50MB - 10MB Upload ? - Page 2

Placemat · 03-08-2010, 07:56

I'd be happy with 2mb Upload on my XL service, but then I don't really use my upload at all.

Out of interest, how do BT get away with offering up to 10Mb on their FTTC service?

Chrysalis · 03-08-2010, 09:00

placemat its different technologies.

cable technology has smaller upload capacity at the UBR.

I am amazed at the demand for upload speeds admittedly, personally the only uploading I do on a regular basis is emails, and more recently remote desktop.

a lot of torrent users? people running servers? or just feel its nice to have for things like uploading pictures and videos?

Kymmy · 03-08-2010, 09:04

Running servers here..Hence my 700K UP with 10Mb down isn't exactly ideal... But the best I can get round here

jb66 · 03-08-2010, 09:28

Torrents for me

kwikbreaks · 03-08-2010, 13:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chrysalis

a lot of torrent users?

Ah you mean candidates for setting case law when the new Digital Economy Act starts getting enforced - yes that would be my guess.

callanish · 04-08-2010, 21:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chrysalis

a lot of torrent users? people running servers? or just feel its nice to have for things like uploading pictures and videos?

or for those streaming remotely using a slingbox trying to improve picture quality with a better upload speed.

kwikbreaks · 05-08-2010, 06:47

Now that is a perfectly legitimate need - as would be homeworking, speedy offsite backups, website maintenance, and scores of other things but I still have this deep down conviction that the first suggestion would account for most of the popularity.

virginruinedntl · 05-08-2010, 11:35

Skype HD requires i believe 1.3mb upload in order to get their highest video quality. 20mb users get 0.75mb upload at the moment. Also alot of people upload videos to youtube and photos to facebook, tinypic etc. HD camcorders and cameras make the files bigger and bigger so we need a fast upload speed otherwise it takes forever, took 2.5hrs ish to upload a 740mb .m2ts camcorder file to youtube, not many people have the patience to do that. I'd be happy with 3mb upload on my 20mb connection, would be 4x faster than what it is now.

Chrysalis · 05-08-2010, 12:07

I am not after torrent users

but more of an idea of the demand, it would seem VM have under estimated upload demand on their capacity planning.

I would like to see upload capacity tripled when new products released and then doubled after that to correct the under provisioning. so 6 fold increase.

virginruinedntl · 05-08-2010, 12:56

they have ignored upload speed for years, in america alot of isps and 4mb down and 3mb up and have been like this for years yet we are on 20/0.75. VM are losing customers over this, o2/be have 1.3mb upload and 2.5mb upload tiers i believe and have had these for years, its a shame its taken virgin so many years to catchup. Lets hope we don't have to wait too long.

broadbandking · 05-08-2010, 18:49

The main problem is VM ingored the DOCSIS 2.0 platform, if they had moved to DOCSIS 2.0 the upstreams would have been upgraded to compily with the standard, DOCSIS 3.0 has not give them the option to use bonded channels (which should be for future upgrades) afaik VM are using different frequencies to enable the upload speed upgrade.

@ Chrysalis, VM will not underesitmate the requipments, they have been doing trials for months to understand the load, due to VM using real customers they have a good idea of the demand, so the upgrades should be fine when done, VM will stagger the uplift to ensure demand is met.

Chrysalis · 06-08-2010, 06:52

bbk ignition said the same but didnt they do trials in the past as well and under estimated demand then?

eg. I read on tbb the 100mbit trials are 1.75meg up not 10meg up. Do trials emulate same user load as heavy areas? or do they have segmented bandwidth for small trial customer count such as only 100 users in ashford,kent.

If the plan is to simply upgrade a single upstream on overlay to a 18mbit channel and to relieve legacy by moving some more users of it to overlay then VM have underestimated by a long shot.

What is your estimation on upgrades needed in an area where only 1mbit is possible on a 10mbit product and only 200kbit upload on 512kbit upload product, to the new upgraded speeds to run without congestion?

|Kippa| · 06-08-2010, 09:29

Is there enough bandwidth for ack packets only using 1.75meg up for 100mbit? Correct me if I am wrong but doesn't the 1.5meg up for the 50mbit get saturated when downloading at the full 50mbit. If so, wouldn't the minimum upload rate for 100mbit be between 2.5meg and 3meg at the least and not 1.75meg?

Ignitionnet · 06-08-2010, 10:20

The standard upgrade for 100Mbit and 10:1 ratio is 2 resegmentations and a doubling of channel width on overlay network, increasing upstream bandwidth by a factor of 8 and quadrupling downstream.

There is no requirement to ack every single packet, I'm not sure where this comes from. TCP does, by default, do cumulative acknowledgement - an ack implicitly acknowledges every transmitted packet up until the sequence number the acknowledgement is supplied for.

The exception to this is misconfigured TCP stacks.

If one is acknowledging every single packet 100Mbit requires 3.6Mbit of upstream as a bare minimum, which would, yes, mean that 1.75Mbit is not enough for the 53Mbit downstream on the 50M.

HTH.

virginruinedntl · 06-08-2010, 12:58

I wonder how BT's infinity will change virgin's upload speeds. Upto 40mb down and 10mb up for FTTC enabled exchanges and cabinets over copper, the upload would be way better than virgin's. I bet Virgin are hoping BT upgrades very slowly. Sky and BT will be using FTTC, i wonder if Virgin will be for houses that aren't cabled (which is alot). Maybe they could make their Tv boxes work with it somehow, they'd probably have to give users different modems i would have thought. BT's tv is rubbish so virgin could gain quite alot of customers by doing this.