Cutting pay for the Police - what next

[Jimmy-J]

Originally Posted by defirish

It doesn't bother me either if he doesn't post a link. I know other people find it annoying and they are entitled to that. I just find there's a lot more going on in the world than Artur not posting a link. I dont think he knows how to do it but to me I always find he has a very interesting things to say and says them very well and does open up topics of discussion

I agree.

[Derek]

Originally Posted by Gary L

Public sympathy might be quite thin when others are losing their jobs, having whatever money they have took off them in the way of fines issued by the police.

You don't get fines if you haven't done anything wrong. And despite what the daily mail think handing out fines to drivers is a very, very small part of a typical cops day.

Personally speaking I've handed out two fixed penalties this year. One for using a mobile phone whilst driving, one for going through a red light. Not exactly handing them out like confetti is it?

Originally Posted by papa smurf

£ 23 k for a rookie that's not a bad starting wage no wonder the country's strapped for cash -

It is fairly well paid but after the initial training you are right in at the deep end.

Originally Posted by martyh

Arthur ,it would appear that you have neglected to read past the headlines ,a pay freeze is not a pay cut

There is 'independent' report coming out next week (Tuesday I think) about Police pay and conditions. It's hardly independent if the Home Sec has already said she is going to take an axe to long-standing agreements before she has read what is suggested.

It's a given that the pension contributions, already this highest in the public sector AFAIK, will go up to 14% so a 3% cut in real terms. The public holiday pay will drop and standard overtime will go to plain time. There are even whispered rumours of overtime being done away with completely.

Maybe some think thats not too bad but like a lot of things we don't get a choice in working, if we get told to come in we do regardless of prior committments.

Remember as well we don't have the right to strike.

---------- Post added at 20:03 ---------- Previous post was at 20:01 ----------

Oh and before anyone believes the Daily Mail the story about claiming £100 for answering your phone on a day off is fantasy.

[TheDaddy]

Originally Posted by Derek

Oh and before anyone believes the Daily Mail the story about claiming £100 for answering your phone on a day off is fantasy.

More like £200 is it Derek

Pay cut = they (whoever "they" may be) reduce your pay.

Pay freeze = they (as above) don't give you any more money.

Big difference (speaking as someone who has had a pay freeze since September 2008).

[Jimmy-J]

Originally Posted by Hugh

Pay cut = they (whoever "they" may be) reduce your pay.

Pay freeze = they (as above) don't give you any more money.

Big difference (speaking as someone who has had a pay freeze since September 2008).

Yeah, my son's pay freeze happened around the same time, and they no longer recieve their yearly bonus.

[Derek]

As you might expect the Police bloggers have their own take on this.

PC Bloggs

But the generous overtime and bonuses some officers get is in direct compensation for two fundamental regulations that we adhere to:

* We can be prosecuted criminally for neglect of duty.
* We must work the days and hours we are told to, according to operational need.

Few of us who live in Britain would disagree with another fundamental principle: that people should not be forced to work without pay, and the more inconvenient/difficult/distressing the work, the more they should be compensated.

Inspector Gadget

My view is that if we cannot be made compulsorily redundant and we retain our decent pension rights, then we have little to complain about in the context of what is happening to almost everyone else.

[papa smurf]

an end to ‘grab a grand’

£5,000 police bonuses are axed: Rank-and-file fury as chief constables end payment for simply 'doing the job'

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...#ixzz1FWENLBlA

[Sparkle]

Originally Posted by Derek

Quote:
But the generous overtime and bonuses some officers get is in direct compensation for two fundamental regulations that we adhere to:

* We can be prosecuted criminally for neglect of duty.
* We must work the days and hours we are told to, according to operational need.

Few of us who live in Britain would disagree with another fundamental principle: that people should not be forced to work without pay, and the more inconvenient/difficult/distressing the work, the more they should be compensated.

As a salaried worker, I don't get paid a penny extra no matter how much overtime I work. If I have to work an extra 10 hours to get the job done, then so be it. No fancy bonus for me either.
I don't really see the big deal with the pay freeze, its the same all over - last year I had to take a week furlow as did near everyone else where I work.
As Mr Cameron said "We're all in this together.", about time the police join in and I don't think they should be exempt just because they start kicking and squealing.
Our lads in Afghanistan are on a fraction of the pay and benefits bequeathed to the guys and gals in blue, and with a far greater risk of being maimed or killed. I think the police should just be grateful they still have their jobs, unlike so many others during these difficult times.

If you routinely end up spending vastly more hours at the office than you are contracted to, then your employer is taking the mick frankly. As soon as the job market improves, go and find a job with a company with a slightly more enlightened view of employee welfare.

[Sparkle]

Originally Posted by Chris

If you routinely end up spending vastly more hours at the office than you are contracted to, then your employer is taking the mick frankly. As soon as the job market improves, go and find a job with a company with a slightly more enlightened view of employee welfare.

Its not routine per se, but I don't work simply for money - I work mostly for the satisfaction in knowing I've contributed to making the world a better place. I'm not badly paid either and I'm well looked after, it's just that I don't get paid for overtime.

That's not uncommon for office work though. Your contract will state that you have a basic working week (probably 35 or 37.5 hours) and that occasional overtime is required. However it will also state that your salary is calculated on the assumption you will do overtime and that it contains an allowance for this already.

Just because you have an arrangement like this, doesn't mean that people who do not (i.e. people such as police, in this case), shouldn't get overtime when it's earned. A contract is a contract.

I guess the problem is, you probably weren't working there at the time they switched away from calculated overtime. If you had been, you would have seen the jump in your salary. I know plenty of people this has happened to (most of them quite a bit older than us, to be fair) and at the time they thought it was a good deal.

Personally, while I enjoy my work, it's not the main focus of my life. It serves me because it puts a roof over my family's head and food on the table. I do what I do well, and thoroughly, but I expect to get paid for it.

[Gary L]

Originally Posted by Derek

You don't get fines if you haven't done anything wrong. And despite what the daily mail think handing out fines to drivers is a very, very small part of a typical cops day.

I must have missed that part where they said that.

Personally speaking I've handed out two fixed penalties this year. One for using a mobile phone whilst driving, one for going through a red light. Not exactly handing them out like confetti is it?

Good job you're not on performance pay, then

[Derek]

Originally Posted by Sparkle

As a salaried worker, I don't get paid a penny extra no matter how much overtime I work. If I have to work an extra 10 hours to get the job done, then so be it.

If you decide the job isn't worth it and go home could you get jailed?

If your boss decides you need to come in and work on a day with no notice regardless of previous plans do you need to comply with his demands?

[Jimmy-J]

28,000 police job losses

Acpo predicts the jobs of 12,000 police officers and 16,000 civilian staff will be lost as a result of spending cuts.
Meanwhile, the Winsor review of police pay and conditions to be unveiled on Tuesday is expected to recommend cutting £180m in annual bonuses.
Greater Manchester Chief Constable Peter Fahy confirmed the job loss forecast - representing a reduction of about 12% of posts - to the Guardian.
He said: "We will have fewer staff, the same or more demands, and will need to incentivise staff to produce higher quality."

[Pierre]

Originally Posted by Derek

It is fairly well paid but after the initial training you are right in at the deep end.

I think from Sergeant upwards it's well paid. Factor in the pension, and the ability to retire early on a full pension and it's very, very good.

So you have to pay your dues when you start out, same in many trades/ jobs.

It's a given that the pension contributions, already this highest in the public sector AFAIK, will go up to 14% so a 3% cut in real terms. The public holiday pay will drop and standard overtime will go to plain time. There are even whispered rumours of overtime being done away with completely.

you contribute 14%, how much do we contribute?

Remember as well we don't have the right to strike

You also can't be made redundant. In this current climate that kind of job security is priceless.

When they talk about job losses, they mean not replacing officers that leave, not making them redundant.

Forget about overtime rates and having to work when asked. If someone said to me here's a job for life, until you retire (early if you want, depending when you joined obviously) on a decent pension (so you could even get a nice little part time job in your 50's and see out your years in comfort) - that would be very nice thank you.

Don't get me wrong I don't begrudge any of it. Tough job, needs its fringe benefits, not for me otherwise I'd of considered it.

But Police that complain about their T&Cs don't get any time from me.