Scores die in Israeli air strikes - Page 42

Dai · 18-01-2009, 20:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by foreverwar

And this is why the ceasefire will fail - instead of looking ahead, emotive negative language will be used by both sides, raising tempers and leading to a breakdown in communications.

This thread in a way has become a metaphor for what is happening out there. It's frightening how quickly a terrible issue like this divides people into opposing camps and how reluctant they are to consider the validity of their stances.

It's been quite an education.

frogstamper · 18-01-2009, 20:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by foreverwar

And this is why the ceasefire will fail - instead of looking ahead, emotive negative language will be used by both sides, raising tempers and leading to a breakdown in communications.

S_l_m, I understand you feel strongly about this, but all posts like that do is lead to posters making negative comments about Hamas, which then escalates into a ever-worsening spiral, and once again, everybody loses (imho).

Well said foreverwar, I couldn't have put it better. Its tantamount to a married couple having an argument and one or the other just can't stop themselves from having the last word, continue down that route and once again everybody loses...again.

SMG · 18-01-2009, 20:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by foreverwar

And this is why the ceasefire will fail - instead of looking ahead, emotive negative language will be used by both sides, raising tempers and leading to a breakdown in communications.

S_l_m, I understand you feel strongly about this, but all posts like that do is lead to posters making negative comments about Hamas, which then escalates into a ever-worsening spiral, and once again, everybody loses (imho).

Very well said indeed. Too much flag waving & not enough talking.

Osem · 18-01-2009, 20:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaiNasty

This thread in a way has become a metaphor for what is happening out there. It's frightening how quickly a terrible issue like this divides people into opposing camps and how reluctant they are to consider the validity of their stances.

It's been quite an education.

Given the subject matter, I think most contributors to this thread have been remarkably restrained. No warnings, no infractions - if only the world was like this.

soicky · 18-01-2009, 21:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by frogstamper

Well said foreverwar, I couldn't have put it better. Its tantamount to a married couple having an argument and one or the other just can't stop themselves from having the last word, continue down that route and once again everybody loses...again.

Let's not forget that were not going to make much difference discussing peace negotiations. People come to give their opinions and views on matters and tbh they can say whatever they feel, within the rules ofcourse.

icestar2 · 18-01-2009, 21:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by foreverwar

And this is why the ceasefire will fail - instead of looking ahead, emotive negative language will be used by both sides, raising tempers and leading to a breakdown in communications.

S_l_m, I understand you feel strongly about this, but all posts like that do is lead to posters making negative comments about Hamas, which then escalates into a ever-worsening spiral, and once again, everybody loses (imho).

Was thinking exaclty the same Foreverwar. Very well put post

On The subject at hand I would love to hear of a ceasefire holding or of talks taking place but I cant say I hold out much hope of seeing this actually happen.

**Maggy** · 18-01-2009, 22:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by frogstamper

Well said foreverwar, I couldn't have put it better. Its tantamount to a married couple having an argument and one or the other just can't stop themselves from having the last word, continue down that route and once again everybody loses...again.

Well in that scenario the couple either get a divorce,live with the situation or murder occurs.

I just wish divorce was a possibility here.

Saaf_laandon_mo · 18-01-2009, 22:37

When i say words like brutal aggression, destruction and carnage, i'm not making things up or being negative. If the world sees this for its reality then hopefully people will see whats happened and prevent it from happening again.
.yes, there is a ceasefire, and i hope it lasts, but i do not feel that the israelis should be allowed to get away with what they've done by covering it up from the eyes of the world.

**Maggy** · 18-01-2009, 22:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Saaf_laandon_mo

When i say words like brutal aggression, destruction and carnage, i'm not making things up or being negative. If the world sees this for its reality then hopefully people will see whats happened and prevent it from happening again.
.yes, there is a ceasefire, and i hope it lasts, but i do not feel that the israelis should be allowed to get away with what they've done by covering it up from the eyes of the world.

Neither should Hamas be let off the hook either.They are not angels and my sympathies do not lie with them.

My sympathies are for the ordinary Palestinians who just want all the fighting to stop...as it is for the ordinary Israelis who also want the fighting to stop.

The bloody fighting hawks on both sides can go to hell for all I care.

frogstamper · 19-01-2009, 02:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Maggy J

Neither should Hamas be let off the hook either.They are not angels and my sympathies do not lie with them.

My sympathies are for the ordinary Palestinians who just want all the fighting to stop...as it is for the ordinary Israelis who also want the fighting to stop.

The bloody fighting hawks on both sides can go to hell for all I care.

Well said Maggy, if only we could get shot of the hotheads on both sides the ordinary Israeli and Palestinian might stand a chance.

icestar2 · 19-01-2009, 03:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by frogstamper

Well said Maggy, if only we could get shot of the hotheads on both sides the ordinary Israeli and Palestinian might stand a chance.

Agreed but I think this is a more of a deep rooted problem. Getting rid of the hot heads is one way however there could be many more than we think and normally I would expect that more will just spring up in their place.

I believe that both side's preconceived ideas of each other have to be changed. How this would be done I dont know but until they stop thinking of eachother as the Enemy or pure evil then war's like this will continue until there's no-one left to fight them.

Osem · 19-01-2009, 09:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Saaf_laandon_mo

When i say words like brutal aggression, destruction and carnage, i'm not making things up or being negative. If the world sees this for its reality then hopefully people will see whats happened and prevent it from happening again.
.yes, there is a ceasefire, and i hope it lasts, but i do not feel that the israelis should be allowed to get away with what they've done by covering it up from the eyes of the world.

Agree but history has shown that's exactly what'll happen sadly. The fact that Isreal has once again proved she can and will act in this manner irrespective of world opinion (aside from their bankers and buddies in the US of course) doesn't bode well for the Palestinians.

ntluser · 19-01-2009, 14:12

I think it's a case of wait and see and hope for the best.

Every day without fighting is a bonus.

Any plan formulated by the Palestinians and Israel would have to contain safeguards which protect both sides and prevent the situation lapsing back into war.

It's likely that any plan is best implemented gradually by degrees over a period of time using mutually agreed milestones which enable the two sides to build up some trust as the situation demands it.

UN monitors are likely to be present for some time to ensure that both sides are keeping to what they agreed.

Given the amount of ill-feeling between the two groups, the lack of trust and the fact that the issue has been going on since 1947, I would expect such a implementation to take 10 to 20 years as there is no quick fix to this problem.The quality of life would improve by every successfully completed milestone.

Hopefully, any child born at the start of the implementation of the agreed plan will live through many happy years of peace.

BBKing · 19-01-2009, 15:14

Quote:

The fact that Isreal has once again proved she can and will act in this manner irrespective of world opinion

...and lose. Hamas aren't Hezbollah, who are a decent fighting force with some good brains, so it's another blow to the idea that you can and should keep these backward tribes in place with air-power and artillery. Since it's the fourth time that's happened in five years, perhaps the people who think this is a good idea will re-examine it, but I'm not hopeful.

SMG · 19-01-2009, 17:02

When you look at the people in the Gaza area, & the homes where they live, they have very little more than any 3rd world country. There is no gain for anyone who wants the place. No industry, fertile land, resources, nothing. It not even strategically important. With the exception of getting hurt from idiots firing rockets, Israel has no real use for the place.

BBKing, There are no winners, or losers. If you imply Hamas, are a decent fighting force, then that beggars belief. What they are, is a group of cowards, who fight behind women & children, who are too frightened to fight other soldiers, in an open conflict.

When this conflict started, Hamas publicly announced that there would be a bloodbath. Just like Saddam & all the other wannabe`s, all gob & no fight.

13 Soldiers, a bloodbath?

They were right about the bloodbath of course, the blood of civilians is on their hands, & for what, a strip of barren land.