaluable sources of information.

And the tragedy is most people who would find the information so useful aren't the type to browse forums, either.

Originally Posted by caph

It's the incredibly slow paging up and down in My Shows (this has got better with the update but is still painful).

Yeah, that's one I need to add to the list of improvements thread. The "SMS style alphabet entry" model you get from the search TV option should extend to My Shows. Even the USB keyboard letter do nothing, when in fact they should jump to the letter you've selected. Big oversight, that.

Originally Posted by caph

The fact is that HD is slightly blurred on the Tivo, whether this is deliberate or not I don't know, certainly some people don't seem to mind the softer HD as much. I prefer it pin sharp. It's just personal perference.

TiVo has a softer picture through the HDMI, in my opinion. I cranked the Sharpness control up to 100 (maximum) on all four of the TV display modes (they include these things so you can have a nighttime setting, a daytime setting etc) and now the TiVo is just as pin sharp as the Cisco V+ HD box was when the Sharpness was at about 50-60.

Correct TV calibration is just as important as any other factor when reviewing the image quality of a given device. I've been able to make even an old Amiga look pretty decent through the SCART socket of my Samsung LCD with tweaking of the many picture settings it offers, especially stuff like White Balance to make sure the colour gamut/temperature is closer to correct.

Originally Posted by stereohaven

I've let the Wife know some of you think she doesn't have a brain and she deems it the opinion of an uninformed, narrow minded idiot, and I tend to agree.

"...and now she complains of a headache when I'm trying to get my leg over..."

Originally Posted by stereohaven

She said "apology accepted", but she wasn't upset really (it is just an anonymous internet forum after al!), but trying to make a point that it's easy to make assumptions based on how you are coming at something and not considering that other people don't view a product in the same way.

Oh he does that often. You get used to it. It helps if you chide him a bit.

Originally Posted by stereohaven

I like to tinker.

That'll be written on my bloody tombstone, mate. So do I!

[muppetman11]

Originally Posted by zekeisaszekedoes

Oh, I'd argue it's far more than that. I have a Humax FoxSat PVR and while it's a great unit (allows transfer of recordings too) compared to a TiVo it's nowhere near as useful or fully featured

I fully agree re it's many features , I suppose it's down to the individual punter how important these are , the more tech minded will love them were some will think its overkill. On my recent use of TIVO I liked the advanced features and can see how they would be useful , guess its down to the individual.

[stereohaven]

Originally Posted by zekeisaszekedoes

"...and now she complains of a headache when I'm trying to get my leg over..."

I was only trying to get the remote and thought she was asleep...

Originally Posted by zekeisaszekedoes

That'll be written on my bloody tombstone, mate. So do I!

And of course the flipside of something so simple as Sky+ is that for us tinkerers it is too simple, we want extra functionality to play with, we need more toys.

[zekeisaszekedoes]

Originally Posted by muppetman11

I fully agree re it's many features , I suppose it's down to the individual punter how important these are , the more tech minded will love them were some will think its overkill. On my recent use of TIVO I liked the advanced features and can see how they would be useful , guess its down to the individual.

I quite agree. I almost wish there was a "basic" mode which strips the interface right down to the core features and apps, all on one page. Looking through the F11 SD menu relic from the US TiVo boxes, there is something called KidZone; maybe if that were adapted to be fitting to all age ranges, the learning curve could be reduced for the more luddite among VM's customer base.

Originally Posted by stereohaven

I was only trying to get the remote and thought she was asleep...

That's your story and you're sticking to it!

Originally Posted by stereohaven

And of course the flipside of something so simple as Sky+ is that for us tinkerers it is too simple, we want extra functionality to play with, we need more toys.

Too true. When I lent the TiVo to someone else in the house for a month to see if they liked it, what I missed the most was fiddling around with settings and features to see what I found useful. Even now, learning how to create better WishLists etc is often more fun than what those lists actually record!

[greeninferno]

Originally Posted by stereohaven

I don't know, you go away for a few days and all hell breaks loose...





Not often!

I'm not being facetious, honestly, but this illustrates my point perfectly, just because that extra functionality is important to you and some others, it doesn't mean that every PVR owner is drooling over the idea.

you don't often think i really enjoyed that film , i wonder what other films they have appeared in/directed?

I don't believe you.