Laptop as a server.

[funkyCable]

I've been using a Dell Latitude X300 for work which has been upgraded but I was really impressed how silent it was. I left it on 24/7 and had no problems

I was originally looking at getton x300 or a dell latitude d410 on ebay and then I thought if I'm going to pay that much for a 2nd would it not be better to buy a new netbook to do the same thing. Plus I would get a guarentee/warranty.

ROB - Would I not be able to take it back to the store if it did get hot or break. I think I'll go this weekend and see what these netbooks/laptops look like and if they would be able to cope.

[KingDaveRa]

Originally Posted by AbyssUnderground

People who are saying "You can't run a laptop 24/7 its not designed for it" or "laptop as a server, it will die", have you ever actually tried it?

Nope.

But I know of two cases where they did. And they died.

1. A laptop was being used by a fairly major OEM (who since went bust - says a lot) as their web server. The reasoning being it had a battery - that's like a UPS, right! Anyway, it died, and took their website down. Duhh.

2. At work, we have a bunch of plasma screens in reception showing all sorts of random stuff. Somebody decided to run one on a laptop sat on a shelf. It overheated horribly, and fried the motherboard. Binned the whole thing as I recall.

So those are two cases I can name, and I'm aware of other cases.

Laptops are not designed to run 24/7. They get far too hot. Besides, running them on the mains all the time isn't clever, as it kills the battery. Some will run without the battery, but that doesn't solve the heat problem you'll get anyway.

[AbyssUnderground]

Originally Posted by KingDaveRa

Nope.

But I know of two cases where they did. And they died.

1. A laptop was being used by a fairly major OEM (who since went bust - says a lot) as their web server. The reasoning being it had a battery - that's like a UPS, right! Anyway, it died, and took their website down. Duhh.

2. At work, we have a bunch of plasma screens in reception showing all sorts of random stuff. Somebody decided to run one on a laptop sat on a shelf. It overheated horribly, and fried the motherboard. Binned the whole thing as I recall.

So those are two cases I can name, and I'm aware of other cases.

Laptops are not designed to run 24/7. They get far too hot. Besides, running them on the mains all the time isn't clever, as it kills the battery. Some will run without the battery, but that doesn't solve the heat problem you'll get anyway.

1. Thats a general failure, it happens and can be repaired.

2. I bet that shelf didn't have great air circulation. If you're that worried about it you can buy a USB powered fan pad to put the laptop on which will cool it sufficiently enough. They're fairly cheap as well.

You make a good point about the battery. You should run it down once a week to at least 40% to keep it in tip top shape, or remove it completely (but then you have no UPS capability).

[Stuart]

Originally Posted by KingDaveRa

Nope.

But I know of two cases where they did. And they died.

1. A laptop was being used by a fairly major OEM (who since went bust - says a lot) as their web server. The reasoning being it had a battery - that's like a UPS, right! Anyway, it died, and took their website down. Duhh.

The theory is sound. However, in practice it's a terrible idea. Laptops don't make a noise when switching to batter. In my experience, UPS's make an awful racket if the power dies (the alarm on ours at work is extremely, even painfully, loud). No way on earth a passing person wouldn't notice a problem. UPSs can also signal the server if the power dies, so it can contact relevant personell and shut itself down safely. OK, a laptop can do that with custom software, but a UPS can also power the hardware required to send a message (such as network hardware or modem). Admittedly, A Laptop may have a modem built in.

2. At work, we have a bunch of plasma screens in reception showing all sorts of random stuff. Somebody decided to run one on a laptop sat on a shelf. It overheated horribly, and fried the motherboard. Binned the whole thing as I recall.

I find it staggering that companies are willing to spend thousands fitting flash plasmas and lcds to their reception areas, but are not happy to spend an extra £200 or £300 on a small PC to run it. OK, so it's worth remembering that "shuttle" style micro PCs are not really designed to run 24/7 either, but there is no reason a mini PC couldn't.

Going back to the OP's point, I'd recommend a mini PC, or if expenses run to it, a Mac Mini. Mac Minis run exceptionally cool, even under a heavy load, and are quiet even at full load.

[ZrByte]

Originally Posted by KingDaveRa

Nope.


Laptops are not designed to run 24/7. They get far too hot. Besides, running them on the mains all the time isn't clever, as it kills the battery. Some will run without the battery, but that doesn't solve the heat problem you'll get anyway.

Just thought I would challenge your closing comment there. Poorly designed or even old laptops may not be designed for it but that doesn't hold true right across the range. My current laptop, Dell studio 1735 is more than up to the task it barely gets warm gaming. The laptop before that was an inspiron 1525 and though that one did get considerably warmer gaming it stayed nice and cool for every other use as long as it wasn't taxing the cpu 100% 24/7.

To the OP, I really wouldn't go for a shuttle or a netbook as a server. I would really go for something like the Dell GX240 sff or the D510 usdt I recommended earlier, they are much better suited to the task you have in mind, Or like someone else mentioned even a mini-itx would do it. And any of them could be bought for a fraction of the cost of a netbook or a shuttle.

[KingDaveRa]

I think the major win point with the Mini-ITX systems is that they are designed, and indeed, can be run, totally passively cooled. I.e. silent. It's easy to get pretty silent drives now (even 2.5" drives - you can get drives designed to run 24/7 now - HP's servers come with them now) so you can have something pretty powerful, small, and quiet.

You can make a PC mostly passively cooled - my media centre has a huge chunk of copper in it with no fans, and just a single case fan. That runs perfectly fine. I even fashioned a cowling of a sort out of some plastic to drag air right through the CPU heatsink so it was then dumped right out the side. That method can get costly as these big passive heatsinks can be very pricey. Underclocking the CPU helps.

I'd recommend QuietPC for such things. Incidentally, Noctua fans are THE quietest fans I've ever used, and come with a world of fittings and speed adaptors. I've got a 12Cm fan in my PC which is effectively silent!

[Caspar]

I use a Dell Inspiron laptop (dual core 2GHz with 4GB RAM and 140GB hard disk) running Win2003 server SP2. Hosting the windows domain, DNS, DHCP, with 5 virtual servers on the same laptop giving me a backup DC (+RRAS), IIS7, MS Exchange 2007 SP1, Exchange 2007 SP1 Edge server (non-domain) and a MS SQL 2005 server (+WSUS). No laptop battery installed, with a 20minute UPS installed.

This hosts my personal websites and my family Exchange accounts, accessible by our iPhones.

I originally had this over 2 computers, but thought I'd experiment by squeezing it onto the one laptop.

Main reason to swap to laptop was engery efficiency - my 3.2Ghz PentiumD computer runs at around 150Watts, costing about 55pence per 24hours of continual running, with optmisations (such as Windows power options and not running intensive services such as Windows search, nightly anti-virus scanning and Diskeeper).
My laptop runs the same servers, but only using about 40Watts of power, which is about 10pence a day.

Been running quite a while like this with no problems.

[Hom3r]

Wouldn't you get a better value for money with a desktop over a laptop.

[Caspar]

Originally Posted by Hom3r

Wouldn't you get a better value for money with a desktop over a laptop.

Value for money? on what basis/application?

Laptops can come with equal hardware grunt, CPU etc.. but over a 3year life you'd see a return on that investment through cost savings, such as electricity.

It really depends on what your application is, using a laptop at the heart of a server infrastructure is humours but it can work and it does for me for my personal projects...but def not within a corporate arena - but that application is v. different. Namely budgets and users.

It isn't this what we love about IT - how a single problem has many solutions?

[KingDaveRa]

Plus corporate environments generally have dedicated areas for servers, so they can sit there with their screaming banshee fans.

Servers are noisy! Bloody noisy.

[dragon]

I use a GX240 for the home server stuff paid £20 delivered on ebay... although i don't run my home machine 24/7 and have it set to go into Standby

If it's not already been suggested perhaps you could try linitx.com they sell fanless mini-itx boards and the such like.

Some of the embedded platforms aren't bad however it depends on your needs they may not have the grunt to run demanding webapps.

Sorry i'm fairly tired so probably missed half the thread.

[funkyCable]

Just an update I went to my local ASDA and I saw an empty netbook box I asked the kind lady at the counter and she said they had two left. The first one she bought out looked like it was returned item so she fetched the other one. So I paid £150 and when I got home and booted it up I was pleased to see that it was the 160gig version that DeathTrap mentioned I checked the box and it said 120gig but the systems reporting 160gig so no complaints. try to find the terminal now.

[flamingeck]

Originally Posted by funkyCable

Just an update I went to my local ASDA and I saw an empty netbook box I asked the kind lady at the counter and she said they had two left. The first one she bought out looked like it was returned item so she fetched the other one. So I paid £150 and when I got home and booted it up I was pleased to see that it was the 160gig version that DeathTrap mentioned I checked the box and it said 120gig but the systems reporting 160gig so no complaints. try to find the terminal now.

Why on earth have you bothered to spend £150 on a home server to feed a few photos and php content when you could have done all of that from any cheap hosting company for a fraction of the cost and danger.

£150 you could have 10 years worth of proper server than a bloody craptop.

[Caspar]

Originally Posted by flamingeck

Why on earth have you bothered to spend £150 on a home server to feed a few photos and php content when you could have done all of that from any cheap hosting company for a fraction of the cost and danger.

£150 you could have 10 years worth of proper server than a bloody craptop.

If all he bought the laptop for was to host the server, then i agree with flamingeck. Hosting is cheap, go that route to host pics, and simple apps.

However if you want more demanding services then a home server environment is the way to go!.... many 100'GB data store, Exchange for email, MS SQL database, etc...

[Stuart]

Originally Posted by Caspar

If all he bought the laptop for was to host the server, then i agree with flamingeck. Hosting is cheap, go that route to host pics, and simple apps.

However if you want more demanding services then a home server environment is the way to go!.... many 100'GB data store, Exchange for email, MS SQL database, etc...

Plus there is the satisfaction of seeing it all work once you set it up yourself, and you have the freedom to design the site how you want, using whatever scripts you want rather than the ones the hosting company see fit to provide.