Mansfield teacher arrested over All Saints pupil assault

Originally Posted by Russ B

so all society's problems started with the removal of the cane as punishment in schools? If not what else should we be blaming?

Society?Parents?Police?Teachers?This Government?The last Government?Christians?Muslims?Immigrants?The PC do gooders,liberal,whishy washy brigade?The Media?The EU?

Take yer pick?

[alferret]

Originally Posted by dgardner

SNIP!
How do you know he was goading the the teacher etc?

If you had read my earlier posts you would know where I got my information from.

Corporal punishment should be brought back into all secondary schools. When I was a school we had to endure a ruler across the knuckles, slipper across the arse (think my head of year had this as a fetish it was his favourite form of punishment and I was on the receiving end far to often) and the cane, dependant on severity of the alleged infraction it was either across the palm or the backside.
Parents should understand that kids only get this sort of punishment if something warrants it, its ok saying "you touch my kid then you got me to deal with" but what does that show the kid? All it shows is the parent isnt in control of themselves and its ok to retaliate against someone being chastised.
Regardless of the discussions that are going on the teacher was wrong to do what he done, the kid was wrong for also doing what he done and two wrongs dont make a right, everything will come out in the wash.

I got caught skipping school by the teacher one day, he sent a letter out to my mum and dad, my dad went up to school to see the head of year, I was called into the office and my dad said to the teacher what sort of punishment are you going to give him? The teacher said I'm going to cane him. My dad said that's fine but I want to watch you cane him? The teacher looked shocked and said OK, I got 3 right across the backside. My dad said that's not hard enough, he took the cane off the teacher and gave me 3 more across the backside, the teacher stood there with a smug grin across his face, you could see the look of a result in his smile. I never skipped school again. After that for some strange reason I buckled down in school and got some good exam results.

When I left school and got a job I used to visit this teacher while he was in school teaching lessons, he never let me forget that day when my dad caned me in front of him, the above teacher was strict but fair, if he ever went past you in school and you had your top button undone he used to grab you by the tie and pull it up till you went blue in the face. This is the sort of teaching we need now along with the cane.

[Russ]

Originally Posted by Nidge

if he ever went past you in school and you had your top button undone he used to grab you by the tie and pull it up till you went blue in the face. This is the sort of teaching we need now along with the cane.

You call that 'fair'? Sounds more like bullying to me.

[soicky]

Originally Posted by Russ B

You call that 'fair'? Sounds more like bullying to me.

---------- Post added at 16:00 ---------- Previous post was at 15:59 ----------

Originally Posted by Nidge

I got caught skipping school by the teacher one day, he sent a letter out to my mum and dad, my dad went up to school to see the head of year, I was called into the office and my dad said to the teacher what sort of punishment are you going to give him? The teacher said I'm going to cane him. My dad said that's fine but I want to watch you cane him? The teacher looked shocked and said OK, I got 3 right across the backside. My dad said that's not hard enough, he took the cane off the teacher and gave me 3 more across the backside, the teacher stood there with a smug grin across his face, you could see the look of a result in his smile. I never skipped school again. After that for some strange reason I buckled down in school and got some good exam results.

When I left school and got a job I used to visit this teacher while he was in school teaching lessons, he never let me forget that day when my dad caned me in front of him, the above teacher was strict but fair, if he ever went past you in school and you had your top button undone he used to grab you by the tie and pull it up till you went blue in the face. This is the sort of teaching we need now along with the cane.

Society has changed, caning will never be brought back.

Originally Posted by Russ B

You call that 'fair'? Sounds more like bullying to me.

With quotes like that is there any wonder this contry is going down the pan?

---------- Post added at 17:07 ---------- Previous post was at 17:04 ----------

Originally Posted by soicky

---------- Post added at 16:00 ---------- Previous post was at 15:59 ----------



Society has changed, caning will never be brought back.

If that day never comes people like you who are against the cane and any form of corporal punishment will have to live with the fact that this country is in the gutter when it comes to children. You know it's getting bad when your local MacDoanlds now employs bouncers to keep the kids out.

[Russ]

Originally Posted by Nidge

With quotes like that is there any wonder this contry is going down the pan?

If an older or bigger pupil did that as 'punishment' to another student it would be bullying. So why is it not the same when a teacher does it when other methods are available? I mean come on, almost choking a child because his top button wasn't done up?

Originally Posted by Nidge

You know it's getting bad when your local MacDoanlds now employs bouncers to keep the kids out.

And that's due to the cane being removed from schools is it?

Originally Posted by Russ B

And that's due to the cane being removed from schools is it?

Yes it spreads out of school onto the streets.

[lucy7]

National service, lets fetch that back!

For the girls too.

[rogerdraig]

Originally Posted by Nidge

With quotes like that is there any wonder this contry is going down the pan?

---------- Post added at 17:07 ---------- Previous post was at 17:04 ----------




If that day never comes people like you who are against the cane and any form of corporal punishment will have to live with the fact that this country is in the gutter when it comes to children. You know it's getting bad when your local MacDoanlds now employs bouncers to keep the kids out.

i am not against parents using it to discipline their own children and would support their right too

but i will never support its use in school it is so open to abuse and would be abused no matter what rules were put in place for its use

schools should use their right to expel pupils but often they don't go down that route because they loose money by doing so

they often instead just exclude them often illegally and with out getting the other agencies involved that would help

so you end up with kids getting no help no schooling and just getting more uncontrollable

see

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/wales/7024005.stm

the parents in this case were given practical no help because the school decided not to record most of his absences

http://www.teachingexpertise.com/art...explained-1555

this points out that unofficial exclusions are illegal

its all very well saying its parents fault ( though it can be ) when the schools don't follow the rules properly and don't trigger the help out there for them and the parents

[lucy7]

The use of a cane Roger is open to abuse in the home as well.
I was a victim of that.

Originally Posted by lucy7

National service, lets fetch that back!

For the girls too.

They still have it in Turkey and in Greece, their Children are polite and well behaved.

Next door to me I have 3 Polish children who's manners are impeccable, every time I see them they say good morning and good afternoon, they do the same with my missus good morning and good afternoon. They go to a school a few doors away from my house infact the same school as my partners young son, I asked my partners son if the children were OK in school? He said everyone like to play with them. If only our kids were like them.

[rogerdraig]

Originally Posted by lucy7

The use of a cane Roger is open to abuse in the home as well.
I was a victim of that.

yep it can be but that has always been something you can get arrested for ( though admittedly the police were very reluctant to do so but any punishment that could be seen as abh was always prosecutable

but taking it away as a means of control from parents is not the way

( lol defending the other side for a bit )

i blame the NSPCC for their FULL STOP campaign and the ever present social workers for demonising this

there is no comparison between some father belting seven bells out of a child with his belt or fists which should lead them to prison and a smack on the bottom with the hand to enforce a message to a young child

but even with that support i see no help with smacking a child once its old enough to reason with as it shouldn't really be being used as a punishment it should be being used to teach

as in i will and have smacked a child's hand for going near a fire though some social workers would say not to but the child learned with 2 smacks not to touch it much quicker than if i had tried to explain it to this by talking to them at two years old

i have seen mother at nursery crying because they had smacked their child for similar reasons because they think social will take their kids if they find out

this is where it is going wrong schools dont ever need the cane but parents need to be shown how to use discipline correctly and fairly with children before they are 5

equally when parents abuse that right they should be dealt with with the full force of the law but at the moment they know not what they can do

It all boils down to the sink estate culture and lack of cane within the school system.

[lucy7]

I get what you are saying Roger.

I can clearly remeber mine saying to me "you cant touch me or I will ring Esther!"

They still did get a smack from time to time though, never a cane or slipper, just my hand.
I only hit them in control of myself though, and only when the talking avenue had not worked. Smacking in my house was a rare occassion.
I am not proud that I smacked them, and if I had to parent again, I do feel I would do it the same way though.

My husband, the childrens Dad hit my son once when he accidently stood on my dog and the dog yelped, he lashed into him big style, left several marks on him and hand prints that took over a week to go.
That was out of control smacking and not even disipline.
I was horrified and it was the nail in the coffin on the marriage after that.

I have just shown my lad this before I post it, and he has just followed the thread.
He says he agrees with me that the fear of punishment would probaly curb bad behavior in schools, but not stop it.