The Pope Thread [UK visit 2010 - merged] - Page 7

Kymmy · 16-09-2010, 15:11

I think Stephen Fry has some sensible words

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-11316476

**Chris** · 16-09-2010, 15:29

I don't think he does - as with many of this country's highly intelligent and articulate atheists, when asked to comment on religious issues he can't help but dissolve into spluttering disapproval.

He, of all people, I should have expected to be able to articulate why he thinks the Pope shouldn't have had a State reception today. Unfortunately when it came to the crunch his argument boiled down to 'he shouldn't get one because it's self evident that the Vatican isn't a State'. Sadly for him and those who think like him, international law doesn't hold that assertion to be self evident.

And I'd be very careful about decrying something due to its status being an 'accident of history' - most of the British constitution is an accident of history, yet I don't hear Stephen Fry demanding a revolution.

danielf · 16-09-2010, 16:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris

I don't think he does - as with many of this country's highly intelligent and articulate atheists, when asked to comment on religious issues he can't help but dissolve into spluttering disapproval.

He, of all people, I should have expected to be able to articulate why he thinks the Pope shouldn't have had a State reception today. Unfortunately when it came to the crunch his argument boiled down to 'he shouldn't get one because it's self evident that the Vatican isn't a State'. Sadly for him and those who think like him, international law doesn't hold that assertion to be self evident.

And I'd be very careful about decrying something due to its status being an 'accident of history' - most of the British constitution is an accident of history, yet I don't hear Stephen Fry demanding a revolution.

While that's a fair point, I thought the observation that if the Vatican is a state, it is best described as an Autocratic Monarchy an interesting one. Should we see the pope's invitation as a head of state as UK endorsement of Autocratic Monarchy* as a form of Government?

*An autocratic monarchy that is seen by many as failing to act on widespread child abuse in its ranks at that.

Mr Angry · 16-09-2010, 16:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by danielf

Should we see the pope's invitation as a head of state as UK endorsement of Autocratic Monarchy* as a form of Government?

*An autocratic monarchy that is seen by many as failing to act on widespread child abuse in its ranks at that.

If that is the case and the context in which he was invited then, apparently, yes you should.

**Damien** · 16-09-2010, 17:07

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-11332515

Quote:

The Pope has compared "atheist extremism" to the Nazi tyranny of WWII in a speech given in Edinburgh as he begins a four-day visit to the UK.

Not sure if this was a fair interpretation of what he actually said, at first glance it appears quite a moronic thing to say but then what does he mean by 'extremism'?

Mr Angry · 16-09-2010, 17:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-11332515

Not sure if this was a fair interpretation of what he actually said, at first glance it appears quite a moronic thing to say but then what does he mean by 'extremism'?

By "extremism" he most probably means "them" or, alternatively, anyone, anything and any body which doesn't subscribe or conform to his partcular mindset at any given time.

papa smurf · 16-09-2010, 17:55

as an atheist i have no interest in the twisted views of this sad old git. reality will catch him up eventually .

Mr Angry · 16-09-2010, 18:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by papa smurf

.... i have no interest in the twisted views of this sad old git.

The feeling is mutual, apparently.

papa smurf · 16-09-2010, 18:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Angry

The feeling is mutual, apparently.

Pierre · 16-09-2010, 18:09

As an "athiest"...........I'm not sure if I am, I don't believe in a god, or any gods but I'm not against religion, if that's what people want to believe.

Anyway, I don't believe in god but you can't get away from the fact that this country is a christian country. It's not very often the leader of the christian church comes here and I have no objection to the pomp and ceremony afforded to him if it makes the very large population of UK christians happy.

Sirius · 16-09-2010, 18:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by papa smurf

as an atheist i have no interest in the twisted views of this sad old git. reality will catch him up eventually .

Agreed. However when he starts broadcasting that bull plop at his public meetings then i start to see my bottom over him.

Quote:

The Pope has ignited a row by associating atheism with Nazism in the first speech of his UK visit.

If he wants to associate atheists with Nazi's then i have no problem associating Christians with pedophiles, Two can play at that game.

Quote:

"The notion that it was the atheism of Nazis that led to their extremist and hateful views or that it somehow fuels intolerance in Britain today is a terrible libel against those who do not believe in God.

"The notion that it is non-religious people in the UK today who want to force their views on others, coming from a man whose organisation exerts itself internationally to impose its narrow and exclusive form of morality and undermine the human rights of women, children, gay people and many others, is surreal."

The Pope's speech follows controversial comments by one of his top aides in an interview with German magazine Focus.

Cardinal Walter Kasper, 77, spoke about the Godlessness of a section of English society, claiming Britain was facing an "aggressive new atheism" and "Christians were at a disadvantage".

Why has he started spouting all this bull plop anyway. Is it that he must upset as many people as he can whilst he is here part of his objective.

papa smurf · 16-09-2010, 18:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sirius

Agreed. However when he starts broadcasting that bull plop at his public meetings then i start to see my bottom over him.

If he wants to associate atheists with Nazi's then i have no problem associating Christians with pedophiles, Two can play at that game.

Why has he started spouting all this bull plop anyway. Is it that he must upset as many people as he can whilst he is here part of his objective.

its a distraction ploy -now all the kafiks are pointing at the evil nazi atheist baby eaters

Sirius · 16-09-2010, 18:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by papa smurf

its a distraction ploy -now all the kafiks are pointing at the evil nazi atheist baby eaters

I have a perfect reply to that but it would get me banned

Mr Angry · 16-09-2010, 18:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sirius

If he wants to associate atheists with Nazi's then i have no problem associating Christians with p(a)edophiles, Two can play at that game.

And in doing so you not only cause equally ill informed affrontery but you also do yourself a disservice.

Sirius · 16-09-2010, 18:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Angry

And in doing so you not only cause equally ill informed effrontery but you also do yourself a disservice.

Well he just wound me up

If i want to be a atheist that is my decision, However i don't expect the leader of the catholic church to assume that because i am an atheist i must therefor be associated with Nazi-ism

.