[Update] BNP on Question Time this week

Originally Posted by nomadking

Perhaps the panel could be asked about this story of 5(so far) racist attacks.

As I am sure they will be, if racist attacks are discussed.

Or are you raising the oft-repeated "Straw Man" argument that only attacks by Indigenous Britons on ethnic minorities are reported/treated as racist attacks? (which seems to be contradicted by your BBC link, in which it is stated)

Scotland Yard confirmed that the assault was being treated as ' racially motivated'

One thing people are missing is what the BNP say and what they do are very different things. It's very irritating when I hear people take the BNP's catchphrases to heart and then claim it shows they are not that bad. Suddenly people who claim not to believe anything politicians say are suddenly eager to take the BNP for their word, despite all the evidence of things they do/say behind the scenes.

Nick Griffin won't say anything racist, he will make straw man arguments and say things to which no one would disagree. Someone who question him on the racist aspect and he will say something like "We just want British people to have priority on national services, and people claim it's racist. They are just being Politically Correct". Cue lots of cheering by the morons who follow him and his goons as they cite it as evidence of the BNP not being racists. They will choose to remain ignorant of the racist aspects of the BNP (white's only, deportation of those who are not white and British) because although that's what they desire they do not want to admit to others. Cowards.

[SMG]

Originally Posted by Damien

One thing people are missing is what the BNP say and what they do are very different things. It's very irritating when I hear people take the BNP's catchphrases to heart and then claim it shows they are not that bad. Suddenly people who claim not to believe anything politicians say are suddenly eager to take the BNP for their word, despite all the evidence of things they do/say behind the scenes.

Nick Griffin won't say anything racist, he will make straw man arguments and say things to which no one would disagree. Someone who question him on the racist aspect and he will say something like "We just want British people to have priority on national services, and people claim it's racist. They are just being Politically Correct". Cue lots of cheering by the morons who follow him and his goons. Cowards.

So, not much different than the 3 main political parties & their leaders then!

[Tezcatlipoca]

...But at least Lib/Lab/Con don't restrict membership to whites only, or want to "repatriate" non-white British Citizens to their "countries of ethnic origin", etc...

I don't think having restricted membership is a problem really ,after all there are plenty of blacks only ,women only ,men only ,asian only ect .that's not the problem ,the real problem imo is because the mainstream parties i.e con ,lab,lib havn't addressed the imigration problem then groups like the BNP are allowed a platform to promote their racist propoganda simply because as far as joe blogs is concerened no one else will sort it out

Originally Posted by Sirius

This will only increase my dislike of the BBC.

iplayer was starting to make me think the licence fee was worth the money, then they go and do this.


http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/8240206.stm

Why should they be excluded from any debate? They have won 2 seats in the European Elections. It's only the Liberals of this country who are kicking off. The BNP are hear to stay so get used to it.

Originally Posted by martyh

I don't think having restricted membership is a problem really ,after all there are plenty of blacks only ,women only ,men only ,asian only ect .that's not the problem ,the real problem imo is because the mainstream parties i.e con ,lab,lib havn't addressed the imigration problem then groups like the BNP are allowed a platform to promote their racist propoganda simply because as far as joe blogs is concerened no one else will sort it out

If you mean addressing the problem along the lines of racial bigotry then no the major political parties haven't addressed the issue if that's the criteria you judge on.However I think they have done their best to keep a balance provided you DON'T rely on the appalling journalistic attempts of The Sun and the Mail to imply that they have failed as EVIDENCE of anything.

[Ignitionnet]

Don't see a problem with this at all. We're all old enough, ugly enough and stupid enough to make our own minds up and the more information we are given in order to make us more informed to make these decisions the better.

A huge fear of the BNP being on QT strikes me as a fear of liking some things they may say, which is I'm afraid inevitable. It's very hard to disagree with 100% of what a party may say, even PM Mandelson's party says the odd thing that makes some kind of sense.

[Horace]

If we don't allow even 'extreme' political parties freedom of expression and democracy we can't criticise other countries who deny those rights to groups we support.

Originally Posted by Horace

If we don't allow even 'extreme' political parties freedom of expression and democracy we can't criticise other countries who deny those rights to groups we support.

I don't see anyone here claiming we should ban the BNP, just questioning if the BBC should invite what is essentially a group that festers hate and racism onto Question Time.

They do have their freedom of expression and democracy hence their right to have meetings, stand in elections, have a website and so on.

However, Freedom of expression and democracy does not entitle people to a platform.

[nomadking]

That's just it, 'extreme' political parties are allowed freedom of expression, but only selected ones. The real fascists are the ones that make that selection and impose it, often using violence or non-violent sanctions that seriously affect peoples lives and jobs.

---------- Post added at 11:28 ---------- Previous post was at 11:15 ----------

Originally Posted by Damien

I don't see anyone here claiming we should ban the BNP, just questioning if the BBC should invite what is essentially a group that festers hate and racism onto Question Time.

They do have their freedom of expression and democracy hence their right to have meetings, stand in elections, have a website and so on.

However, Freedom of expression and democracy does not entitle people to a platform.

So who is it gets to choose those who is and who isn't allowed a platform?

The reason Labour loses votes to the BNP in certain areas, is that the traditional Labour voters see people who will only truly support their own race, selected as Labour candidates that are supported by racists who will only vote for that person based on their race, and see no choice but to vote BNP to take action against the racists in the Labour party.

[Russ]

Originally Posted by nomadking

The reason Labour loses votes to the BNP in certain areas, is that the traditional Labour voters see people who will only truly support their own race, selected as Labour candidates that are supported by racists who will only vote for that person based on their race, and see no choice but to vote BNP to take action against the racists in the Labour party.

Surely the main reason they lose out to the BNP is the media whip up a story which doesn't actualy exist (ie 'winterval'), people then believe it without question then blame the government for allowing it to happen.

Originally Posted by Russ B

Surely the main reason they lose out to the BNP is the media whip up a story which doesn't actualy exist (ie 'winterval'), people then believe it without question then blame the government for allowing it to happen.

It was actually the Daily Mail who invented Winterval. The BNP do invent crimes (Richard Barnbrook made up murders committed by Asians) or accuse minorities of committing crimes for which white people were eventually arrested.

I agree with your point though, The BNP fabricate stories for political gain.

---------- Post added at 12:55 ---------- Previous post was at 12:51 ----------

Originally Posted by nomadking

So who is it gets to choose those who is and who isn't allowed a platform?

Who ever owns the platform

The reason Labour loses votes to the BNP in certain areas, is that the traditional Labour voters see people who will only truly support their own race, selected as Labour candidates that are supported by racists who will only vote for that person based on their race, and see no choice but to vote BNP to take action against the racists in the Labour party.

Yes, People vote BNP to stop racism. That's why they vote for a party that wants an all-white UK. The BNP are clear racists, people who support these policies should admit it and stop pretending it's not racist.

[Pierre]

I agree with your point though, The BNP fabricate stories for political gain.

Name me one Political party that doesn't?????????????

Who ever owns the platform

The BBC is a public service broacaster, a broadcaster that is supoosed to be free of the populist agenda. The BNP is a British political party and have as much right as other minority parties (plaid cymru, UKIP, Respect) and indeed independants that have graced question time.

Yes, People vote BNP to stop racism. That's why they vote for a party that wants an all-white UK. The BNP are clear racists, people who support these policies should admit it and stop pretending it's not racist.

BNP are indeed a facist, right wing party. but to suggest that all who vote for them are racists is missing the point completely.

The rise in support for the BNP, is down to failure of the main parties to represent those people in these areas competently.

Originally Posted by Pierre

Name me one Political party that doesn't?????????????

I do not believe Labour makes up stories about murders. I haven't seen the Tories start claiming minorities were guilty for crimes that were not committed by them (or not committed at all). The Lib Dems have not made up stories about gangs of Asian rapists either.

The BNP consistently does stuff like this.

The BBC is a public service broacaster, a broadcaster that is supoosed to be free of the populist agenda. The BNP is a British political party and have as much right as other minority parties (plaid cymru, UKIP, Respect) and indeed independants that have graced question time.

And they are getting it. I was simply commenting that free speech does not entire you to a platform from which to speak. Incidentally the only reason the BNP are in is because of their MEP's. Other minority political groups on Question Time have previously achieved more success than the BNP.

BNP are indeed a facist, right wing party. but to suggest that all who vote for them are racists is missing the point completely.

The rise in support for the BNP, is down to failure of the main parties to represent those people in these areas competently.

Read what I said:

Yes, People vote BNP to stop racism. That's why they vote for a party that wants an all-white UK. The BNP are clear racists, people who support these policies should admit it and stop pretending it's not racist.

Anyone who supports an All-White Britain is a racist.